Best Design for Minimalist Trailerable Coastal Cruising

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Chris Ostlind, Sep 29, 2006.

  1. lewisboats
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    lewisboats Obsessed Member

    Hey...What about the Pilgrim 590...I was going to suggest the K800 but it is too heavy for your specs. Anyhoo...here is a couple of pics of it (P590)

    Steve
     

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  2. lewisboats
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    lewisboats Obsessed Member

    Egoist is also an option...I have a zip of the plans if anyone wants.

    Steve
     

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  3. Chris Ostlind

    Chris Ostlind Previous Member

    O'Toole's Take

    Nice comments, Matt. Yeah, the indication about operation of the float folding could have been better said. I think you hit it correctly, though, about the mechanism.

    I deliberately left a lot of space around the baseline description to see what sort of boats were swirling through people's heads regarding this application. Too tight of a basket and it isn't as much fun. There would be time, later, to draw it down some and further focus the potential.

    Steve: The Pilgrim 590 certainly does fit the niche nicely, especially with the centerboard.

    One of the obvious questions that are emerging is the use of a small outboard for a boat of this type. The use of the F22 in tight coastal environments, when there is no wind, mandates a small outboard as the boat can not be paddled effectively for more than a few yards. Currents, as Matt indicates, would soon sweep the boat wherever they would take you. That could end-up as a less than optimal experience.

    I have always felt that the smallest F-Boat currently available, the F24, would make for a fantastic coastal cruising Mother Ship with kayaks as the means to explore the smaller waterways where it would be unwise to take the F24. You would pay a small price to have a pair of kayaks lashed to the tramps and the personal mobility, once anchored, could make for some fantastic exploration in areas where most big boaters never go.

    Other boats that have been mentioned in this category could carry an inflatable or even a folding kayak for the same application.

    If the F24 were to be used in this fashion among the islands of the Pacific Northwest, where huge tidal swings are common, the need to have a suitable inshore dinghy or kayak is an absolute. A prudent person is not going to beach their F24 on a rocky shore at high tide and then listen to the awful sounds of the gelcoat while the next tide comes in to float it free. In this case, a sailing canoe/trimaran might make for a much better choice as it can be physically handled to a location above the tidal flux.

    Matt, your comment about "what coast" is at the essence of the discussion as the boat chosen will have to deal with not only prevailing conditions, but also have to recognize the potential, realistic range within the given load carrying capacity of the design as it applies to stores. There are lots of very interesting cruising grounds that have large distances between dependable sources of stores, so that limitation would have to be near the top of the list for a great all-around design.
     
  4. ted655
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    ted655 Senior Member

  5. messabout
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    messabout Senior Member

    Sean Herron suggests that Bolger boxes may be anathema for all us sophisticated guys. I used to deride those beastie things too. That is until I sailed a few of them. Micro and Long Micro are about as ugly as they can get. BUT they are marvels of simplicity, low cost, and yes, performance. My favorite is Black Skimmer a rather charming sharpie. I chartered a Skimmer years ago in the Florida keys. Some of the stuff that Bolger prescribes seems goofy until you use it. For example, the Black Skimmer has flooded forepeak and flooded transom well. There are a hundred holes drilled in the bottom to accomplish the flooding. That seemed absurd to a guy who has spent a lot of years trying to keep water out of the boat. The flooded compartment washes the mud off the anchor, provides a great place to shower with a plastic bag thingy, and does not seem to affect the performance of the boat, nor is it noisy. The Skimmer will SAIL, not just float, in less than twelve inches of water. The damned thing is built inside out as the stringers are on the outside of the boat. That is sure to slow the boat one would think. I did not notice any diminished performance. The yawl rig is a marvel of simplicity. Unstayed masts,sprit booms and only two strings to adjust. The boat will self steer for miles and miles. Lest I sound like a Bolger salesman, I hasten to add that I dont own one of his boats and have no plans to do so. On the other hand I have great respect for those "chicken coops". If you want a Marina Queen this is not it, but if you want a capable, fun, reasonably cheap boat then give it a look.
     
  6. jarhead
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    jarhead Junior Member

    on the question of launch/retrieve times- the janus and similar cats cant compete with folding tris. the courier boats are way too hi-tech/expensive for my taste or bankaccount, but his earlier plywood versions are very suitable, the tramp and 6 metre trailertri should be considered if you're in this market.
     
  7. kellan_hatch
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    kellan_hatch New Member

    Light Trimaran

    Hi,

    In my opinion, the ultimate minimalist cruiser should be very lightweight and should have features, besides small accomodations, that differentiate it from larger cruisers. Ideally, you should be able to take into very thin water, launch from just about anywhere you can get your feet wet and even make short portages. For my money, a light multihull gives you the most boat for the least weight. To fit the definition of a cruiser, I believe it should be roomy enough for one or two people to sleep onboard and duck out of inclement weather.

    This is the boat that fits that description for me (I may be a little bit predudiced, since this is going to be my next boat):

    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/06/designs/xcr/index.htm

    I also like the idea of having at least three options for propelling a boat. In this case sail, paddle and small motor.

    A trimaran configuration gives you massive stability while still allowing an very lightweight craft that can be easily moved along by wind, motor or muscle.

    Kellan
     
  8. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

  9. Chris Ostlind

    Chris Ostlind Previous Member

    I'm not Kellan

    Here's the boat about which I was referring in my initial query.
    (attached) The manufacturer of that boat is Kruger Canoes in Michigan, USA
    http://www.krugercanoes.com/prod03.htm

    I am building a boat for Kellan, but I made no mention of that effort in my postings nor did I prompt Kellan to post on my behalf. He's just proud of his new boat and likes to talk about it.

    My apologies if it appears to be something else that is tricky.

    I really like boats of this type and I think that shows in the comments I have made to specific different types as they have been posted in the thread.
     

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  10. Guillermo
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    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Chris: I was joking. No offense here.
    By the way, I know 'nada' about canoes.
     
  11. Tanton Yachts
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    Tanton Yachts Yacht Designer

    User Friendly 21

    Water Ballasted. Free standing rig. Fiberglass construction.
     

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  12. Gilbert
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    Gilbert Senior Member

    There is a lot of interesting stuff on this thread.
    I would mention the Rhodes Mariner (or O'day or whoever took it over after that). I believe it is basically a Rhodes 19 with a cabin and 4 bunks. I spent some time sailing on a Rhodes 19 and it was one of the very best sailers I've ever been aboard. That makes me think the Mariner would be great too.
     
  13. kellan_hatch
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    kellan_hatch New Member

    Nothin' up my sleeve

    Nope, no trickery! Actually, I didn't even know if Chris was thinking of this kind of boat when he started this thread. I think he's just looking for feedback about what people are looking for in a minimal cruiser. He designs a lot of different types of boats.

    But the truth is, I'm just very excited about the XCR and want people to see the design and consider the exciting potential this type of boat.

    Also, I think the word minimalist, when applied to watercraft, means a lot of things to a lot of people. To me it means just big enough to sleep aboard, carry a simple galley and big enough ice chest to keep me in cold Pepsi for a few days.

    Kellan
     
  14. lewisboats
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    lewisboats Obsessed Member

    Interesting...what kind of bottom shape does it have, do you have a body view?

    Steve
     

  15. Tanton Yachts
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    Location: Newport. RI. USA

    Tanton Yachts Yacht Designer

    User Friendly 21'. Sections.

    Also available in 24'. Dinghy shape with a long keel.
     

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