How to achive uniform non skid

Discussion in 'Fiberglass and Composite Boat Building' started by pescaloco, Dec 10, 2013.

  1. pescaloco
    Joined: Feb 2006
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    pescaloco Senior Member

    Hey guys
    What is you preferred method of making a NON MOLDED nonskid deck surface that will be silica or grip text and 2Pk paint

    I have made some test patches by rolling epoxy on the substrate and broadcasting fine silica sand with both total coverage and also more sparsely
    then painting with 2 part polyurethane paint. I am not satisfied with either test panel.

    I also bought a can of Awlgrip Griptex additive and rolled some paint and then sprayed the dry nonskid material into the wet paint this actually looked ok but still not great. Since I am working on the boat in the marina I can't spay the paint and Griptext mixed together.

    Lastly if one were to spray Awlgrip with griptex additive they specify an .070 tip or larger i tried to find a conversion but failed to find, I have 1.4mm 2.0mm and 2.5mm tip spray guns

    Thanks
     
  2. modflod
    Joined: Oct 2013
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    Location: Palm Harbor, FL

    modflod Junior Member

    depending what the surface under it is, you can roll silica-thickened gelcoat. Mix silica into the gelcoat before activating to a mayo consistency. You'll have to experiment with rollers. The more you roll the same surface over while it's kicking, the smaller the bumps.
    Cheap, professionnal looking, easy to do at the marina.
    If the underlying surface is not PE/VE, you could experiment with the same technique using a different paint.
    Good luck.
     

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  3. Petros
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    Petros Senior Member

    0.70" is 1.778 mm. about 1.8. the 2 mm is probably close enough.
     
  4. Landlubber
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    Landlubber Senior Member

    I had this problem whilst working in China on a very expensive brand of boats that had forgotten to put the non skid into the moulds, we did set them up later with the standard vynel patterns, but we spent a whole day experimenting with different ideas and materials.
    The winner easily was to paint the deck area with the two pack polyurethane, whilst still wet, then using a putty type spray gun filled with the factory non skid particles, we sprayed the particles over the area of paint. This was done DRY, the particles were dumped in the can dry and then sprayed out, the result was exceptional, very even in thickness and pattern.

    Give it a try, we were very happy, and I still work on one of those boats here in Brisbane and it is perfect still.
     
  5. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Mixing particulates in paint doesn't work well, because of drop out, even if the paint is continuously stirred. The broadcast method does work, though you do need to top coat to control it's aggression and lock down the particulates. I prefer to texture the substrate, which can be done a few ways, but the most common is to spray or roll the wet resin, in the taped off areas, just before it goes green and can't self level before it does. With some experimenting (different rollers, pressures, orifice sizes, etc.) you can get a very uniform and predictable textured pattern. With the resin textured, you can paint normally and if you need to repaint, the texture remains after prep, so you don't have to reapply it, unlike mixing and broadcast methods.
     
  6. pescaloco
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    pescaloco Senior Member

    Thanks to all that responded.

    I spent the day trying different techniques, and I got a nice result spraying the dry media in the wet paint.

    I will also do some test panels with VE resin and roll out with a nap roller as it goes green.
     
  7. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    If you don't over coat the sprayed in particulates, they bust out easily with use.
     
  8. Landlubber
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    Landlubber Senior Member

    Yeah, once the particles are down, you do need to overcoat them with the paint, sorry I left that part out on my posting above
     
  9. tom kane
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    tom kane Senior Member

    Mask out the area you want to apply your rough surface to.
    Apply your chosen resin or paint to that surface.
    cover the wet surface well with your dry grit. Do not touch.
    Leave until surface is dry then vacuum loose grit.
    Top coat with colour or clear resin.
     
  10. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    Sugar works OK...paint the panel...cover in sugar...let cure...wash off the sugar.

    The sugar leaves a nice profile in the paint and is easy to refinish in fulture .

    Sugar profile is not aggressive. If you need aggresive non skid use othr techniques.


    If you are doing a large surface break the surface into managable sections ...tthe perimeter of these sections is gloss.

    This technique makes repairs easier because only one panel must be recoated.
     
  11. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Rock salt works better then sugar, as they chunks are bigger and it washes out too, with no ants the next day either. This is the broadcast method and it works, though you have to experiment a little to get the texture you want. Rolling the resin, you see what you're getting as you do it and there's no additional steps.
     
  12. mastcolin
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    mastcolin Senior Member

    there is a skill to applying the non skid with roller. It can be done. It is common on superyacht here in Holland where it isn't sprayed.

    You make a mix standard for brushing. Chuck in your Griptex additive. personally I prefer mixing the coarser or super coarse with the fine. Add to your desired level. personally I prefer more than awlgrip state as I feel it works better this way.

    You need 2 people for larger areas. One man rolls on the paint mixed with grit. Roll it out thinner than you would for gloss without grit. Do NOT use a foam roller, you will get tracks/lines. Use a mohair roller than you would use for antifouling. Yep, you heard right. Once the 1st person has rolled out a thin layer (as quick as possible) the 2nd person uses a dry mohair roller and then goes over the surface. You may want-have to play with letting it tack off depending on how warm, windy, thick the paint is. Replace the dry roller once it gets saturated.

    Repeat 2nd layer next day, with out sanding if required. You will need accelerator for 1st coat. Applying paint minus grit on top is up to you. Personally wouldn't do it. 2 coats normally looks better than 1 and if the grit starts wearing away you have layer underneath.

    Spraying is/should be no problem. Just spray "dry" ie increase gun/surface distance. Use faster solvent blend. Thin more than normal. It is better to apply thin coats multiple times than 2-3 coats you would do normally until you have technique mastered. Spray in random fashion not how you would do topcoat , to avoid risk of thicker overlaps. The grit will go through 1.6mm tip. So long as you ain't using huge pressure pot I have never seen problems (I have done superyacht sized areas).

    If you spray do not apply too thick, this is where problems arise. You donĀ“t need exceptional flow. With roller technique roll out good on tape line so you get a good line. If you roll, mask good! The dry roller technique throws spetters and if there is breeze wind outside you will cover lower areas. I talk from experience:(. Brow above bridge forward of sundeck, lovely. Cap rail on bridgedeck, non-skid on varnish. Ooops!
     
  13. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    Hmmm...ill remember that...no foam roller when using griptex awlgrip.

    And a Dry roll man

    Thanks
     
  14. FAST FRED
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    FAST FRED Senior Member

    A different method to create no skid .

    Mark the area with a pencil .

    Spray starch and iron flat very coarse cotton mosquito netting and cut it to match the desired no skid pattern .

    Roll a thin layer colored epoxy , let it set a while , then lay on the cotton on your pencil marks and roll another layer of epoxy on.

    When you are done very fancy water ways and other design can be done with the no skid.

    The cotton grabs the paint and pulls it up into the fabric.

    Best of all sanding off cotton is far easier than sanding off sand , so eventually repairs can be made.

    Very large areas can be done uniformly with this method.

    For folks that insist on sand , simply use about 2 inches of material over the wet paint, and it will come out uniform.

    Vacuum it up carefully after the under paint cures and roll on a top, holding coat.
     

  15. mastcolin
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    mastcolin Senior Member

    I am not telling the Spanish all the painter tricks:) They'll have to pay me in a load of good wine for this:). I have worked with Pinmar and Rolling Stock in Spain and in Europe. There are loads of stuff they don't appear to know (they have their own tricks that I don't know for sure)

    I presume the random mohair structure gives you random grit lay done? The roller is actually not random and I think it sucks up the grit and doesn't let go. Whatever, the mohair works, the foam never. And it goes without saying never use a brush...unless a very small spot repair when you dab the dry brush on surface. Damn! Another trick in the open. Or the END of a roller:)

    ps forgot to say that a) roller is the small 10cm(?) one for better control b) before you start rolling out, make the painting roller thoroughly wet through with paint and roll out on a board or something . But when you apply the paint make sure you roll it out thin. You don't want puddles that cause the grit to float. You will only be applying a thin layer, I imagine less than 20micron(dry) of wet paint (if you could measure it). Don't sand too rough under or the scratch marks will show through. If nothing else you will get a matt finish which is probably not desired. Add matting agent if you want this.

    pps Perfection from International is meant to brush/roll very good. It may be better to use this? Never tried product personally. Only going on grapevine talk. In Holland we often use De Ijssel Double Coat which is a specific brush product and just chuck in Griptex.
     
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