Concrete submarine

I hope you can open it, very interresting. The English version is on top on the page,on the left, click the Union Jack.
And if somebody else in the blog already mentioned this link, I apologize for the repeat.

http://www.euronaut.org

 

What's the point

1. Mobile Habitat (Independant Morring, genset and wind)
2. Long Range Voyage (Transcontinental Snorkle 20-30kts)
3. Short Range Surface Independant Sub (6-12hrs @ 3-6kts, <200')

This is a very inexpensive, independant life style. Imagine having a moored surface patio that stays on the bouy when you take off in the sub. The patio has the wind gen and solar heater with steps to the hatch where you spend the night.

Subs like this can achive 20MPG at 15kts compared to the best surface yachts that work hard to achive 1.8 to 2.2 MPG. These smaller surface yachts have no more space than the 200T sub because it actually uses a lot less space for the "equipment". The redundant gensets and electric motors are very small as long as you stay below 20kts while snokleing, 12kts on the surface and 6kts submerged. Remember the dropable ballast is outside!

Ther hardest part of this yacht is getting the inflatable tender out of the sub. Most subs keep the inflatable part in a fiberglass farring and just hoist the motor out of the sub. That way they meet the solas self rescure requirements of the open ocean operation.

 

1. 
   
   Get a http://www.porta-bote.com/
   
   Also get inflatable life raft http://www.theraft.com/

 

Underwater Habitats

I do - in fact it is not really clear if the 200 tonner i built is a "live abord submarine yacht", or a "mobile habitat"... depends on the lifestyle the owner adopts - i assume.



It would also be hard to say if BEN FRANKLIN was a submarine, or a drifting habitat. As soon as you manage the step to think a bit outside this military submarine box - all those options become so clear... where else could we take this concept?



Some suggestions on the latest pages added to the website:

concretesubmarine.com

 

This is a great example of a civilian design focused on research / dive work with all the appropriate tradeoffs. Many of their tradeoff would be cumbersome or dangerous abourd a yacht with wives or friends wandering arround!

Just look at the layout. I don't think i would do a transcontinental voyage in it for comfort reasons alone. Diferent purpose different design. Form fits function!

I have got to stop posting from my phone! LOL
The typo's must be killing you guys!

 

Legal Opperation of a Sub

I have excerpts from the law which show the requirements which are basically

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s110-3598

1) Legal registration in a country which is a member of the maritime pact.
2) AIS transponder and possibly Flag while on surface (text is vauge)
3) Master of the Boat must verbaly indicate the flag is challenged via VHF or HF as required my maritime law. (AIS / Flag eliminates this requirment)
4) Transponder may be construed to mean underwater transponder while submerged. (This iss still not part of international maritime law but may be required to fully submerge in the US)
5) failure to present supporting documents or have the supporting documents on file with the embasy for the flag country may allow the vesil to be board in international waters but this is actually a crime today.
6) The US has esentially given it'self probable cause to board / detain if the AIS / flag can not be confirmed with the flagged country.

Affirmative Defenses-

‘(1) IN GENERAL- It is an affirmative defense to a prosecution for a violation of subsection (a), which the defendant has the burden to prove by a preponderance of the evidence, that the submersible vessel or semi-submersible vessel involved was, at the time of the offense--

‘(A) a vessel of the United States or lawfully registered in a foreign nation as claimed by the master or individual in charge of the vessel when requested to make a claim by an officer of the United States authorized to enforce applicable provisions of United States law;

‘(B) classed by and designed in accordance with the rules of a classification society;

‘(C) lawfully operated in government-regulated or licensed activity, including commerce, research, or exploration; or

‘(D) equipped with and using an operable automatic identification system, vessel monitoring system, or long range identification and tracking system.

‘(2) PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS- The affirmative defenses provided by this subsection are proved conclusively by the production of--

‘(A) government documents evidencing the vessel’s nationality at the time of the offense, as provided in article 5 of the 1958 Convention on the High Seas;

‘(B) a certificate of classification issued by the vessel’s classification society upon completion of relevant classification surveys and valid at the time of the offense; or

‘(C) government documents evidencing licensure, regulation, or registration for commerce, research, or exploration.

 

What kind of propeller is that? Any newer pictures? What is black bag covering hull. The surface look rough. I don't see how you build it in the building. You surely did not drag into building.

I would think a pour like that would be better in a dug out pit. Then sub woulb be move from pit via a very large crane to a giant flatbed. Then to water.

It doesn't seem this is what I see in pictures.

To me I see a wood structured blimp that was stucco in concrete, not something from a mold.

 

You guys are arguing over insurance and paperwork. Is it real?

Lets see diagrams, pictures of inside, working drawings anything...
I would be happy to sign NDA.

 

Wilfried & Steve, good luck with your efforts.

I'm not sure what your sub would cost but you have some serious competition.

One the lower end, the Uboatworx made in The Netherlands (Euro 150 K or so). On the high end SeaMagine (www.seamagine.com) and VAS/Nautilus (www.yachtdive.com) in the $ 2 million range), both built under class rules.

I would start with building a better website. The navigational architecture leaves to be desired and thats a gross understatement. Also, people want to see who you are. What makes you qualified to do this project? Who are you anyway? I can't find that info. From the pictures and text I can see you are in Cartagena and now I realize you are the owner of the sub at Navtech.

Well, good luck.

Thorwald

 

Ahh.. nice to have you back on earth within a few (28) minutes ! No, we have been comfortable with the typo´s by so far.

You are still flying Pan Am ??

 

Hey, Apex
You built a few boats... Does this look real to you??

 

Yes, I believe they do...........

but would never allow one of my children to have a test run!

Regards
Richard

 

Yeah - me too.

I dont see we were 'arguing' about the admin problems. Its the only 'solid' thing I can get a handle on at this point. All the 'technical detail' is totally not available. I have seen some great schemes totally destroyed by 'paperwork', espcically where safety was concerned. Have you read the story behind the Mini Minor demise?

It occurred to me in a dream last night - Stevall has probably actually paid real money to be an 'agent'. No wonder the specifics are missing.

I got the impression from Wil that he was building the thing for a 'client', but these recent posts dont mention the 'owner' much. I wonder what is happening there.

When researching - its always best to 'follow the money'

 

Follow the Money, in Colombia? Submarines? Hey in Miami in the 80's, the offshore boating industry, construction, real estate was all funded by Drugs. Nothing against these guys I do wish them well at many levels. But if their actions are truly altruistic to change the world, then open up with more details. Otherwise it is the same old pictures, lots of conversation, I think they are looking for money to continue or are/have scammed someone in past.

I once worked for a lady that started a TV network, she sold shares to people but kept majority interest. Somewhere at the end it became apparent the she sold more the 100% not including her suppose 51%. So what started as an entrepreneur ended up a ponzi scheme.

If it is real - I will personally donate my old boat stuff to cause and even give engineering/research support. But right now it seems a little fishy.

 

new ideas

US construction is a topic that Wil and I have discussed. Just the fact that we have so many interested expert in all fields of devlopment, even Devil's advocates can work in our favor.
As a start-up company, especially in the States, this has given me new ideas how a 200 ton boat could be competly outfitted with US craftsmanship, concrete testing, dive testing, hull compressing, and many other aspects that are possibly available to make a sub that is safe, fitted in the inside with carpentry experts and dive expertise with the assistance of of scuba diver etc. The possibilities aree endless. Also, the pool of experts are all within somewhat easy access in America.
The additional experience and expertise of the actual cement pour and designs will come from Wil. Where I live, on the Delta, has many advantages as to testing, where although the vision is obscured from the view ports, the interest in building a sub of this size is right out my door. In addition, the access to materials is local. There are 3 ready-mix companies that are just waiting for the business, a Homedepot is in walking distance for common materials, and a Westmarine, as well as other marine specific companies are all within the area.
A major committment is necessary to complete the first 200 ton on US soil. This can come from a co-op from all of the people I just mentioned. The Delta, and the little cove that I live in has a deep channel, as well as many shallow areas. Some of these shallow areas completely turn to dry basin twice a day, perfect for any add-ons we would want to make without taking the sub out of the water.
The mold, which is reusable is done, the costs of going on a major drop-off run are removed, and local cost of registration, insurance and inspection are right here.
Although I work and assist Wil in many aspects, I am still a consumer. The costs of building a sub with the stamp of being associated with the company is the goal. I have many people interested in the project, but what is necessary for the majority of commitments is the ability for a buyer to see a sub in his backyard is one of the reasons for any delay. Also, a comprehensive paper on all of the tests done and approved from the proper authorities in an addition insurance.
What I need are some ideas as to the ways this coud all come together. With many people involved in a co-investment would, in my mind, get those that are considering a purchase to commit. If Wil approves, he could reestablish a base of operations right here, which is centraly located and he could easily get the project going.
In my mind, the positive aspects are overwhelming and any concerns as to real world applications could be worked out in this forum.
I am good at organizing, and there are shipyards, cement companies and carpenters ready to go. The time from start to finish could be reduced as well as the cost and paperwork.
The main question is what is in it for the people that want to be involved? For me, just the possibility of using a complete yacht sub would be a thrill. Although coming to this, or even a better location, would be an expense. But airlines and local motels are dirt cheap right now. A well organized project would have specific dates of arrival and departure to facilitate the use of one individual's expertice.
Another draw for individuals to make this initial investment would get him or her a ground floor opportunity for purchsing the sub. As many people possible ivolved would bring down the individual cost. That is why word of mouth is an important aspect as well. If all goes well, methods of less expensive building techniques could be incorporated.
I know Wil will to listen to any ideas, as do I. Although the profit margine to start may not be the most desirable, the future could be the exact opposite. Everyone who has contributed may possibly be able to use their initial investment toward their own sub.
As for me, I would be willing and even excited to make steps in any harbor to bringing the reality to those that have only seen pictures. This would sell its self as I made my way to the next hand-off to a person who could take up where I left off. I don't know of any companies that have used this method to bring an idea to the public. it would be a novel approach.
I think I have given a general picture as how this could be done. If we bring even a couple more interested parties to the forum, it could become big. I welcome any ideas, both negative and positive that could help.
In regards of making a smaller sub or making design modifications, which have been discussed. I have come to my own conclusion that to make any long passages, anything smaller would be out of the question. I know, based on the prices of construction costs of the 200 tonner made and delivered from Wil's current location could be brought down, and even make more money for the company. With the 200 ton mold completed, a big cost has been eliminated. A company needs to make money or at have to ability to to profitable to survive. This could be done, and still make Wil's efforts woth while.Let's keep it going and make a change in the perception of owning a Yacht Submarine a reality.
Thanks for reading,
Steve