What would you like to see on a 40 ft day cruiser?

Oh and by the way fellow forumites by all means have your boat built overseas for slave labor, save a buck and stimulate the economy!

 

Not every place "overseas" can be brought in conjunction with slave labour I assume.
And we should bear in mind that the customer is forcing the producer to lower price.The average manufacturer (mid tier), is not very happy to move production abroad to survive.

Regards
Richard

 

now thats an issue to sink ones teeth into

round here we have something called the Davis Bacon act
its a law that ensures that the gov pays prevailing union wage
kinda keeps em honest or as honest as you can ever expect the gov to be
now if that were a worldwide concept you would get your share of people freaking out over a one world gov
but
since what the present system is doing is take a shipwright, say in Germany who is respected for his quality and environmental standards and forces him to compete with say a man with few skills and working in horrible conditions and in complete disregard for the environment in some underdeveloped nation
who by the way is dying for the work

the present worldwide system draws down the wages to the lowest common denominator

the present national system mandated by the Davis Bacon act does the opposite

so a posible solution to this problem might be to implement a minimum world wage at say the average of the developed worlds prevailing union wage

that would effectively keep industry on its home turf and make it less viable to incur the huge shipping costs of doing biz in bf Egypt

my two cents
B

 

It is nearly impossible to impose any labor union agreements on a worldwide scale.

But I believe that the globalization will ideally ultimately lead towards an near-equalization of wages on the worldwide scale, though it will be a painful process principally for developed countries.
We will have to accept a general decline in our standard of living, while chinese, korean, morrocan etc. people will see their on the rise.
That's because there is a constant drift of money barycentre from our world towards their, due to western industries re-allocating their production units.
It's like opening a dam which separates two water masses at different levels. The process will continue until some sort of near-equilibrium is reached.

So I believe that this natural evolution of the current global economic system will ultimately lead towards the goal you have wished for.

 

Really valuable statements! thanks.

 

Thank you for this valuable input.

It is hard to understand for the average labourer, that he gave a lifetime of knowledge, sweat and power, to encounter the fact, that he enabled his company to move abroad, destroying his job. But fact is that he asks for the cheapest product himself, he is moving his home industry himself.
Where is the chance for, say Mercedes to compete with a Turkish Bus manufacturer? They went to Turkey (20 years ago) and produce there. That enabled them to keep the German labourer healthy and busy.
So are we to blame, producing in the third world (to very high salaries in these countries)? We still keep our home industry healthy by installing their (high tech) products.
but
I fear the customer will ask for the cheaper Indian engines and electronics after some years. If our industry is not prepared for that, the carousel will keep on turning.
Just my 0,02€
Regards
Richard

 

then one is forced to accept the present economic difficulties as a result not of only banking error but as a failure to account for this shift in the working class and a lowering of his sallery ( cant spell that one to save my life )
given that the poor slob got screwed on the mortgage deal and then hosed on his wages while at the same time watching many skilled and well paying jobs sail overseas how do you then expect anything less than the system falling apart when that failure is inevitable in the redistribution system you guys are advocating
I am always a fan of a macro economy that favors local biz over industries that ship long distances
ever consider that when you buy say an apple from the large grocery store
although that apple may have been grown just outside of town it probably got shipped to a sorting plant in another state then a holding vasility in another state and then shipped back to be sold posibly only a few miles from were it was grown and yet traveled in some cased literally around the world
its insane the way we ignore the transportation costs of goods that can and should be produced locally but arent because some fool pushing a pencil all day decided he could make a few extra bucks if he only sacrifices the local balanced economies of hole nations and replaces them with consumer driven ones

sorry guys I know Im about to take a few shots on this one
but if we want to get back to some form of stability in the world economy we are going to have to be reasonable about this hole globalization thing
in case no one was paying attention its not working
rather than bring that wages of the third world up to that of the developed world
it has created a bidding war among the poorer countries to see who will accept the lowest wages
it has driven pollution to ridiculous levels
and done little overall but concentrate the wealth

my two cents is we need to return to a more sensible approach
and keep our imports to what it actually makes sense to import
and our shipping to a minimum
this will save oil
save pollution
and create more jobs with less impact
it is also a proven winner in countries that had little choice but to try it
say in Costa Rica or Ecuador were local economies learned to thrive on tourist and renewable forest products and maintain there indigenous and cultural heritage by NOT allowing the big multinationals in

oh well
that should be enough ammunition for you guys to start shooting

have at it but the proofs in the pudding
**** the way you describe it didn't work out

cheers
B

 

oh
outa respect for whoever started this thread since we got so far off subject we should move this over to a more appropriate thread
say
politics lies and witchcraft
were it belongs
and continue with our 40 footer design

 

<<<< then one is forced to accept the present economic difficulties as a result not of only banking error but as a failure to account for this shift in the working class and a lowering of his sallery ( cant spell that one to save my life )
given that the poor slob got screwed on the mortgage deal and then hosed on his wages while at the same time watching many skilled and well paying jobs sail overseas how do you then expect anything less than the system falling apart when that failure is inevitable in the redistribution system you guys are advocating
I am always a fan of a macro economy that favors local biz over industries that ship long distances
ever consider that when you buy say an apple from the large grocery store
although that apple may have been grown just outside of town it probably got shipped to a sorting plant in another state then a holding vasility in another state and then shipped back to be sold posibly only a few miles from were it was grown and yet traveled in some cased literally around the world
its insane the way we ignore the transportation costs of goods that can and should be produced locally but arent because some fool pushing a pencil all day decided he could make a few extra bucks if he only sacrifices the local balanced economies of hole nations and replaces them with consumer driven ones>>>>>

Hoorah! Some great posts by all!

The world has always been a pretty absurd circus but lately it really puts earlier levels of ridiculous to shame...

I think that the mathematics of the underlying resource and energy economics are coming to the big crunch right now. It is so masked by the extraordinary pyramid we've erected on it though that it is not so obvious so we get lost in credit lingo land, missing the fundamentals. There going to be some serious changes alright and it's not going to be directed by the presidential reality tv show.

The baltic dry index has tumbled 96% in just a few months and that means no more big ships are being bought or made. In fact they're decommissioning all over the place , as in turning in for scrap.

It won't be long till the apple won't do the ridiculous "round the world to get in a supermarket near you" thing anymore.

 

Boston that was a statement of value and I´m not going to shoot against it.
The world goes mad, but she is´nt driven by greedy bosses or "shareholder value" (the ugliest and most cynical verb imaginable) only. The consumer expects strawberries all year round, or at least accepts that the industry provides such idiotic offers, by paying high amounts for senseless products. Who is going to blame the distributor for making a fortune of that?
I am not advocating the system! I just accept being part of it. When it comes to wages and reasonable subsistence I was always ahead of my competitors and always have won at the end, with a better result.

And I agree that we hijacked this thread, although it is in direct connection to the original question.

Regards
Richard

 

Here's a thought-Everyone who is going to buy a new vehicle this year, buy one made by their own company(ies) in their own country. That way, both the wages and the profits stay home. Second choice would be a vehicle made at home by a foreign company. People who live where they don't make vehicles do as they please.

 

Nothing like that will ever work, imho. The world has taken it's direction and only some huge, insurmountable crisis might change it. Maybe if we run seriously out of fossil fuels and have to renounce having bananas delivered from Honduras in mid january, for example...

Just go to any mall in your city and see how many items you will find with "Made in U.S.A." label. Apart from some food and drinks, you have excellent probabilities not to find any.

We all have to start accepting and getting used to the fact that national borders are already starting to fade in this globalized world. The economy has broken the ice crust, the rest will follow. Everything goes where money goes.

That is not necessarily negative, it's an opportunity for everyone and the winners will be those who will know how to make the best use of it.

 

well as someone who day trades I can understand the sentiment completely because basically other than the political glitches in the graph, the a-typically extreme volatility in the market actually helps with predictability and that's what makes money
predictability

thursday I nailed it for a 1.78% gain early in the day
if I had been around for the afternoon drop to a traditional support level and then the expected rally Ild have made a killing
I came home and cried that Ild missed it

but

the manufacturing sector, the produce and commodities sector, and the energy sector, all need a radical rethink with a bend towards localization within the economy
this biz about unbridled world trade has gotten us into a bad patch and we need to show some moderation in the process
there are goods that will do well on a world stage
but there are others that are nonviable to the economic well being of the hole when considered on the world market
identifying those goods and limiting there percentage of imports based on a countries gdp of produced consumables is going to be key

other countries basically already follow this system
its just the us gov had its head up its *** for the last oh say thirty or forty years since we started this most favored trade status thing descending more recently right on down to nafta
Reorge Bush was just the last and biggest idiot to hurry the process along


basically allowing multinational industries to manipulate hole countries into purely consumer based trade cannot work to do anything but bankrupt those countries

the only civilization to ever survive on a purely consumer based economy was the Roman empire and it held a monopoly on one immensely profitable thing literally the energy industry of its day
the slave trade
all slaves sold in the Roman empire were to be originally sold in the Roman market
everything else including sand for the Arena was imported
at night
when no one was looking
course
Julius Caesar also invented the welfare system and the dole
but hey
all in all there system worked
or at least it did till lead pipes caught up with em
then they went nuts

oh
they might have been a little nicer to the neighbors
that didnt work out to well for em in the end either

Hanibal and Hasdrubal nearly finished em off early as well but still there culture and civilization thrived on only one commodity

its the only time any culture has survived any appreciable amount of time being purely consumer based

 

Ten points is all I can add to that.
Regards
Richard