clear Awlgrip (Alwood) or Epiphanes

Discussion in 'Materials' started by H A van Nes, May 25, 2015.

  1. H A van Nes
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Croton on Hudson, NY

    H A van Nes designer builder sailor

    I've wooded the entire 30 footer ready to refinish bright. What's the best product. I've heard the yards around NY will use Algrip clear unless the owner specifies something else. Alwood is their brand name for their best clear finish. Any ideas?
     
  2. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    There are a lot of choices for these types of linear clear coatings. Most perform quite well, though are harder to apply (well) than other types of clear finishes. All the major formulators will have these types of coatings, so much of it depends on what's available, what you're comfortable with, your skill sets and equipment. Spraying Alwood, Epiphanes or Bristol Finish will all produce fine results, but can you do this or will a product with more friendly hand application be something you're after?
     
  3. H A van Nes
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Croton on Hudson, NY

    H A van Nes designer builder sailor

    Thanks Par: That's pretty much what I thought. I wonder if the Awlwood is stronger or will hold up to UV, scuffing, swelling/shrinking, of the wood better? I have equipment and experience spraying but it is more involved - need to mask. But mostly it's about overspray and wasted material. Also I don't know the price of the Awlwood product and primer. I suspect it is more than Epiphanes. I agree, all the products applied properly will give good looking results. Do you have a preference?
     
  4. pauloman
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: New Hampshire

    pauloman Epoxy Vendor

    very few 2 part clear polys have much in the way of UV protection.. It is a very expensive additive needed for gloss clear finishes. Two exceptions - auto clear coat and acrylic poly uv plus.

    one cool trick is to apply over fresh new spar varnish - a win win combination

    paul
    progressive epoxy polymers inc
     
  5. H A van Nes
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Croton on Hudson, NY

    H A van Nes designer builder sailor

    Thanks Pauloman but the Epifanes rep told me that putting their two part coating over their one part varnish will not work - the 2 part solvent will soften and lift the the one part varnish. Your suggestion does sound interesting. What specific products do you recommend for your method? Should I use your method AFTER two coats of varnish while the second coat is new and Fresh. By fresh do you mean still tacky?
     
  6. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    A product 1 of the forum members recommended to me is coelan clear it Waterproofs the timber as well and lasts for years. $ 470 aud. For 3 ltrs its not cheap but it is the best.
     
  7. pauloman
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: New Hampshire

    pauloman Epoxy Vendor

    I have put the 2 part LPU (acrylic poly UV - contains both uv blockers and absorbers - most clear coats do not) over spar varnish with good results - so have my customers - best results - epoxy primer then spar varnish for mil thickness, warmth, uv protection, etc then 2 part clear lpu (acylic poly uv plus) over the organic spar varnish - great for masts etc that don't come down very often.

    paul oman
    progressive epoxy polymers (epoxyproducts.com)
     
  8. michael pierzga
    Joined: Dec 2008
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    Location: spain

    michael pierzga Senior Member


    The awlgrip product is good.

    The epiphane product and complete epiphanes system is good.

    Its up to you


    I would go epi because I know how to use the system

    You should go with the product that your shipyard is familiar with.

    Dont force them to use unfamiliar products.
     
  9. H A van Nes
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Croton on Hudson, NY

    H A van Nes designer builder sailor

    Thanks Pauloman. this sounds a bit like what I did 12 years ago when I first did the boat. but I'm told I need to seal the wood before staining to even out the stain this time. The hull is completely raw wood now. Can I seal with thinned varnish or epoxy primer to even out the stain, then stain, then varnish and finish with the LPU 2 part product? I welcome your input - thanks in advance.
     
  10. SukiSolo
    Joined: Dec 2012
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    Location: Hampshire UK

    SukiSolo Senior Member

    I've seen incompatible varnishes bubble up a surface in minutes before now. Also 2k finishes tend to peel off after a few months. I've never tried mixing systems myself EXCEPT that 1 pack poly varnish goes on pretty much any type of underlying varnish and stays there. At least the Hempel, Epiphanes and International ones do AFAIK, not had one peel off in over 30 years so far.

    If you do go the Pauloman system make sure you get exactly the correct varnishes for compatibility, thinners too. Especially important as this kind of mix is not normally recommended.

    Although I don't doubt it (mixing systems) can work, I'd like to understand the 'systems' ie chemistry a little more before I'd give it a try. Any further info would be much appreciated. It should also be noted that sometimes US terminology and Euro can be different and even the same branded products different either side of the Pond....;)
     
  11. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Coelan clear wood finish lasts up to 10 years in the bright uv sunlight.
    From what I understand, as it ages, if the surface dulls, paint on more. The original coating will never crack.
    http://www.coelan-boat.com/

    No need to spray, it flows totally smooth. It is like a shiny clear tough rubber coating that stretches with wood so it will not crack.
    I told a slip neighbor about this, he put it on his woodwork and likes it a lot.
     
  12. peterjoki
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    Location: Turku, Finland

    peterjoki Junior Member

    Tell us about the construction method of your 30 footer.
    This is very important when choosing a varnish.

    2k all the way if the wood doesn't live, ie cold molded, plywood.
    Are you varnishing below waterline, or going to use anti-fouling?
     
  13. H A van Nes
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Croton on Hudson, NY

    H A van Nes designer builder sailor

    thanks guys: I never heard of Coelan. I will check it out. As far as the construction it is 1/4 in marine ply over the frames topsides then covered with 1/2 in mahogany planking screwed and epoxied onto the plywood. The bottom ends the same way but has an additional third layer of 3/8 in planking epoxied onto the frames first. all layers are epoxied all over. I am using anti fouling paint on the bottom.
     

  14. peterjoki
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    Location: Turku, Finland

    peterjoki Junior Member

    Give it an epoxy seal and finish with the varnish of your choice. The best UV barrier is the most important factor to consider. All the leading brand 2k varnishes perfom about the same. I'd go 2k.
     
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