Materials for shipconstruction without damage

Discussion in 'Materials' started by phillipviana, Nov 25, 2009.

  1. phillipviana
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 9
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Rio-Brazil

    phillipviana Naval Architecture and ME

    Hello everybody,


    I'm student of Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering and i'm wondering working of project and construction the composites boats using good materials without damage the environment.
    Someday i wonder go to Europa, New Zealand, Australia, USA and sudy, learn more about those stuffs.
    I'd like to know if there's materials for composites, wooden boats buildings that they don't damage the environment in the world.


    thx:)
     
  2. Herman
    Joined: Oct 2004
    Posts: 1,618
    Likes: 89, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 1240
    Location: The Netherlands

    Herman Senior Member

    Steel: uses a lot of energy and coal.
    Aluminium: uses lots of energy.
    Composites: uses crude oil and energy
    Wood: deforestation is a problem
    Concrete: unwanted material for environmental reasons

    Every material has it's drawbacks.

    Only other thing I can mention is that in composites there is a trend towards more friendly (or at least friendly looking) materials. (hemp, flax, pine oil based epoxy resins, etc)
     
  3. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    (or at least friendly looking)

    That was the right formulation Herman!

    They only "look" green. Neither Hemp, nor flax or bamboo are so overly friendly to our environment once processed.
    The same is valid for the "alternative" Epoxies (one could make Ep from almost every oil / fat).

    When the timber is choosen from the right source (for a homebuilder nearly impossible), wood remains to be the material of choice. And not only under environmental aspects.

    Regards
    Richard
     
  4. hoytedow
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 5,806
    Likes: 373, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 2489
    Location: North of Cuba

    hoytedow Carbon Based Life Form

    What some call damage others call harvest. Any farm can be run poorly or well. A well run timber resource is actually beneficial to the forest, lessening catastrophic fire risk and removing damaged, disease or dying trees from endangering their neighboring timber. Burning fossil or other fuels must be done responsibly for pollution reasons like sulphur emissions, etc., but global warming is a farcical reason for not using them. All in all, you should use the resource that is most suited for your personal skills, based on the end product that you are trying to achieve. Have fun whatever you do.
     
  5. Herman
    Joined: Oct 2004
    Posts: 1,618
    Likes: 89, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 1240
    Location: The Netherlands

    Herman Senior Member

    Environment is crazy stuff. LPG gas is still burned on oil platforms because there is no demand for it. Distribution is a problem, and called dangerous. The same people that call LPG dangerous, are setting up a network for H2 distribution (under high pressures). Not dangerous?

    It is all about who has the best lobby.

    For boating, if there is a choice, one can make a more sensible choice. Instead of using tropical wood, there is a very nice range of non-tropical wood available, with similar properties.

    With every action you do, please do think about environmental effects, but don't overdo it.
     
  6. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Concur Herman! do┬┤nt overdo...
     
  7. alan white
    Joined: Mar 2007
    Posts: 3,731
    Likes: 122, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1404
    Location: maine

    alan white Senior Member

    I know Americans use far too much energy, materials, dump space, and so forth, byproducts of a lifestyle that is based upon cheap a fuel/income ratio.
    It really doesn't matter much what individuals do unless they become instrumental in raising the cost of fuels so that less is used.
    It matters, yes, that an individual lives in such a way that he uses fewer resources (which are nearly all made available at cheap prices due to low fuel costs). It matters to he himself if he knows better.
    People tend to justify their actions by pointing to the way others live and making a comparison. They might say that they are far more green even while they use a huge amount of resources compared to, say, a Chinese or even a German.
    Yet even the Chinese (home life) is not that sustainable when you look at the bigger picture.
    One has to realize that it will not matter what they do as individuals to change things, only that they live an honorable life, which means they always do the best they can, always understand that everything has a price, that they recognize that acting honorably to sustain their own life is the most important thing of all (live as example to others without trying to).
    You all know what you do. I see a lot of talk of efficient kayaks and also ridiculously over-powered power boats that live only to race around creating waves. You all know who you are.
     
  8. fcfc
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 779
    Likes: 29, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 399
    Location: france,europe

    fcfc Senior Member

    There was on the net a swiss study about an eco boat. But I do not remember where.


    Results where surprising:

    without damage : this does not exist.

    lowest damage :

    It was local wood from sustainable forest. I insist on local, because for swiss, it was meaning poplar wood. Using tropical wood cut from rain forest (non harvested) and transported on thousand of kilometers was a nightmare.

    The second was surprisingly carbon + expoy + linear PVC.
    There were 3 reasons for this:
    1)You need very small quantities of them to build a structurally sound boat.
    2)They are a pain to produce and recycle. But big name factories as Toray Japan for carbon and Herex swiss for foam can build it without to much environmental impact. The transport involve very small quantities.
    3)The boat you build with them will be very light, and will be the lowest on energy comsumption for its use. (ie a sailboat will have smaller mast, smaller sails smaller paint bottom surface etc ... for same performances as other materials)

    NB : With this material, it was a necessity to build ultralight, otherwise, you loose all the benefit.
     
  9. phillipviana
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 9
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Rio-Brazil

    phillipviana Naval Architecture and ME

    Thank you so much

    Thank you,guys, so much!!!

    I will read again and get those good informations, the exchange of views make us better. And certainly u guys help me much.
    I'm liking a lot learning about the project and construction wooden boat, later my next step will looking for, search good materials and cheap or not. But, fist of all GOOD.
    I don't know,but i suspicious there is better than here in our Marine Polo. Its a place like a laboratory where we, students, learn about those stuffs above mentioned.

    thanks again
     
  10. Red Tide
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 58
    Likes: 2, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 68
    Location: MA

    Red Tide Junior Member

    Maybe there are simply too many people for our planet to sustain with the lifestyle we desire. If every couple only had one child until things reached a sustainable level, that might lead to a better life for all. Or would we rather pack so many people in that we can't do anything any longer lest we use some energy. We could all sit and twitter about how great it must have been in our parents' generation when they could go out on the water and enjoy life.
     

  11. hoytedow
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 5,806
    Likes: 373, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 2489
    Location: North of Cuba

    hoytedow Carbon Based Life Form

    Red Tide, It is not up to you to tell other humans how many children they can have. If you think there are too many people, you may want to stop breeding. God/Nature will regulate our population. Socialists/Humanists don't have that right.
    You may wish to visit this thread, however, where economic positions have been discussed at length. 'Global economic situation for liveaboard cruising yachties'
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.