Who has experience with a desulfator for deep discharging lead acid batteries

Discussion in 'OnBoard Electronics & Controls' started by BertKu, Jan 26, 2019.

  1. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member


    DIY 12 Voltage Lead Acid Battery Desulfator SLA AGM
    for a few dollars and free shipping.

    I bought 7 years ago 16 deep charging lead sealed lead acid batteries for my electric boat I had built. Of those 16 batteries I kept 4 batteries as spare and top them up at regular intervals to keep them charged and compensate for the leakage current. The spare batteries are fine, but I wonder who has experience in desulfing a sealed deep charging lead acid batteries.
    a) Will a 2 ampere unit desulfate a 24 Amphour battery? No or yes, but it takes longer.
    b) one has to buy a unit which matches the 24 Ampere.
    Many thanks for you thoughts
    Bert
     
  2. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    I did some searching on the Internet and this is what I found.
    [​IMG]

    But they dont say what Ah the batteries are 6Ah, 9Ah, 60Ah? Also the article is not saying anything on the way older batteries can be re-conditioned.

    PowerPulse® from PulseTech® (USA)
    PowerPulse® from PulseTech® (USA)
    Battery Maintenance System
    Uses Patented Pulse Technology
    Works on all types of lead-acid batteries
    Extends battery life up to 5 times.
    Available in 12-Volt, 24-Volt, 36-Volt and 48-Volt
    Used extensively by consumers and the U.S. Military worldwide for almost ten years
    Scientifically proven by two major U.S. universities to make batteries last longer
    Top 50 product by Automotive Engineering Magazine (U.S.)
    5 Years Limited Warranty

    Bert. Who can help?
     
  3. JamesG123
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    JamesG123 Senior Member

    This guy has an interesting and amusing video on the subject:



    Beware, he's an obscenely un-PC funny Cannuck.
     
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  4. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    Hi James, that was hilarious.

    But unfortunately I am after a real proven system in improving a battery. My problem is only to get answers on questions I have and I have not been able to find them. Except for one, it also works on deep discharging slabs. But what I still miss it the answer on whether a 2 Ampere device works on a 24Ah battery of which I have been drawing only between 5 and 10 Ampere. I miss the time table what it takes to do a 24 Ah battery with a 2 Ampere unit. I have red very positive and good reviews, but can't find a time curve. A time curve which tells me a 24Ah battery, which is at its end of it lifetime, need by 2 Ampere XYZ hours to recover, or with a 10 Ampere unit ZKZ hours. I have ordered a 2 Ampere unit over the Internet and it if it works on an old 12Volt/9Ah battery, I certainly will make a 10 or 20 Ampere unit or buy one.
    I personally think that many sailors could benefit from such unit.
    Bert
     
  5. JamesG123
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    JamesG123 Senior Member

    The charge rate is immaterial. What you are doing is coaxing the ions to go back to where they came from. 2Ah will just take longer to charge/recondition a higher capacity battery. From what I have read, experienced, the lower the power, the better because you are not "boiling" the plates so more of it goes back to lead instead of sloughed off as sulfates. As long as the incoming charge has enough voltage to overcome the resistance of the electrolyte and the contamination, it doesn't matter if its even milli-amps. That is why "trickle chargers" work.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
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  6. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    Thank you so much James,
    That answer all my questions. I made about 50 trickle chargers for timing equipment I made for the Horsy people. My daughter was a top rider and I was sick and tired to hold her horse all the time, thus I decided to make wireless Timing equipment 20 years ago and was successful in exporting them. I will thus use one parallel with the desulfating unit I bought and measure and control the current flow. Thank you for helping me out. Bert
     
  7. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    I found an interesting write up with the frequencies required etc. https://cdn.hackaday.io/files/257411101302944/batt desulfator.pdf It explains it quite well. We all have experienced a bad battery at always the wrong timing. To experiment with a desulfator can only help. I cannot see that a small 2 Ampere unit can damage a battery like James has explained in a previous thread. My batteries are costing a fortune and if I can extend the life by 5 year longer, that is only a bonus. Bert
     
  8. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    To start with, you need to understand the difference between AGM and flooded cell batteries. The AGM have a fiberglass separator between the plates, which only gets about 85% saturated with acid. The rest is air. The chemical reactions are somewhat similar, but there are marked differences. For example, in an AGM, the hydrogen and oxygen re-combines into water. This process is the reason they don't need to be "topped up" on a regular basis. Also, AGM batteries are valve-regulated lead-acid battery (VRLA). That means that they are not directly vented to the atmosphere but have a one way relief valve that opens at about 2.5 PSI. The AGM batteries also have some intermediate chemical reactions that don't exist on the flooded cell type. The compression ratio of the separator has a very large influence on the capacity of the battery. Since the boxes are made of a polymer that deforms with age due to creep, the capacity of the battery will decrease as time passes. In short, how did you determine that the decreased capacity is due to sulfation. That phenomenon is caused by the lead sulfate crystals growing too large, and becoming basically insoluble.
     
  9. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    Hi Gonzo, I see you are still around. Thank you for your response, I am aware about the differences, but go on reviews from manufacturers and some other forums members I have checked. They all say that it works on all batteries included deep charging sealed lead acid batteries or AGM. However I am still searching to find people who has experience with this marvelous product, to gain and get the knowledge, in how to verify that it is working, to hear how one can check the progress, consequence of "over charging" etc. We all know that the oscillation process is between 1 and 8 Mhz , One need a scope which can see the up to 10 Mhz, my scope is old and has some technical issues, thus only frequencies up to 1 Mhz. Thanks Gonzo, Bert
     
  10. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    I forgot to answer you. A battery consist of 2.1 - 2.2 Volt cells. 6 x 2.2 = 13.2 Volt.
    5 x 2.2 = 11 Volt. Because the voltage drops from 13 Volt rapidly to 11.3 Volt and then stays there, one can assume that 1 cell has a problem. I gamble that with a 2 Ampere desulfator unit, I may recover that cell and bring the battery back to normal. What is your guess. Bert
     
  11. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Let us know what happens. I have only to learn and zero to offer.
     
  12. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    If one cell is going to zero, it may be internally shorted. Dendrite formation, even though less severe in AGMs, is one of the most common causes of short circuits. Basically, the chemical reaction is more active where the plates are closer. At that point, a lead dendrite starts forming (from more deposition) which eventually connects the plates.
     
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  13. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    Hi Gonzo, that may very well be true in other AGM batteries, but I am able to charge the battery with trickle charging to 13.4 Volt, which mean to me that I do not have one short cell, but a cell which fast is not able to hold charge. I am still gambling the this desulfator unit will help to solve at least somehow. Bert
     
  14. BertKu
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    BertKu Senior Member

    unfortunately, I just received the shipping detail. I just have to have patience : Estimated delivery Sunday, Feb 17, 2019 - Thursday, Mar 14, 2019
    Bert
     

  15. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Ouch!
     
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