Modern Aircraft Carrier

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Dook, Feb 19, 2005.

  1. Thunderhead19
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    Thunderhead19 Senior Member

    I've heard some of the same comments from our officer cadets about american officer cadets regarding how they're taught to do things. I think it's along the lines of them being micro-managed for political reasons. "They do what they're told and are told what to think whilst outside the proverbial box". BTW, Chester Nimitz did a lot of dumb things, but then hindsight being what it is....
     
  2. safewalrus
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    Dook, as a matter of reference the Royal Navy had seaborne (carrier borne)AWACS in the 60's I know I worked with the bloody things! :rolleyes: They also had many antiaircraft warning and 'picket boats' to stick out in front of the fleet;:p all experience learned from an earlier war (which you lot didn't bother to come into until you saw which way it was going [apart from a few enlightened individuals like Eisenhower and 'some of the professional military']:p )

    Unfortunately we listened to our allies who had more money than us (unfortunately not sense:( ) and followed their lead (we didn't have much choice - e.g. suez:mad: ) and plumped for the anti russian sub role! Thus when it came to the crunch and our own show we were a little short on the right equipment - we still did OK tho' despite your offers of help - to both sides!:eek: by your civilians)
     
  3. Dook
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    Dook Junior Member

    So you are getting educated to think outside the box huh? What's going to happen the first time after you get your commission and you are given an order? You are going to say "Yes sir" and follow it, not wanting to rock the boat. What Ensign, or LT for that matter, questions a superior? None that wants a good FITREP!

    The problem is that this "Not rock the boat" continues all the way up the chain. Even CO's have extremely limited ability to change anything because everything is written down in regulations and SOP's that tie their hands. The only ones who have the power to change anything are the Admirals but they are so far removed from the real day to day navy that they can't see where the real improvements in efficiency can be made.

    No one gives back money to the general fund, they spend it, sometimes wastefully.

    No one cares that we can save tons of paper and switch over to computerization because "we've always done it that way".

    No one reduces the billets of the E7 and above and brings in more worker bees because they think the navy is switching to less manual labor and more computerized systems but some of our computers are still using DOS based programs (aviation maintenance program is DOS based).

    $7 billion went to install the Navy/Marine Corp Intranet system just so we could have computers on almost every desktop and send E-mails back and forth but there already was an internet and an E-mail system in place. What a huge waste! As much as an aircraft carrier just so we can send E-mails on our own system!

    Maybe all of the above is why E5's have to work 12 hours a day for months and months straight with no days off while the zombies go home to have dinner with their families?

    Decisions like this are making my taxes go up. Fix it, damnit!

    You know what MF, I'll give you a little keen insight. The navy wants to prevent all accidents. Our rate is already very low but 2% still means a lot of deaths and bent metal. So the leadership has to take action. What do they do? They make more regulations. We have safety standowns where I'm told to wear proper basketball shoes and be carefull with my christmas tree lights, always wear my motorcycle helmet. And we have to log onto a computer and perform some training regimen online so the leadership can say "We took action".

    Now here's the insight. By taking me from my job to sit in the theater and be bored, by forcing more regulations upon me, you slow me down. This means that when I can finally get back to work I now have to hurry more than before and that gets you accidents. The zombies are the root of the problem.

    I wonder why you chose navy leaders from many years ago and none from today? Hehe.

    Can't overcome bomb damage with redundancy? No, but that applies to Nimitz as well and which is more likely to be detected by an enemy aircraft with bombs? A stealthy carrier or a Nimitz? There's no comparison.

    And yes I do understand stealth. If you would have read my article then you would have noticed the sentence that says the 55 degree sides of this stealth design will be detectable by an aircraft at 30,000 feet within 10 miles. Compare that with a Nimitz that can be detected by radar at over 90 miles, which just happens to be the range of the SS-N-22 Sunburn mach 2-3 anti-ship missile that China bought from Russia.

    In a few years France will be exporting stealth aircraft to anyone (their Rafale already has an active stealth system) and China will likely be building their own and the U.S. Navy will still be stuck with Nimitz carriers.

    I think you'd better pay close attention to your damage control training.
     
  4. Dook
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    Dook Junior Member

    Yes they exist. CIWS have been around for over 20 years and yes they work. I've seen one take pieces off a drone a mile overhead. But I wouldn't bet them to take down a mach 2 russian anti-ship missile.

    The THEL is something the US Army tested but it needs a lot of power so it is towed around on a large truck.

    An array of THEL's would be perfect as an anti-missile defense weapon for an aircraft carrier since it's nuclear reactors can easily power them and the laser beams travel at the speed of EMR (speed of light) minus the resistance.

    The only bad thing is the laser beams intensity is reduced by water in the air.
     
  5. safewalrus
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    *****, *****, *****, overlooked for promotion were we?

    You'd be a great guy to have in the trench next to me when the chips were down (that way I could keep any eye on you so you wouldn't hurt the rest of the guys - for the short duration of the remainder of your life :D )
     
  6. rowboat63
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    rowboat63 New Member

    The Navy has just re-designated it's aircraft carriers as LSTs, large slow targets. Two carriers nearly sank themselves off Vietnam with no enemy opposition whatsoever. The Navy surface fleet is a joke. There is no stelth on the surface of the ocean. There's no where to hide, and that white foaming wake is conspicuous. Let's fight the next war, not the last one.
     
  7. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Let's fight no wars, please. I think we've had enough already.....
     
  8. FAST FRED
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    FAST FRED Senior Member

    "The US Navy is by far the most inefficient organization ever created. Where the term "Too many chiefs and not enough indians" is taken to the extreme."

    Your lack of knowledge concerning Military operations is remarkable.

    EVERY military is overstaffed in piece time as the ability to repeadly take hits requires enough personelle to carry on the fight.

    Overstaffed? Not if there to continuing to launch & recover & Fight , after a couple of torpedos or cruise missels are absorbed.

    FAST FRED Ex USN Pilot.
     
  9. yipster
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    yipster designer

    i saw a big french aircraft carrier on its way back from some indian junk yard were protest was made against dangerous asbest in the ship...
     
  10. safewalrus
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    Fast Fred - Officer obviously? as you said overstaffed, a PO could do that job - so could a seaman grade 3 (or whatever you call 'em), whats in a rank! Just a ploy to over indulge the pilots ego before killing him!:rolleyes:
     
  11. Wellydeckhand

    Wellydeckhand Previous Member

    Anybody know of Japanese Aircraft carriaer named YAMATO something like that? sink in japan port i think........ anybody have a pic of that thing?:):):) heard it was the biggest ever built in the WW II
     
  12. Milan
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    Milan Senior Member

    She wasn't aircraft carrier, she was a battleship, biggest ever built. (Together with a Musashi her sister ship, at the 72 800 tons of fully loaded displacement).
     
  13. Dook
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    Dook Junior Member

    Walrus: Uh, millionaire by age 50 there snaggletooth, despite the military. Own my own business, check in on it twice a week then go back to my custom house built on 10 acres of prime California real estate. So much for your closed little mind.

    Fred: Lack of knowledge? Your lack of education is amazing. Overstaffed? Yeah, with managers, not with people who do the real work. Only the people who actually do the job day in and out know how to do it. Do you actually believe an officer, or chief, can step in and suddenly perform a function that they haven't done ever or in years? You shouldn't comment on something you obviously know nothing about.
     
  14. FAST FRED
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    FAST FRED Senior Member

    "Do you actually believe an officer, or chief, can step in and suddenly perform a function that they haven't done ever or in years"

    Most Chiefs do a decade or more of grunt work , before becoming a Chief.

    As powerplants officer I observed ,
    ANY Chief could do ANY of the work that was needed , as they taught the lower rates their jobs.
    And did Quality Controll on the finished repairs.
    In avation most are fairly bright (or soon DEAD), so the thought of a 27 year Chief , or a 2 year Seaman second class filling in after a few torpedos are absorbed is not a problem.

    In Peacetime , YES there vastly overstaffed , waiting for the day when the job will be done with 75% out of action.

    The Officers NO, the airdales are not crosstrained , none are trained in remove & repair , or even rerfuling, spotting or launching or arming.

    Fighting with aircraft is the ONLY specialty Pilots are trained for,
    the appointment to maintenance billets ect. are just to help the Chiefs when a burorat ( Like a supply clerk) gets in the way.

    And of course to LEARN how the system works , and why.

    The US has worked to free over a BILLION folks in the last century , you would prefer communism or fachisim , its close cousin?

    Work Camp or Goulag ? Which do you chose?

    FAST FRED
     

  15. safewalrus
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    Fed is goulag like Guantanamo bay? The US of A f***ed up bigtime there (better to have shot the scroats and buried them in unmarked graves where they stood than waste all that money and make martyrs of 'em!

    Dook my darling little nonentity, is 'dook' some sort of badly spelt ploy on some old world royalty that you think you should be because your a millionaire - the bit I like is the way you slag managers then tell us your a millionaire! Millionaires don't become millionaires by hand digging ditches, they do it by getting others to hand dig ditches, that in case you wearn't aware is called management!

    And if you only check the business twice a week you won't be a millionaire for long - some fly person will steal the bloody lot while your poncing around playing 'cowboys'! What I remember of prime California real estate, is that the good stuff is so rare it's owned by real millionaires the rest is desert (owned by jacks**t), so how much desert did you say you had?

    Can't be much of a millionaire if it took you to age 50 there's other redneck posers on this forum done it by the age of 30 (they say)! But you enjoy your money Mr. Boss and the grovelling by the paid hands (who are probably ripping you off big time, but you know by telling us about it you obviously are so insecure you deserve it)!
     
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