Freestanding

Discussion in 'Wooden Boat Building and Restoration' started by Freestanding, Feb 14, 2018.

  1. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    Thanks Rob.
    The sharpie I had (a long time ago, 1985)
    Hull was 30'. Designed by Chris Maas. I wanted wishbone booms, but I never made them. The simple sprit booms i did have allowed quick outhaul adjustment while underway......which didn't seem like an option!
    The video above was supposed to show off my flying outhaul. That's why the sail looks way too deep.
    But I play with the outhaul all the time. Seems like a must-have to me.
    The video also shows a simple "tied-off" downwind. Not completely downwind but well past cables already.
     
  2. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    Is there a forum for sails and design?
    I want to talk about sails.....I tend to infuriate and make unsupported claims....
    Rob, as you said, flex from freestanding rigs present a new issue with foresail (a little flex) Sometimes I hoisted a wire-luff jib between my sharpie masts. It looked really cool....wasn't practical.
    On my current little 14-1/2' boat (catboat) the boat is balanced under mainsail. My bow sprit is for reaching and downwind sails.
    This video makes me nauseous (sorry) and I had 80 lbs of removable ballast in the bow (which I removed after seeing this)
     
  3. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    It seems you need to hollow the luff a little more. Every sail you can buy with a wire luff will be cut incorrectly for a freestanding rig. (That's how I see it)
    I built a couple polytarp jibs (go ahead, laugh) but I learned about "hollow ing the luff" one of my jibs looked perfect (not this one).....I'm sure it is because the luff is a little extra hollow. I am suggesting that if flying a foresail from a freestanding rig it does require a custom cut sail.....just like the main.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2018
  4. rob denney
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    rob denney Senior Member

    Hollow luffs are the solution. The problem is, that you need a different amount of hollow for each wind strength, so it gets a bit inconvenient.
     
  5. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    Yes. You're right of course.
    (I'm going to say something foolish....I'm sure)
    But that is not an issue with my rig. (which is balanced upwind without a foresail)
    I don't yet own an assymetrical spinnaker but that is per plan.
    (Don't want to get too specific about my boat....because no one cares really but me)
    I want to try making a self tending jib because i think that would be cool.
     
  6. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    I don't know the "words" so this is difficult for me to describe.
    Regardless of how stiff my sticks are.....they set with a little curve. To say it differently....very light load will put the curve in it.....just the weight of the sail seems to do it. But push on it further and it feels like a beam....I'm stumbling but trying to describe how these freestanding rigs take up their (slightly curved) posture all the time.
    The masts are strong as heck, and one would not describe them as flexible....
    But they take their nice curve under very low loading. Is that the way to say it?
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2018
  7. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    If you've ever rigged a sail board you know that the mast tube has to submit to the sail.
    It takes crazy force to bend the tube like that.
    My sailboat rig is not like that. I also think Robs' super-cool, high aspect widow- makers are "fit to the stick" like mine?
    A Laser looks different to me. There is a curve to the luff so my guess is the sail is the boss like a windsurf rig. This "pre-bending or pre-loading seems to address the natural slight bend I described above.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2018
  8. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    'Got a new sail from Ballard Yacht services (Ballard Sails?)
     
  9. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
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    gonzo Senior Member

    What do you mean by a mast having to "submit to the sail"?
     
  10. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    Oh, windsurf masts are straight. windsurf sails have a pronounced curved luff. It takes a serious amount of load (6 to 1 ratio at least)
    to pull a windsurf sail onto a mast....the mast must bend in order to fit. "the mast must submit to the sail shape"
    I had a sail for my boat with too much luff rounding......it takes serious load (way too much to try) to fully raise that sail..... my spar would need to bend to fit that overcurved luff, like a windsurf sail.
     
  11. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

  12. Freestanding
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Seattle

    Freestanding Junior Member

    Hi gonzo. yes, I was thinking I could experiment with a footed sail (club footed jib?) but I'm looking for a little spinnaker first.
    I deleted videos unintentionally......
    last video
     
  13. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
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    gonzo Senior Member

    Whatever gets you on the water is fine in my book.
     

  14. Shipway
    Joined: Nov 2013
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    Location: British Columbia

    Shipway Junior Member

    My 3 ton catboat's freestanding mast is solid clear Doug Fir from a big old tree, 7.5" diameter at deck, to carry 420sq.ft. of gaff sail. Yes it's a bit heavy but 10ft of beam on a 23' boat helps. If it ever breaks, which I doubt, I'd make a new one with clear Sitka spruce.
     

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