Cruising sailboats with no or minimal cockpit in the 30-40 ft range

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Avoid Rocks, Nov 30, 2015.

  1. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Annie wrote the book Voyaging On A Small Income about it. Annie and Pete divorced in 2001.

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    Annie continued her sailing aboard a 35.5' Wylo II named Iron Bark with Trevor Robertson who had solo wintered on this boat in the Antarctic in the winter of 1999-2000.

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    In the winter of 2004-2005 Annie and Trevor wintered on Iron Bark in the Arctic... (the below picture by Anie is published here)

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    Later Annie continued her sailing solo on a GRP boat named Fantail which she converted to a Junk.

    More info can be found at: Annie Hill Voyaging Notes -- Voyaging with Annie Hill -- Iron Bark's travels

    P.S.
     
  2. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Matt Rutherford who was the first to circumnavigate the Americas (he did this solo in a 27' GRP Albin Vega) now also sails a Wylo II . . .

    Classic Boat - Yard News: July 2013
    Here some cruiser kids who met Nick on the Guadiana perform a Birthday Rap for him in 2010, Nick himself can be seen from 3:42 in the video...



    Below a sailing Wylo II . . .

     
  3. Tad
    Joined: Mar 2002
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    Tad Boat Designer

    In the late 1920's William Robinson replaced the cockpit in Svaap with a aft cabin. He said the cockpit was a great waste of space. Tom Colvin was a strong proponent of flush decks rather than cockpits. Steve Dashew replaced the cockpit on his Columbia 50 with a flush deck before his first circumnavigation. Any boat can have the cockpit replaced with a flush deck. My son replaced the cockpit in his Sea Spirit with a flush deck and small aft trunk cabin.

    SS14sm.jpg
     
  4. pdwiley
    Joined: Jun 2008
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    pdwiley Senior Member

    My Tom Colvin design stretched Saugeen Witch has no cockpit, just a smooth bridge deck. It does have wheel steering though and quite a complex mechanical steering system at that. Which is purely my responsibility as I have a machine shop and like building stuff, if I were doing it again I'd use hydraulics.

    PDW
     
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  5. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    With a flush deck how does the helmsman get comfortable assuming tiller steer. I would get aching legs quickly with no footwell or am i missing something. My old boat has a ridiculously deep rear cockpit which i plan on filling in about a foot . Maybe gonzo's storage idea could work.
     
  6. ImaginaryNumber
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: USA

    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    Annie is now building a replacement for Fantail. It will be a 26' plywood junk-rigged shoal-draft boat with an apparent class name of Sib-Lim (Small Is Beautiful, Less is More). Here is the SOR, from November 2014.
    See also:
    The "Sib-Lim" Challenge

    SibLim - the model

    SibLim - the costs

    SibLim - the variants

    SibLim - the setup

    Note: The JRA forum is odd in that they put the newest messages first and the oldest messages last. Also, as a guest you can read the messages, but must be a (paying) member to post or to view certain of the linked drawings and photos.
     
  7. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    I think your mech steering is better for a sail boat. With hydraulics there is no rudder feedback which makes it hard to trim sails. Thats the good thing about a tiller. You can feel everything.
     
  8. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

  9. waikikin
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    waikikin Senior Member

    I quite like that style of raised deck with bulwarks running through.
    The style reminds me of a magazine article I read(late 70s-early 80s?) about a 36-40' yacht built in the Solomons, may have been a Herreshoff or adapted from such, what was striking and pertinent to the thread was the "cockpit area" was just decked across, had a transom hung rudder as well, the fellow that had it built lived in the village and assisted the local shipwrights in construction. It was finished with deks olje also, not sure if that held up, he also had to replace the mizzen as it cracked or broke, the builders weren't ever happy with the inititial tree choice and proved correct... may have been free standing and might have had leeboards or maybe a centerboard... too long ago, the article was interesting in the culture issue as no grog allowed as village may have been Seventh Day or similar. Also interesting from an economic sense, there may have been a duty free aspect for a developing country and the obvious lower labour & material cost. Not sure if anyone else may remember or recognises the design, could have been in Aus cruising skipper?
    I also often see some Pugh & roberts center cockpit designs that use a "poop" style aft cabin... the deck above of which often ends up with an awning over with seating fitted to pushpit around the perimeter... some davits are oft apparent, I wonder that "normal" aft cockpit yachts might be treated in a similar fashion, some adaptations that are required by climate might be easily applied.. as un-"yacht" like as they might appear we soon get sick of roasting in the sun & the theme of a breezy back shady patio appeals as most time is at anchor & the ergonomics of cockpit seats only suit some circumstances... autopilot & a few bean bags makes life comfy and easy.

    Jeff.
     
  10. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    From: 35.5' Wylo II exterior
    The on deck storage lockers looks to me they provide pretty spacious and also comfortable seating, and in addition to this some backrest cushions could be attached on the solid rails that run around the aft deck. When there's a need for hand steering in bad weather one could move the seat cushions to the flush deck and sit on them with stretched legs using the storage lockers as backrest and using the backrest cushions from the rails, all cushions firmly fixed of course. I would make the lockers so wide that the feet are able to reach the locker on the other side to brace oneself when sitting between the lockers, which would make this low sitting position pretty firm and also sheltered between the lockers and behind the wide cabin roof. If the aft deck lockers are made watertight they also provide good buoyancy where it counts to resist to roll further in a knockdown while a cockpit well would do the opposite in this situation.

    P.S. - Note in above pictures they use a tiller extension, maybe it's an adjustable one for use in various seating positions and also to have the option to fix the tiller like like in the pic below....
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2015
  11. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    Thanks Angélique. Now i get it. The storage locker/seats make it just as comfortable as a well. I like the advantage of shedding waves instantly instead of waiting for a deep cockpit like mine to drain through its 2 little scuppers.
     
  12. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    From: 35.5' Wylo II exterior
    I don't think the last quoted picture steering position is comfortable for a long period of time, also as shown without wearing a PFD and not on the leash it isn't safe. I would mount a backrest on the long plank across the stern and mount this athwartship seat below the tiller, so one could sit next to tiller facing forward without turning the neck all the time while steering. This would need a bit higher rudder head and a straight horizontal tiller I think.
     
  13. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

  14. pdwiley
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    Location: Hobart

    pdwiley Senior Member


  15. Yobarnacle
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    I encourage modifying an existing boat.
    A wheelhouse/cuddy can be added over the forward area of the existing cockpit.
    Sized to allow sitting headroom, protected companionway access below, and serves as a spray dodger/windbreak for the helmsman.
    It can provide a mostly protected fishing position, if the bridgedeck athwartship aft of companionway is resized and re-sculpted into comfortable aft facing seating. Leave the wheelhouse open on the aft side for poles and lines.
    Another athwartship seat can be created at after end of cockpit, reducing volume and adding forward facing seats when motoring.
    Creates more aft storage or enlarges aft cabin as well.
    These changes are not expensive or intensive, and can be designed as bolt-ons, should a future owner want to revert to original.
    Goodluck! :D
     
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