AC 36 Foiling Monohulls

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by OzFred, Sep 13, 2017.

  1. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    Everyone had pretty much written off Stars and Stripes, even the recently released Prada Cup schedule leaves it out. However, it seems there's a last ditch attempt to sail someone else's Boat 1, rumoured to be ETNZ's Te Aihe.

    Could struggling America's Cup syndicate Stars and Stripes earn a lifeline?
    The challenger's yet to launch its boat with thoughts the challenge exists largely in name only.
    But reports out of the US claim Stars and Stripes has gone to the independent arbitration panel to try to get permission to take over Team New Zealand's first boat Te Aihe for the Prada Cup.
    To do that they will need to force a rule change that says the boat's hull and other components must be built in a syndicate's country of origin.

    A major hurdle is that the Protocol requires that a team's hull is built in the country of the team (the "constructed in the country of origin" provision), so the only existing boat that S&S could use is American Magic's first boat, Defiant, which is now in Auckland. To use Te Aihe S&S needs a change to the Protocol, and that requires agreement from both ENTZ and Luna Rossa Prada.

    The benefit for the team selling or leasing out the boat is that they get some cash for an otherwise useless asset. However, there is zero benefit for anyone else other than S&S. A fourth challenger doubles the number of races required to complete the Prada Cup round robin stage 1 from 12 to 24, so that 2 races must be sailed every day and three on some days of the proposed schedule. That seems like a logistical nightmare for the sake of a fourth challenger with little (no?) chance of being competitive.

    So I rate the chance of success of the rumoured S&S's plan as zero, but this is the America's Cup so really anything could happen…
     
  2. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    The Stars and Stripes challenge is now virtually over. The arbitration panel rejected their request to waive the "constructed in country" requirement of the protocol for the Challenger Selection Series (aka Parada Cup).

    ACAP36 10.pdf https://docs.google.com/a/acofficials.org/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=YWNvZmZpY2lhbHMub3JnfGFjMzYtb2ZmaWNpYWwtbm90aWNlYm9hcmR8Z3g6Mzg5N2FjYjRkOTBiNjc0Yg

    S&S could still be a challenger if it can get a boat to Auckland before the start of the Prada Cup (15 Jan 2021) and have it measured, which must be completed by 13 January. The odds of them making the starting line are now vanishingly small and getting smaller every day.
     
  3. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    Video of Defiant training on 3 Aug:
     
  4. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    Doug Lord likes this.
  5. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
    Posts: 2,327
    Likes: 190, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1082
    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

  6. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

     
    Doug Lord likes this.
  7. Dolfiman
    Joined: Aug 2017
    Posts: 1,157
    Likes: 496, Points: 83
    Location: France

    Dolfiman Senior Member

    A synthesis of the concept and the technology involved :
     
  8. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    More Defiant… a lot of wing is out of the water at times, is that a consequence of anhedral foils? Would flat foils have less of the wingtip exposed?

    At about 39 seconds it seems to hit some wave tops pretty hard, likely it's a rough ride at times. Manoeuvres are pretty slick.

     
  9. Doug Halsey
    Joined: Feb 2007
    Posts: 442
    Likes: 123, Points: 53, Legacy Rep: 160
    Location: California, USA

    Doug Halsey Senior Member

    Are you assuming that exposing the wingtips is a bad thing?
     
  10. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    I think for a straight foil it's not much of an issue, but for an anhedral foil it means the outer wing is very close to the surface, which has issues for drag. In rough water, quite a lot of Defiant's wing comes out, which means it must be close to losing most of its lift in deeper troughs.

    But maybe the inboard wing is providing a lot of vertical lift, so perhaps it doesn't matter that much? There are so many variables to consider and the teams still don't seem to have worked out what is optimal yet, so not a simple problem. :)
     
  11. CT249
    Joined: May 2003
    Posts: 1,247
    Likes: 86, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 215
    Location: Sydney Australia

    CT249 Senior Member

    The searching I did indicated that the kiteboarder seems to have no track record as a racer. No disrespect, but in other foiling classes even good sailors seem to be going up to 25-50% slower than the pros, from what I've seen. It would be interesting to see a top-line pro kitefoiler up against the AC75s.

    It's also a bit funny that eons ago, some people thought it was dumb that a 17 or 18 foot "beach toy" could sometimes be as quick or quicker than a 67' AC boat. Now it's possible that a 3' "beach toy"could sometimes be as quick or quicker than a 75' AC boat.
     
    Doug Halsey likes this.

  12. OzFred
    Joined: Nov 2015
    Posts: 506
    Likes: 53, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 16
    Location: Earth

    OzFred Senior Member

    The sailor is described in Sail World and Yachts and Yachting articles as 17 year old "Devonport kiteboarder Nick Reeves" so yes, not known kiteboard racing talent. But he has time on his side.

    At least it's a bit more even than the AC72 vs non–foiling kiteboard—even though that kiteboarder had a better resume. :)
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.