When NOT to use full length battens?

How can the boom move up and down if the Topper is set and the (non-rigid) vang is set up to counter the Topper?

Topper keeps the boom from moving down. Vang keeps the boom from moving up.

 

You asked about the topping lift

 

No, it doesn't need to be on the centre line but it's easier if it's luffing to reduce the drag on the bolt rope.

The rigid vang is physically constrained to it can't lift the boom beyond the optimum furling position. This is the setting where the sail rolls without gravitating to one end of the boom or the other as you roll it down.

The reef positions are best when there is a ful length batten 300mm or so above the boom.

The only downside of the system is that you can't ease the clew off in light airs.

They sold about 2500 units in Europe but I think the full batten / lazy jack / stack pack set up has eaten into their market more recently. But our Sailtainer is 20 years old and has been faultless.

 

Thanks. I am assuming the added mast track is rigidly held on CL. I'm guessing there is a pretty nice pre-feeder?

When reefing, what holds the new "outhaul" tension? Is it simply the tension on the rolled sail?

 

Yes the added mast track is both rigid and on the centre line, but the gooseneck has also been brought aft to coincide exactly.

Yes the reefed 'out haul' is partly the quality of the roll (which is very good) and the sail tension imposed by the compression in the full length batten.

 

Not exactly.

You stated the TL was not as good as a rigid vang. When asked why you said in your experience the boom supported by a TL moves up and down and caused the sail to have wrinkles.

So why didn't you simply use the vang to stop this problem? Seems like a pretty logical thing to do.


So what you are saying is, the rigid vang functions better for people who can't figure out how to use a normal vang to keep a boom from rising.

 

Paul B: you are starting to hijack another thread to start a fight.

 

OK, so at any angle the feeding sail is (reasonably) under the track?

When furling, does the bolt rope lay on top of itself, or is there a mechanism that offsets the roll in some increment? I am thinking if the luff all rolls on itself that would be a big bulk compared to the rest of the furled sail.

 

I guess i didnt state that i am doing a simple boom that rolls the sail around it just like the Corsair Trimarans use and have been for years,so i will,of course use a topping lift and end of boom sheeting,by using a through the mast shaft to rotate the boom to keep the tack close to the mast so i dont need to set the track back.I have in the past installed a profurl in boom system on a customers boat but to be honest,i see no advantage over the Corsair system which is just the old fashioned system from way back but the full battens make it work.The in boom systems to me remind me of a saying we had 35+years ago when i first got into boatbuilding which went something like "an elephant is a mouse built to marine department specifications" in other words an extremly complex(expensive)way of doing a simple job.There may be some validity on really large boats but overkill on boats under 40ft or so imho.
Steve.

 

I made a bunch of sails for the sailtainer system a number of years ago while working at another loft. They worked well. IIRC, the tack angle was pretty critical... something like 87 degrees, plus or minus a half degree or so. As I recall, the bolt rope offset just a bit each roll, kind of like a cable on a large winch does. My memory may be faulty, though.

Question about the tack angle: It seems like no problem on a mast with normal rake, but on a boat that carries a lot of rake it would seem that the boom would droop if the proper tack angle is to be maintained?

 

I've sailed Corsairs a bit, and made a few mains for them. That system works fine. Only problem I can see with using it on a Lindenburg 26 is not having the boom vang fitting accessible while reefed. Perhaps something can be rigged up with one of the oldfashioned boom claws. I guess the vang isn't an issue with Corsairs b/c they seldom ease the main much past the end of the traveller... but I don't recall ever having reefed on a Corsair. One slight problem with the Corsair that won't be a problem on the Lindenburg - the top couple of battens on the Corsair flat top main have to be removed to roll the last few feet... I assume the Lindenburg sail will have a normal monohull type roach.

 

That's what I was getting at. It seems the offsetting would make for a better roll, but with no mechanism to force it does it do it naturally?

Back in the old days the in-mast furling systems could really have issues if the foot wasn't cut correctly and too much sail rolled onto itself. I suspect the same can be true for in-boom systems.

 

Are you having a tapered boom to take the extra fabric in the center of the sail?

 

Yes, that's why the tack angle was critical. If too close to 90 degrees, the sail would bunch up at the front. If the angle was too close to 85 degrees, then the luff would start creeping too far aft on the roll which created problems where the bolt rope exited the mast groove. When the tack angle was at the specified angle the system worked very well.
With the in mast furlers, the issue wasn't that the sail wouldn't roll up; it was that the sail would get too bulky and start rubbing against the interior of the mast. Even with a slightly raised clew, care must be taken not to make the head and tack patches too bulky or use too heavy a cloth.

 

Mast furlers scare me! I was always impressed with the Hood boom system, from memory it had a padded leech and the wedge in the track to accommodate what I assume was a flatter cut main for rolling. It seemed to me to be an excellent cross between ease of use and performance.