Framing System for trimaran SuperYatch

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by ruminame, Jan 25, 2010.

  1. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    There have been a rash of threads from India members that say they are designing "Superyachts". The common denominator is that they don't have the basic knowledge of design or structural calculations. It is not disrespect to tell them that it takes years of effort to understand yacht design. Then, after all that time, we only know what we specialized on. Superyachts take a team of people with knowledge of different fields. That includes decorators and art experts.
     
  2. bhnautika
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    bhnautika Senior Member

    So let me get this straight, if you’re a student coming into this forum with idea’s, hopes and dreams and questions, you better forget it. It seems that member’s time is precious. So don’t waste their time. Well, I didn’t know that answering threads was compulsory, therefore requiring some kind of answer, good, bad or indifferent. It must be an ego thing and a need to say something.
    Is it not disrespectful to make snide remarks about his university, too many people take for granted the opportunities they have been given, its easy to poke a finger at someone and say “you should know this”. If you read his posts in this thread he is going out side the norm and into new territory, for him, as a student, this is a brave move. You have to start somewhere.
     
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  3. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    I don't think it is disrespectful to tell the truth about a University. If they are given a very poor education it would be better for them to find a better one.
     
  4. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    Shouldn't we at least ask what construction material is to be used before giving advice? This boat could be steel, wood, Aluminum, fiberglass, carbon, concrete ... or am I missing something here -wouldn't be the first time- I maybe there's a partial language barrier needs some patience to overcome? I'd like to know a little more before dismissing this guy.
     
  5. Dave Gudeman
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    Dave Gudeman Senior Member

    help with homework

    I suspect what you are seeing here is someone trying to get you guys to solve a homework problem for him. In other words, he isn't really designing a superyacht; that's just the background of the homework assignment.
     
  6. bhnautika
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    bhnautika Senior Member

    Again I ask the question if you don’t like the thread why post? Other than to have a cheap shot, to become the gatekeeper of the kingdom knowledge. If he had asked the question “I’m researching what framing is best suited to a large trimaran” would he have got a better reception? .
    Par your analogy doesn’t stack up there are many ways of holding up a roof with out walls (think glass). I think a student who doesn’t ask questions is more of problem than one who accepts all.
    A courteous response back may have got to the heart of what he was after. May be something like his second post after numerous posts poking fun. As for the truth about his university, what truth is that? Or is this just smear by innuendo.
    Nobody asked him one question they just shouted at him.
     
  7. bhnautika
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    bhnautika Senior Member

    If you read his second post, he had done some research but was not happy with that and was looking for a second opinion or advice. He may know all about the framing of mono hulls for all we know but this is new ground for him, he maybe, just being cautious and thorough not a bad trait for an engineer. He just didn’t get that chance because of the phrasing of his question and the conclusions jumped to by others.
     
  8. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    We asked ruminame several questions and he didn't answer. I don't think he has the knowledge answer the question or ask anything significant. Where is he?
     
  9. bhnautika
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    bhnautika Senior Member

    Never let the facts get in the way of a good story. What question or questions were asked.
     
  10. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    Read the thread
     
  11. bhnautika
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    bhnautika Senior Member

    Now I need some help! What number post was a question asked of him.
     
  12. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    Read the thread
     
  13. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    ruminame: I will try to help you but I am not a NA, just an old engineer long past his sell-by date. I will give you the kind of advice I would like to have had long ago.

    First, let’s set the scene. You are a student working on a project of your own choice. This boat, whatever it is, will not be built therefore people's live's will not depend on it. The purpose of the exercise is for you to learn by doing, and if your tutors are responsible and competent you will discover your errors gently and learn from them. This is better than being tested in the crucible of disaster. Of course you are in over your head, that's what makes us grow. What kind of engineer you become will be determined by the manner in which you rise to this challenge and others.

    -so relax a bit.

    Second, you need to tell us a bit more if the good folk here (and most of them are good if a little crusty at times) are to be able to help you. They will not do the job for you, you need to take the first steps yourself and hope that someone here will appreciate your effort and point you in the right direction.

    -so take your destiny into your own hands.

    Third, what do we have to go on? So far we have a trimaran, 51m length, and you want to know how to design the frames. That's not much data is it? Does that mean you know how to design the rest or it’s some other person’s job? Gonzo has advised you that each hull is a different entity, not just ama different from vaka but port and starboard amas may have different internal arrangements. Attachments for decks also to be taken into account. There are other attachments like mast(s), rudders etc which should be obvious to you. Mike Johns has listed some loads and other issues to be taken into account.

    -imagine you are a professional and someone comes along asking you the question you asked us. Could you give a proper answer based on the information we have been given by you? What other information would you need?

    Assuming you are to do the whole thing, make the initial concept design for your boat, visualize the forces that will act on it from the outside and inside (oh yes, don’t forget the engine), imagine how the skin of the boat will react, and place frames to support the skin and distribute those forces. It's a big boat, how will you get it into a harbour or marina: will it need manouvering thrusters and what kind of forces will they impose?

    Remember this boat should be capable of being built! This should be reflected in the frame design: for example a wood boat’s hull would be constructed over the frames whereas the frames of a fiberglass boat would be added after the hull shells are molded. Will you build the amas and vaka (you can get definitions for such terms from Wikipedia) as a whole or separately? Depending

    -then show us what you have! Hopefully you’ll get more effort from us when you have made an effort.
     
  14. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    #21 at least.
     

  15. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    ruminame dissppeared as soon as we asked some technical questions. Is he selling a design to some unsuspecting customer?
     
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