First boat build on a $1500 budget

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by ZIAPDX, May 19, 2015.

  1. ZIAPDX
    Joined: May 2015
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    Location: Portland, Or

    ZIAPDX New Member

    Hello all,
    I live in Portland, Oregon and recently have saved the money necessary to comfortably start my first wooden sail boat build. At this point I plan to buy much of the plywood, epoxy etc. that I will use in the next month. I am still deciding on plans but hopefully the final cost of the build will be <$3000. At this point I have tentatively chosen a core sound 17 as my plan. Before I choose the final plan however I thought I would ask for a good wooden boat building book for general technique advice, specialty tool selection, etc. Also if anyone had any recommendations on different plans, designs etc. Has anyone sailed a core sound? At this point I have read only positive reviews. I look forward to reading your responses.
    Best,
    Griffin
     
  2. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
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    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

    Ply on frame boats http://www.amazon.com/Boatbuilding-With-Plywood-Glen-Witt/dp/0939070073

    One of several decent primers on epoxy put out by the manufactures. West has another - https://www.systemthree.com/reslibrary/literature/The_Epoxy_Book.pdf

    Contact the HPMA or HPVA and ask about current design guides. I didn't find my old 20 page book anymore. Handy info on plywood properties and especially panels in bending. I think they sent it to me for the asking.

    For general info- Reuel Parker's "the sharpie book" -http://www.amazon.com/The-Sharpie-Book-Reuel-Parker/dp/0071580131

    For a more organized and technical look at boat design - Dave Gerr's Boat strength. - http://www.amazon.com/The-Elements-Boat-Strength-Designers/dp/0070231591

    I think the above 2 books would help a lot in terms of perspective. The last one helps you to gain an understanding of how the structure works as a unit and how the sizes of different hull parts are optimized for cost and weight. It gives you the ability to appreciate a well crafted design.

    Good luck with your project.
     
  3. Waterwitch
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: North East USA

    Waterwitch Junior Member

    "Devlin's Boatbuilding" by Sam Devlin is a good book on stitch and glue boat construction.
     
  4. Rurudyne
    Joined: Mar 2014
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    Location: North Texas

    Rurudyne Senior Member

    Good luck and post pictures! :)
     
  5. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    You'd be hard pressed to build a CS-17 on that budget. Sails and hardware will eat about half of it, before you buy wood, goo and finish.

    This is a free book from the epoxy industry leader and a solid reference; > http://www.westsystem.com/ss/assets/HowTo-Publications/GougeonBook 061205.pdf <

    On that budget, you might consider the PDR, which though not as pretty as the Core Sound series, is easy to build, especially cheaply. Another to consider is the Mik Storer "GIS" design (> http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/storer/gis/index.htm <). It's fast, easy to build and you'll embarrass other, production boat sailors at your local puddle, which is always fun
     
  6. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
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    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    The books Phil recommends are good ones but not really of great use in building a CS17. Sam Devlin's book and free material from WEST, System3 and help from other builders on the B&B forum are your best bet.

    You can certainly build a CS17 boat for that money although probably not all the rigging, mast, sails and trailer. Buying the kit will cost more than doing it all yourself. Don't forget that building the boat will take some time for a beginner and maybe some more money will make it into the kitty by then. Sometimes useful hardware can be found on ebay for good prices but you do need to do your homework.

    Mik's GIS is a favorite and great performer but quite a bit smaller than the CS17. I'd skip the PDR, but that's just me.
     
  7. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
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    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

    Ziapdx, you sound like you are about where I was when I built my first boat. I was renting 1/2 a house, and I owned a hammer, a hand saw, and a couple of screwdrivers when I began the build. I was hoping to finish the boat before the landlord found out I was building one (didn't happen :D) The 14'er I owned was 35 years old and too small, so I built a stouter 16' version of it.

    As far as costs go, it is very hard for us to guess the cost challenges you face. I had access to a nice wood shop on the Air Force base the odd time I needed it. But mostly I hand sawed everything, including ripping all the mahogany and oak pieces by hand. Eventually, I did buy and electric drill. So you should look at the tools list for the boat plans you are considering. And decide if tools are part of the boat cost or not. For a first time build, there are quite a lot of expenses that never actually become part of the boat - floor covering (like damaged tarpaper rolls bought from salvage yard), gloves, rags, enough cloths to throw one or two tee shirts away every day, solvents, applicators, temporary frames and blocking and the strongback you build on, tables and sawbucks. A lot of the materials for that stuff can be gotten out of salvage yards, but they still add up.

    The good news is some costs have come down. I just ordered a gallon of epoxy to repair my dink. It cost $40. Half what I paid for it in 1985. Marine ply is still pricey, but the web has made it much easier to get your hands on the stuff. I had to use a translator to order plywood made in Sweden and shipped to Georgia. It took four months to get there.

    See if you can find a local business that uses marine ply and orders a bunch of it. They may let you add your order on to one of theirs if you can be sitting there when the delivery truck comes in to take it away. I've done that a couple times when I just needed a couple sheets and didn't want to spend $100 on shipping.

    Trailer probably costs about $1300. You'll need a hitch and light kit for your car, too.
     
  8. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
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    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

    I thought the CS 17 was a ply on frame build, not stitch and glue. Has it been adapted for stitch and glue now?
     
  9. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
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    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    Never been anything but S&G Phil.
     
  10. ZIAPDX
    Joined: May 2015
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    Location: Portland, Or

    ZIAPDX New Member

    Thanks for the replies, I have just ordered Devlin's boatbuilding and should get it in the next few days. I have been looking at the goat island skiff design as well and it seems like a good alternative, especially for cost effectiveness. Would it be a boat that I could sail on the coast as well as on the rivers or would it be restricted to inland boating? Today I am going to try to find places that sell marine plywood.
     
  11. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    The ability to sail a boat along the coast has much more to do with the skipper's abilities than the boat. Typically, you're close enough to shore to make a run for it, if necessary, so this simply leaves good boat handling skills as the only thing holding you back.
     
  12. CloudDiver
    Joined: Jun 2014
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    Location: San Diego

    CloudDiver Senior Member

    If you are looking for a competitively priced epoxy try Aero Marine products;
    http://www.aeromarineproducts.com/comprehensive-price-page.htm

    I haven't used this epoxy so I can't speak on its qualities, but worth looking into. Not sure if shipping costs will make it worth it, but at least its on the same coast as you. Buying in bulk, the 3 gallon or 6 gallon kits presents good savings.
     
  13. Petros
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: Arlington, WA-USA

    Petros Senior Member

    that is a reasonable budget if you find a design that does not use costly materials and you salvage as much of the parts and hardware as you can. many common items you can make yourself rather than buy from a catalog, like cleats, fair leads, etc. Keep the rigging simple with as little hardware as possible, you can even make sails from polytarp or Tyvek house wrap to save big money. Once you enjoy it for a bit and get it sorted out than you can have regular sail made for it, if you feel the need for more durable sails.

    the higher quality polytarp sails actually will hold up fairly well, it is easy and cheap to make your self by either sewing it or using two sided quality duck tape. I have made a number of sails out of both polytarp and Tyvek, and have used them for a number of years on inland waters. They are easy to replace if they get worn out or questionable.

    I built a 16 ft tri-miran, with a single junk rig polytarp sail, large enough for four people, for about $250 worth of materials. It uses no fiberglass, all marine plywood and solid lumber stringers, that I ripped from larger planks I selected from the stacks at a big box store. many layers of quality surplus paint protects it. A layer of epoxy and fiberglass would make it require less maintenace, but it is fairly durable without the fiberglass. I just need to paint it once a season. without using any fiberglass or eposxy it saves a lot of cost (and building time, my partner and I built it in 2 and a half days in a contest).

    I have sailed it in Puget sound and a number of large lakes. It does not need epoxy and fiberglass to be strong and safe.

    good luck.
     
  14. Doug Halsey
    Joined: Feb 2007
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    Location: California, USA

    Doug Halsey Senior Member

    PAR : How can you compare a PDR to a CS 17 ?
     

  15. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I haven't compared a PDR to a CS-17, nor would I. As far as I'm concerned a PDR is a concrete mixing tub with some appendages and a sail. Some like this form of boat, but I see no sense building something so hideous, regardless of it's sailing ability. My only reference to the PDR, was for the budget imposed.
     
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