On to Paint!

Discussion in 'Materials' started by CatBuilder, May 11, 2012.

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  1. pauloman
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: New Hampshire

    pauloman Epoxy Vendor

    no such thing as UV resistant epoxy. You cannot add UV blockers or absorbers to thermo set resins systems.

    And most clear coat products have little or no UV protection built into them. Auto clear coat is an exception. Original spar varnish is too.

    when I had a clear lpu product reformulated about 8 years ago for max UV protection, it added $8 a gallon to the raw material costs. That's OK for me, but pushes the clear stuff you buy at the hardware store out of the marketplace.

    Mot sure what mydauphin is talking about above. Solvent free epoxies don't outgas until 'cooked' with high heat. If you topcoat epoxy before the 1 week cure time you get a bit of chemical bondings as well as standard mechanical bonding as the new coating solvents bite into the not yet fully cured epoxy.

    this is called the recoat window and is a golden rule in industrial epoxy / painting circles.

    one option is epoxy, solvent pigmented primer for neutral base - fairing surface etc, standard enamel, 2 part lpu clear coat....

    paul oman
    progressive epoxy polymers inc.
     
  2. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    I just stumbled upon a great crew currently doing work near my location. They can fair and spray. They are currently fairing and spraying a boat nearby and I'll check their work out when they are done. They just did 1/4 of a 70ft motoryacht in ONE DAY! (fairing only) They are STILL working at 7PM! They plan to run overnights and stuff to get the paint on fast eliminating sanding.

    Perfect crew!

    They were talking about using AwlQuick.

    What is the consensus on that product? Is it too soft? They are currently using AwlFair on the large motoryacht because that's what the guy owning the yacht already bought.
     
  3. idkfa
    Joined: Sep 2005
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    idkfa Senior Member

    Interesting
     

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  4. mastcolin
    Joined: Jun 2005
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    mastcolin Senior Member

    They sound interesting for you. Speak to them for sure.

    Awlquick? Don't know of many people who use this to be honest. It is a sorta "jack of all trades, master of none" products. I don't doubt that it has its benefits in certain situations. The best system is HighBuild followed by 545. You get the best build, best filler sealer and the best undercoat for the topcoat. I think it is expensive for the film thickness you get (not the wet gallon price, the dry on your boat price). HighBuild in europe is relatively cheaper.

    But to be honest if they want to use it, let them. As I said previous, painter likes to think they know best and if you tell them to use something they don't prefer they will charge you more and they will have excuse if something goes wrong ie you will get blame/extra cost.

    ps 1/4 70footer in a day?! hahaha. I'd sack my guys for going so slow:) My record is 400l filler in one day. Both sides of 48m steel hull. 14 guys. Something like 1200l in a week. Don't judge them day by day to be honest. Judge them when they are finished key stages ie filled, primed, topcoated. Your boat? 10hour a square metre from bare laminate to in the water. +/- depending on your final topcoat desire. You're limited by overcoating times. You can only apply 1 coat filler a day on big areas etc. More guys wouldn't make it any faster timewise. Pace is often determined by the inside work as much as exterior. I work on superyachts bigger than 50m. We take 9months or so but there is no point going faster as interior fit out takes this long. Theoretically we could finish a boat in about 6weeks if we worked with 100guys or so. But there is no point. What we going to do between projects?
     
  5. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    Thanks for that post, Colin. I'm glad you offered your knowledge regarding time and the Awlquick product. They are using Awlfair on the 70 footer, but said they prefer Awlquick because it sands faster. They said it is softer, but faster to get done. Not sure if that is what I'm looking for...

    There are only 3 guys who got 1/4 of the 21.3 meter (70 ft) boat fairer today. I though it seemed like a reasonable speed. Better than me and my guy! :)

    The interior of the boat will be fit out 1000 miles away from here, so no worries about that timing. Speed into the water is the idea. I have all the time in the world for the I
    Interior fit out later. Extenuating circumstances require this approach.
     
  6. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
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    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    I re-did the deck bow on a boat, the usual treatment, fiberglass resin, then epoxy. Waited two days and sanded. I then paint with Poly paint interlux, it looked great for a few days. After week the paint crinkled up in some areas. Interlux said I should have waited longer to paint on epoxy. The area did get very hot. perhaps that had something to do with it.
     
  7. FishStretcher
    Joined: Oct 2011
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    FishStretcher Junior Member

    I used PPG epoxy (DP401?), K38 filler and Dupont ChromaOne urethane with HVLP with great results. Incredibly durable, although allegedly not as tough as the Imron, we sprayed on the trucks at Freightliner. But better looking. Scotch brite pads would hardly touch it. I can't imagine how ward Imron is. This was on a race car, not a boat, so water immersion wasn't an issue, but durability was.

    I did get very sick from inadequate protection while spraying the urethane. I had a mask, but not a fresh air system. The mask loaded up and I got more isocyanate than I bargained for. I almost went to the hospital, the tremors were so bad.
     
  8. Herman
    Joined: Oct 2004
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    Herman Senior Member

    Back to basics: How is the status on the CatBuilder project? Faired and painted?
     
  9. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    Dunno. I called but he never returned my call.
     
  10. Ad Hoc
    Joined: Oct 2008
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

  11. hoytedow
    Joined: Sep 2009
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    Too bad.
     
  12. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    He'd ask questions..then often when he didn't get the answer he wanted or someone offered an alternative-he'd get huffy.
    If you may not like the answer,why ask in the first place?

    And he acted as if he knew my area and waters better than I did-though he's never been here and I've been boating here all my (35 years) life.

    He got tons of free advice from people wanting to help out..and honestly with his attitude-don't let the door hit your a$$ on the way out.

    If I was building a boat and got so much free advice,I'd be sending out cheques to people and/or inviting them for a week-end out fishing.
     
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  13. Herman
    Joined: Oct 2004
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    Herman Senior Member

    Ah, I see. Too bad, I liked following his project.

    I gave him a fair bit of advice, but indeed he usually choose another direction. Right or wrong? I do not know. There are many ways to build a boat. It is partly a personal thing, partly common sense, and partly materials available. (and partly other things)

    Getting advise on a forum will give you so many opinions, you will need to decide which one works for you. If you just stick to a designer or consultant, you get the "thruth" in a simple package. (Kellsal for example). This can be reassuring. Especially if you are a bit insecure. And I felt Catbuilder was a bit insecure. (for a good reason, after creating a couple of large and expensive useless slabs of plywood)
     
  14. Charly
    Joined: Dec 2009
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    Charly Senior Member

    I figure he'll be back. He's gone off before.

    He's smart enough to know that he is incredibly fortunate to have such a rich resource available, and I believe that he does feel some responsibility (and gratification) in passing along the things he has learned.
     

  15. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
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    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    So catbuilder what did you finally decide on, the world wants to know?
     
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