We need a rescue boat.

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Commuter Boats, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Commuter Boats
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    Location: Southeast Alaska

    Commuter Boats Commuter Boats

    I work for a search and rescue group ( Sitka Mountain Rescue , http://cityofsitka.com/government/de...andRescue.html ) that responds to a wide variety of calls from technical mountain rescue to marine search and rescue and whale disentanglement.

    Our call volume on the water has been increasing and at present we rely on other agencies boats or the boats of our volunteers. As of a few months ago we were given the green light to purchase a dedicated search and rescue vessel but as yet have not been able to find a boat that we like. We would like to stay below 200,000 and safety / seaworthiness is of primary concern ( Our operating conditions include offshore in the Gulf of Alaska ), we would like to be able to handle 2 litters and / or 4 to 6 searchers plus crew.

    A 31 foot "Safe boat" ( the Coast Guard uses a lot of 25 and 27 foot "Safe boats") is over 300,000.

    If any builders might be interested please PM me, if any members are familiar with builders that have product that might be applicable I would appreciate any information.
    Thank you , Gerald
     
  2. Lt. Kludge
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    Lt. Kludge Junior Member

    There are a variety of boats that will work. Depends upon how and in what conditions you intend to employ it.

    IIRC the 25ft safeboat USCG RBS is about 200k in standard CG config. A CG Sar crew for that boat is 3 persons. And I think she is rated for about 12ft seas max and up to 25 nm from shore.

    The CG's 41UTB are approaching replacement dates. As a government agency you could possibly acquire one for little cost and spend the money on having it refurbished.

    Check what your partner agencies are using. If it works well for them in the same role and waters should do the same for you.
     
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  3. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    This sounds like a logical way to proceed.
     
  4. J Feenstra
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    J Feenstra Junior Member

    You might rethink the 31 foot requirement, cause a SAR vessel needs to be fast and seaworthy.
    I would suggest you stretch the ship to let’s say 40 foot? And what kind of boats are you using?
     
  5. FAST FRED
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    FAST FRED Senior Member

    I would try to find a MFG that does not build for "gov" contracts.

    The boat will cost 1/2 or 1/3 or less as so much cost is required for gov. paperwork.
     
  6. keysdisease
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    keysdisease Senior Member

    Attached Files:

  7. mydauphin
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    mydauphin Senior Member

    What is your budget?
     
  8. Stephen Ditmore
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    Stephen Ditmore Senior Member

    He said in the initial post: $200,000
    (It didn't jump out at me on first reading because he didn't put a dollar sign in front of it.)

    It looks to me like KeysDisease has found an excellent candidate! Now you'll just have to decide what kind of paint to use to get it presentable. My vote is Petit EasyPoxy with a clearcoat of Cyrstalac/CrabCoat UV BLOCKER (available from http://www.epoxyproducts.com/clear4u.html)
     
  9. mydauphin
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    mydauphin Senior Member

    I can get him something but got to figure how to get it to Alaska. I think there is a pilot boat similar to keydisease post that a friend is trying to sell. And it is painted.
     
  10. Commuter Boats
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    Location: Southeast Alaska

    Commuter Boats Commuter Boats

    Thank you to all who have considered my request for information, thank you submarine Tom who PM me a reference to a builder he works with, and thank you to the suggestions posted.

    In trying to keep my opening post short enough that people would read it, I didn't do a very good job of describing our area of response or the job the vessel will have to fulfill.
    We are a city department staffed by volunteers with a structure much like a volunteer fire department. The purchase will be a city procurement and scrutinized by an assembly of largely layman, a new boat purchase is cleaner but purchasing from another agency is not out of the question. Our operational funding is largely the interest from a banked grant and monies for this purchase will be pulled from that grant reducing our nest egg and the interest that we live on. We can and will pursue other funding sources but they are not guaranteed and staying in the $200,000 range would be an easier sell for us.
    We work anywhere in Southeast Alaska but our primary area of response is within the city and Borough of Sitka ( approximately 150 miles long and some 30 miles wide at the north end, I've included 3 attachments so you might better understand the conditions, the borough is highlighted in white on the 1st attachment ) and includes offshore work but the vessel's primary role will be transporting searchers, subjects and patients as we have next to no road system and all of our work relies on either boats or helicopters for transportation. The ability to work close to the beach and in kelp beds makes outboards attractive.
    Neither the 25 or the 27 safe boat will handle a litter ( a packaged patient) , a sister community ( Ketchikan 200 miles to the south ) has a 41 UTB that has proven to have a relatively high operating and upkeep costs but has otherwise been viable.
    In the search and rescue world I am a team leader, high angle technical rigor, and a boat operator....., to pay the bills I am a Marine fabrication and repair shop owner ( no, I cannot bid on this project, it would be a conflict of interest ), for some of our responses I borrow boats from my clients ( boats that I have designed and built like the one next to my name) we have a couple small inflatable's and a small aluminum skiff, the city has a 28 foot drop bow utility boat that I've pulled off many rescues in but it scares the hell out of me with the amount of well deck and the fact that all its buoyancy is below the deck. Our members have boats ranging from 16 feet to 30+ feet. We can lean on the Alaska State troopers and the Forest Service for transportation but the Forest Service only has utility boats and the troopers have a 35 foot Safe Boat but it won't handle a litter or even a search team in excess of 3 people.
    You have highlighted the hoped-for goal in this online search for something out of a box.
    "It didn't jump out at me on first reading because he didn't put a dollar sign in front of it".... Sorry, my literary skills suck, I'm not an english teacher but I'm married to one :rolleyes: . I was slow to pick up on the keys disease but I got it.
    Again, thank you for your help, Gerald
     

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  11. keysdisease
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    keysdisease Senior Member

    I know its cumbersome considering the politics of how you have to buy this vessel, but a 41UTB similar to the one I linked to with an $80,000 price and the cost of a couple of factory reman engines (installed) with a commercial paint job, is max boat for the buck. even if you throw in new steering, controls, some basic wiring, etc I think we're still within budget.

    I can't imagine operating costs being higher than an outboard powered vessel that meets your needs for payload, range and safety in your waters. A pair of V6 outboards will suck up the fuel, cost more than a couple of factory reman 6BT's, and need to be replaced several times within the lifespan of the Cummins units.

    As for upkeep, just strip out everything but the E stuff and what you need to operate, should be same same with anything else of same size, figuring we're talking AL here.

    Just thinking out loud here, you're is some real nice Country up there, I was lucky enough to spend a day in Sitka once, way cool.

    "Ketchikan 200 miles to the south has a 41 UTB that has proven to have a relatively high operating and upkeep costs but has otherwise been viable. "
     
  12. Stephen Ditmore
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    Stephen Ditmore Senior Member

    Would it be a conflict of interest for you to fix up an older boat like the one KeysDisease has found? It sounds like a good use of your skills to me.

    You could certainly look to a builder like http://www.mooseboats.com/ (this and several others are in your general area), but a new boat would be more expensive, and therefore smaller for a given budget. Perhaps if it were designed and outfitted with your specific requirements in mind a smaller boat would not be a terrible thing.

    It sounds like a jet drive might be advantageous if you can keep the kelp from gumming it up. One way to do this is to give it a marine gear with a reverse, but that's weight and expense that is usually eliminated by the fact that jet drives use a gate to give them reverse thrust.

    The image next to my name is a launch I did preliminary drawings & calculations for, including researching jet drives. One thing I found is that http://www.berkeleyjet.com/ and Legend Jets, now http://www.americanturbine.com/, are less expensive than the competition. At the time they basically made only one (pretty much identical) model, though, and it was optimized for fast boats and high RPM, with the maximum full load boat displacement being 5000 pounds for a single drive. Anyway, the price and limitations of different jet drive options might be something to consider, as well as their ability to operate in kelp. Certainly there are maneuverability advantages, and no exposed prop is a big safety advantage!

    A value oriented east coast builder you could check with is http://www.winninghoff.com.
     
  13. mydauphin
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    mydauphin Senior Member

    There is a boat similar to the one keydisease shows close to me, it has twin diesels, jets drives, and fire pump front and back. It is a commercial response vessel built like a tank. It can tow and fight fires or serve as a rescue vessel this is what it was designed to do at close to 40knots of speed. It has just one defect it is not good on fuel, but it has plenty of capacity.

    The only problem with the listed boat is the single engine drive, it is slow for a 41' footer, and not a good boat to get stuck in rough water. You should get one with a metal cabin also, just in case.
     
  14. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer


  15. Commuter Boats
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    Location: Southeast Alaska

    Commuter Boats Commuter Boats

    I went to the thread and saw your name on a response and immediately expected some wisdom on what makes a seaworthy hull or some discussion on better propulsion efficiency..... I wasn't disappointed to see an endorsement for Armstrong and I appreciate that recommendation.
    If you care to share your views on what might be appropriate for our needs but outside of the mainstream I'd be very interested.

    Gerald
     
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