Sidewheeler riverboat

Discussion in 'Metal Boat Building' started by Mikeemc, Nov 24, 2014.

  1. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    hello, I'm new here to the fourm. In the past year, I'v been studying these Sternwheelers and have been to many web sites and bookmarked them for study. I've also looked at canel barge boats and barges.
     
  2. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
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    gonzo Senior Member

    It seems like you haven't really calculated much of the parameters. For example, why are you using that plate thickness? It looks like you are simply throwing around some random dimensions that are not part of a coherent design. What makes you say that thrusters are "easy to make"? They are fairly sophisticated pieces of equipment for them to run properly. Have you considered the weight of a 33kw generator? It is about 1800lb, not counting cooling, wiring, etc. Thrusters won't do anything but help steer. They won't add any propulsion in heavy winds or currents. Basically, you need to actually design a boat and not just hodge podge a bunch on parts. The sternwheel is one of the worst and less efficient propulsion systems in existence too.
     
  3. parkland
    Joined: Jul 2012
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    parkland Senior Member

    Did someone do a bunch of post editing or deleting?
     
  4. Mikeemc
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    Sure did Park, really like your little paddle boat :)
     
  5. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    SOR = statement of requirements
    This is the list to start with. At first everything goes in, like in brainstorming. Later, conflicts start to be taken care of. Sometimes it is possible to eliminate something or else compromise on several items.
     
  6. parkland
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    parkland Senior Member


    :confused:
     
  7. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    Revising my post over the weekend to clarify a few things. Thank you, Mike
     
  8. parkland
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    parkland Senior Member

    I sort of feel like this thread is damaged and should just be deleted and start a new one.
     
  9. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I suppose somewhere along this thread Mike might have something to ask or add.
     
  10. Mikeemc
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    I'll leave it up for now and ask the mod's to delete certain threads.
     
  11. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    hello, I'm new here to the forum. In the past year, I'v been studying these Sternwheelers and have been to many web sites and bookmarked them for study. I've also looked at canal barge boats and barges. I'm not new to large boat building and I'm looking at a 55ft x 16ft hull for a side-wheeler. Over all beam is 20ft with side wheels. The areas I'm going to needs a shallow draft boat , Florida ICW and cross Fla. Barge canal ,adjacent lakes that are very shallow.

    I have some steel on hand , 4ea - 65ft. 10in x 4in x 1/4in steel beam for the longitudinal stringers , maybe only need 2. 16ea. 6in x 1 1/2in C channel for framing (main body of vessel). structural steel frame for engine bed and wheel shaft bearing mounts to fit port to starboard 16ft across 8ft x 16ft welded tube 3in x 3in x 1/4. Dead rise from keel to hard chine is about 10in so the bottom will have some decent steering. Water tight bulkheads will have to be addressed as to where and thickness , I'm looking at 1/8 for now. One of the designs I'm copying from is this 60FT canal boat with some modification to the bow for shallow draft.


    I spent the weekend welding up a steel model to 1/2in scale from 1/8 plate. In making it I went ahead and made the sides 5ft , I haven't determined the freeboard for the wheels until weight distribution is done in the model float test. If I decide to have the plaiting pre cut. I can send the model and have it digitized for DX cad file.




    In welding the model up I made a mistake on the bow bottom plaiting . I thought I had tacked the cut to form the V going forward and I didn't so the bottom forward is somewhat flat. I'll be making a new model to correct this, I may increase the stern V also.

    I'll be building 2ea one half hull (without keel) and be moving them to the water for final assembly and finish work. Question - has anyone used a tube keel for engine cooling , what I mean is I'm looking at a 10in x 4in x 1/4 maybe thicker 40ft keel cooler for engine and hydraulic cooling. contingent if I build it at the home where I have my shop.


    The Dutch barge design , I believe uses 8mm plaiting. That's 1 1/2 mm more than 1/4in plaiting. Dutch barge is built with framing every 2 feet. From my calculations in the broad area ( amidships )this framing could be used but the longitudinal stringers would have to be on 11in centers for panel loading on the bottom plate due to mine having a flatter bottom, given the speed is 8 knots. The other model uses 3/16in plating , the one problem with this model is that the hull framing has the be trussed all the way through sides and bottom even thou the 1/4 plate model needs some in sides and bottom where water tight bulkheads are used below the water line. 3/16 plating may not be the choice at this time do to bulkhead failure amidships at engine room front bulkhead. These finding are based on just the hull without deckhouse structure. Deckhouse structure will increase structural integrity of the over all vessel.
    Another thing is the chines , mine are hard chines so , I'd like to get some opinions on Those Who Owen these type vessels to give some feed back in what situation they were in , the pros and con of how the chine worked.
    I plan to start building in around end of March , weather permitting. I'm looking at or around Palatka Fla. on the saint johns river , if you know of a place there or nearby let me know. I'm in SC now but don't plan staying here, will be selling the house.
    At this time power is small diesel driving hydraulic pumps to paddle wheels.

    looking for a simple cad drawing program too. I'm old school drafting board and pencil.

    Last but not least I'm 61 and this will be my last boat if it don't kill me , lol.

    I tried to post some photos and my manage attachments is not working sorry will try and post the later.
     
  12. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Mikeemc Junior Member

    Ok figured out how to get the pic's uploaded, I just wished they were in the order of paragraphs in my post. I copied and pasted from Word doc. A guess you can't do that here.
     

    Attached Files:

  13. yofish

    yofish Previous Member

    Mikeemc, I would recommend you download Prosurf:

    http://www.newavesys.com/

    It is a very powerful surface modeling program that is very inexpensive. In trial mode you have 50 'saves' before it becomes inoperable. It has a 'make boat' module that by dictating some basic parameters allows one create a hull form (either round bilge or hard chine) rather quickly. If you want a hand with its basics I'd be glad to help you. It will layout panels flat to be CNC cut or otherwise. On the other hand, there is nothing wrong with doing anything an older way! It's all a matter of precision and speed. The results can be identical.

    IMO, making a model from material that is proportionally WAY out of whack is too much work and has little practical value. The art world provides some good high quality multi-ply card stock that works well for modeling. It's usually known as 'mat board' and comes as large as 32" x 40". It has the right amount of 'bones'. I plot patterns for my models then attach them to the mat board with a dusting of spray adhesive, then cut the parts out with an X-acto knife. A heat gun releases the paper, then a hot glue gun is the 'welder'. In a couple hours I can easily pop one out. I can't tell from your pics, maybe the patterns shown are already made from such?

    You have a lot of ambition to take something on of this size.
     
  14. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Location: South Carolina

    Mikeemc Junior Member

    We'll thank you Yofish that looks like a good program , I'll have to give it a go. I just got through reading for the 4th time , Richards narrow boat. Lots of good info there. I really haven't found much info about riverboat hull construction, other than the usual blogs and some small craft. So I'm on a learning curve with what I think I know and information I can gather to get my boat built. The oldest one I've repaired was built in 1896 (bow stem to keel replacement) to salvageing my steel trawler 65ft and a few in between , 6 builds and repairs. But I'm still learning the old way I guess. Are you the person making those aluminum hulls , they look great.
     

  15. Mikeemc
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Location: South Carolina

    Mikeemc Junior Member

    Was looking at the ABS rules for construction , it states this is for 79ft and larger vessels. Is there a guide for smaller vessels with the 6pack license under 100tons. I have down loaded a few PDF's but most are for commercial vessels much larger.
     
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