MX Next-new dinghy design

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Doug Lord, Aug 18, 2012.

  1. Grey Ghost
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    Grey Ghost Senior Member

    There isn't enough in the videos for me to be excited about yet.
    I think you're overreaching though. You can take every boat designed in the last 300 years and trace the ideas back to something that came before. Nothing is designed in a vacuum. Anything that hasn't been done on a boat can be traced to other engineering. It's putting all the elements together that makes it what it is.
     
  2. Vlad M
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    Vlad M Senior Member

    I've learned something new and nice today - thanks to you and Google.
    I knew that some IC sailors were experimenting with asymmetric, but didn't know it was formalized into a new branch of the class. Good for them!

    So, thanks to you again, I've learned that my mxRay in some distant way helped to improve event the IC! That's just great!

    PS. Are you sailing Canoes?
     
  3. Andy
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    Andy Senior Member

    Of course. All boats are a blend of what has gone before, and that is what I'm saying. Some combinations work better than others though, and from what I've seen so far I see things which I see as flawed. So does that mean that someone can then go around claiming that their boat is "revolutionary" and that all other peoples designs will look like theirs in 20 years time? There are far too many excellent designers out there for that to be the case. So do we just allow such spurious claims to be presented as fact, or do we ask questions? I asked questions, and the rest is history in this thread.
     
  4. gggGuest
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    gggGuest ...

    In your dreams mate.
     
  5. CT 249
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    CT 249 Senior Member

    Canoes were experimenting with spinnakers for many years before the Assymetric Canoe (AC) class was formed. Actually "experimenting" is the wrong word since Baden Powell etc used them in races in the 19th century!

    Those who formed the AC class have spoken of the reasons they did so, and of the information they used to develop the class. So have those who created the MPS. None of them have mentioned the MX-Ray when discussing the background of their boat to me or in the published information I can find. For example, the International Canoe publicity has claimed for some time that they had an assy in 1989 - quite possible as they were in use even on offshore racers by then. The inspiration for the MPS was basically a pair of Contenders, one with an assy and one with a screecher. This has been documented for some time and there is no mention of the MX Ray as far as I know in any information about the development of the AC or MPS. The fact that the creators of such craft mention other boats demonstrates that they are not going to hide anything.

    Singlehanded sailing with an older style of assymetric spinnaker has been done for decades in the southern hemisphere, where kite pole length and spinnaker shapes made it easy and obvious. One documented incident occurred in the early '50s, IIRC, in Canterbury New Zealand; see the autobiography of gold medallist Peter Mander. Basically we all did it; my Manly Junior (baby International Cadet) used to be rigged with its spinnaker pole tied to the centreline so the kite could be set singlehanded. When the family got a Vee Ess (similar to an '80s International 14) we used to stick the kite pole down the spinnaker chute so it would point into the air and we could use the conventional kite as an assy when singlehanding.

    David Thomas published sketches of a singlehander with a chute and spinnaker in Yachting World magazine in the '60s and IIRC there was discussion about the use of a kite when Bruce Farr announced his singlehanded 12 Foot Skiff idea around '68.
     
  6. Andrew Eastwood
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    Andrew Eastwood New Member

    I have just found this thread, which seems to be quite lively! I have been watching for news of the mX Next on the internet and on the Facebook page, but don't seem to be getting the info that I want. Hopefully Vlad will provide at least some of it. I have downloaded the mX Next Brochure which has some details of the boat, together with drawings (albeit fairly minute) which give some idea of the boat, they are marked Preliminary design studies 2012. There are also artists renderings (Question 1) or are they computer renderings from the design software?) of the boat floating in the water.
    Question 2) Is this document correct and up to date?
    Question 3) What is the draft of the hull?
    Question 4) What is the prismatic coefficient?
    Reference is made to computer modelling which predicts cruising at 20 knots and peak(?) of 30 knots.
    Question 5) What was the software used? and what is the theoretical basis of the calculations?
    I would assume that the software has been validated using at least one known design, and compared with real performance.
    Question 6) Was this done and if so what were the results? Any details of this would be useful.
    Question 7) Do you have drag-speed graphs? If so can these be posted?
    Question 8) Do you have heave-speed graphs and pitch-speed graphs? Again can these be posted?
    Question 9) Did the software produce polar plots of velocity- angle to wind direction? Can these be posted?
    I know that I am asking for a lot of information but it might help put the discussion on a more even footing.
     
  7. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    MX Next

    Excerpt from a story on the front page of SA:
    "Bringing a new product to market, especially a new sailboat, can be a time consuming, risky, expensive and sometimes futile, but with the new mxNext starting full production this week, we feel that it’s all been totally worthwhile. Since we started SpeedDream it’s been a fun and interesting ride. The sailing public seem genuinely interested in something new and completely different and this is borne out by the fact that we have already sold over a dozen mxNext’s, most of them sight unseen."Here is a new video of the MX Next:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2uD8QphBpM
     
  8. gggGuest
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    gggGuest ...

    Why does that not surprise me?
     
  9. schakel
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    schakel environmental project Msc

    I saw the same video, but to say it's like speeddream?
    I don't know... I don't see a keel flying. More like a RS100 to me.
     

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  10. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    MX Next

    =================
    He's not saying it's like "Speed Dream"-thats the Company/Project name.
     
  11. The Q
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    The Q Senior Member

    Although I am not a designer (I've only designed and built one boat) And have long given up dinghy sailing. It does annoy me every time someone comes up with a new design there are imediately crys of " it's no good it doesn't have wings or foils they are the future" Well please remember there are many sailers on dinghies who sail in areas where foils and wings are totally impractical. I have sailed in many clubs around the UK where due to wind shadows, and extremely short tacks would mean you'd never get lift off

    Where I sail now, Try sailing with up to a hundred and fifty boats ranging from Optimists to 30ft Sailing cruisers with bowsprits on 1.5 miles of river that is less than a hundred yards wide, Oh and add to that tourists who've never " driven a motor boat are cruising down each bank (when they are being good they occationally try and weave down the middle!)
    The Q
     
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  12. Richard Woods
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    Richard Woods Woods Designs

    I agree, I sailed at Horning last year.

    It's not just in the UK that foils aren't always suitable. I am in Puget Sound right now, just north of Seattle, and the winds here are generally so light, and there is so much flotsam, that a foiler would be very frustrating to sail, even though there is plenty of searoom and no overhanging branches

    Richard Woods
     
  13. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    MX Next

    This thread is supposed to be about the MX Next, not about foils though I think the boat would do better with them in most locations IF it had been designed from the get go as a foiler-but it's not.
     
  14. kerosene
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    kerosene Senior Member

    <removed>

    Seriously motorbike gave you sincere feedback on how you come off as and you just choose to do more of the same. Hire a PR person and step back from public discourse and you'll do better than with your attitude.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2014
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  15. Andy
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    Andy Senior Member

    In the meantime, RS have sold 80+ Aeros and not even launched their first production boat, and I don't see people stopping buying the D1 which would seem to be this boat's nearest competitor. The IC guys are also beginning to sail downwind from the end of their planks, such are the strides they are making in apparent wind sailing. Asso spinnakers on ultralight and fast boats are going to be un-needed old hat soon as boatspeeds increase. How much for the MX anyways?
     
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