Help me ID my new hull...16.5' fiberglass modified V... what engine/drive would work?

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by ve7khz, May 30, 2007.

  1. ve7khz
    Joined: May 2007
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    Hi Gang,

    Just acquired a new project for my boy and I to work on for the next few months (....years..:p ). It's a 16.5' measured right down the middle, almost 7' beam with a 30" transom depth. Transom is about 1.25-1.5" thick double layer of plywood with glass matt/cloth covering. I can't find any markings at all indicating who may have made it. Can anyone here ID it for me?

    2. What power plant and drive system should this boat have? I don't ski or wakeboard much, mainly fishing and running up on sandy beaches for camping. It's going to be a lake boat mainly but may go to the west coast for some salmon fishing once in a while. I have had many I/O boats over the years but I am thinking about having more of a speedy (read, fun, loud etc.) boat this time. Not sure what leg I/O performance can be had vs. V-drive or jet drive. I have had one jet boat which was fun but didn't manoeuver well at low speed. I have not had a V-drive but my neighbour has a Hondo which he loves and is trying to convince me to put a V-drive in this. I am a mechanic so leg maintenance isn't an issue.

    Look forward to hearing your thoughts on this.

    Cheers

    Paul

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  2. alan white
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    alan white Senior Member

    Nice lines. Real deep V. Can't help with the ID, but I like it. Got some work ahead, huh?

    Alan
     
  3. ve7khz
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    Hi Alan,

    Yes, I like the lines too. Should look good sitting in the water. Your right, I suppose it would be considered a deep V. I'm a west coast boater and consider these designs not that deep, compared to others but compared to my buddies Hondo, this is definately DEEP. I'm currently thinking either a 4.3L V6 or maybe a 350 chevy. I like I/O's but would like to try something new...maybe a leg with thru hull exhaust. :D Hard to beat the sound of 8 cylinders roaring down the lake. A six just doesn't sound the same.

    Work, what work... should only take a few weeks. ;) I envision this being a Tim the toolman type a of project. Lots of fun and learning for my boy and I and something we can be proud of when we are done.

    cheers

    Paul
     
  4. alan white
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    alan white Senior Member

    You must work faster than me. Any case, keep us posted. The boat will be a blast, I'm sure, with a V8. I envy your kid retrospectively--- my own dad never had the time. He'll learn a lot.

    Regards, Alan
     
  5. charmc
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    charmc Senior Member

    Hi, Paul,

    That hull has nice clean lines. And you've been able to get a fresh (OK, it's been around a while, but nobody else has used it or even installed anything) hull, no undoing anyone else's screw ups, that'll take some time off the project! :) Working with your son ... priceless, for both of you.

    Don't know your budget, but if you're looking for something different that would be cool on that hull, there are a number of "affordable" surface piercing drive units available. A small block Chevy with a surface drive ... something to think about if youre serious about alternates to I/O.

    Enjoy the project!
     
  6. ve7khz
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    Hi Charlie,

    Thanks for the thoughts. I have just discovered the (new to me) surface drives in the last few days of searching for drive options. Boy how things change. Ahhh... the B word (budget). Well, I am a single Dad with mortgage payments etc. so I don't want to spend a ton. I am imagining maybe $10K to complete this over a couple of years. I am a professional scrounger and I live in the heart of the Okanagan valley with lot's of used/parts boat dealers. :)
    This whole project just "landed" in my lap as my neighbours needed some dozing work in their yard and this hull was left by the previous owner of their house so we struck a deal and home it came tonight. I made a first pass pressure wash and it came up not bad. Some 409 and a brush took off another layer..and I figure another go 'round with a scrub brush and ??? should remove the rest of the tree crap.

    So, I have no idea what surface drives are worth but looking at the pictures...probably more than I could spend in this.

    Thanks again.

    Cheers!

    Paul
     
  7. ve7khz
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    I just noticed in my horrible photography skills, that I caught my other passion (cars) in the background.

    A gold star to the first person to ID my blue car in the background of the pics. Hint (think muscle cars from the 60's) :cool:

    Cheers

    Paul
     
  8. charmc
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    charmc Senior Member

    Paul,

    That's a first gen Pontiac Firebird, specifically a '68. Nice looking convertible. Only one of those built for every 4 coupes.
     
  9. charmc
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    charmc Senior Member

    Seriously, that is very good looking. Original or restored?
     
  10. ve7khz
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    Hi Charlie,

    You da man and win the gold star. Yes, it's a '68 that I restored over 20 years ago but is in need of it again. The top is still excellent but needs a rad, rear end, body work, ball joints.....etc......

    That will be another Boys Day project for Michael and I.

    cheers

    Paul

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  11. marshmat
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    marshmat Senior Member

    Well Paul, she's got nice lines and what looks from the photos to be a fairly solid construction, albeit a lot of cosmetic problems. A good candidate for the kind of project you seem to have in mind.
    In jet drives, I might suggest the Aggressor 7000 (if you like going crazy fast) or the Hamilton HJ212 (if you like more balanced performance). Either would be a nice mate to the popular and reliable 4.3 V6, even if you end up modding the engine a bit. If you really want to step up to a 5.0 V8, your jet pump options open up a fair bit, but costs will go up considerably. The crappy dockside handling of some jetboats comes from the lousy reverse deflectors some pumps use; a true deflector like the Hamilton has makes the boat far more agile in port than just about any prop boat.
    I think with a hullform that deep and the kind of power you want (which means a big prop), a V-drive unit will end up with a pretty steep shaft angle, thus deep draft and wasted power; beaching would be a real pain. In sterndrives, the Alpha is an option as is the Volvo SX, but you might find the prop torque excessive on a boat that small.
    There's a lot of surface drives out there that can handle your power range, but setting them up right requires a lot of work before the boat design is even finished, and it's even harder to get right on a refit job. They suck at low speed and are really hard to match to the boat. But you can't beat them for top end.
    I would say this baby's just begging for a jet drive; you'll get a nice, comfortable and fun boat with the 4.3 V6 or a hair-raising speed demon with the 5.0 V8. Three grand for a jetpump and fittings and 4-5 grand for a surplus or rebuilt engine with ancilliary systems shouldn't be too hard to swing, either from a local dealer or lightly used from Ebay.
     
  12. ve7khz
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    ve7khz Junior Member

    Hi Matt,

    Thanks so much for the thoughtful reply. Just the sort of input I am looking for. I like the idea of a 4.3 with a jet. I don't want to go crazy fast, just a nice mid range speed boat. I would say no more than 50MPH tops, cruising maybe at 35-40 mph. The lakes around here are mostly flat but can blow up in a hurry. That's why I like this deep hull...nice and stable. I will poke around the net to see what is available in jets for the 4.3. I know the 4.3 is a good engine as I have had a few in vehicles as well as one in my current boat in front of a Cobra drive. Do you think a 350 would be too much or a waste of power in this hull? I don't want to overpower it and I like the fuel economy of the 4.3, but I love the sound of the V8. :D

    Cheers

    Paul
     
  13. marshmat
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    marshmat Senior Member

    To be honest I think a 350 (5.7 litre) would be overkill in that boat. It'll sound macho, but it would guzzle fuel and you wouldn't be able to use all of its power anyway in most conditions. If you must have a V8 I'd go no larger than the 5.0 (305 ci). If you want the sound, you can always put a performance exhaust on the V6, it's not quite the same but it scares the hell out of jet-skiers nonetheless. For your target speed range the 4.3 would seem about right.
    Jet pumps that might be compatible:
    Aggressor 7000 http://www.aggressorjets.com/drives.html is designed for the popular 3.0 and 4.3 motors.
    Hamilton HJ212 http://www.hamjet.co.nz/index.cfm/Model_Range/HJ_Waterjets is a very popular unit well matched to the 4.3.
    Ultradynamics 251 http://www.ultradynamics.com/sections/technical/range.asp is similar to the Hamilton unit.
    Berkeley 12-series http://www.berkeleyjet.com/new_pumps.aspx is a classic, a popular choice for high-performance V-hulls and some can be spun by the V6.
     
  14. charmc
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    charmc Senior Member

    Paul,

    Matt has some excellent ideas, and good details. Based on my own experience, I'd agree that you don't need to go to a 350/5.7L, and it would probably overpower the boat. 'Course, if you really want to go way out, put in a supercharged 350, big jet drive, and go blast down a drainage ditch at 75 mph like those crazy Kiwi sprint boaters do.

    OK, back to reality. I once owned a 26' Pacemaker with a 5.0 L Crusader, rated at 220 hp. The boat was a moderately heavy cruiser with a full cabin, but she would do 35 mph all day long with that engine. 5.0L is plenty of power, but you might have a more balanced and user friendly package with the 4.3L V6.

    OK, go build the boat, then redo the Firebird with your son. You and he will remember those times forever. :) :)
     

  15. unlimited171
    Joined: Jun 2007
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    unlimited171 New Member

    keel line to deck looks like 45 degree dead rise, may have been an eary Don Aranow design and or set up for a jet drive the way the stringers are set, I bet if you do some searching for on late 60 early 70 style jet boats you will find your match, if the deck and hull come apart check around the stern and see if there is a metal tag glassed up under the gunnel, some early small manufactures did not place there hin#'s on the outside of the hull but on a metal plate placed in the glass
     
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