30' plywood sharpie

My wife is an artist and a sculptor; she's the one who has good taste in oil paintings. What I have is good taste in wives....



This is her high school senior picture. All my other pictures of her, especially the more current ones, are trapped on my old Dell laptop that took a dump a while back. I need to have someone retrieve them for me.

 

way to go T

 

Hello Troy,

I followed your thread with great interest because in my opinion its a fascinating way to design a boat.

For my feel the cabin is way to high and it will destroy the lovely proportions of your hull. If you say " it doesn't look to bad" don't forget that your cabin seems to be higher than your entire hull midships now, which will dig 9 inches deep into the water.

I don't want to criticise your feeling for proportions, but ...

... perhaps it is a good time to mark your waterline and color your underwaterbody to check the proportions again.

... perhaps take a second look at the possibility for a few inches more freebord in the hull and the same few inches less in the cabin. You can do it easily by adding a temporarely piece of foam or balsa to double up the deck.

... perhaps extend the cabin to the front, so that it doesn' look as short and boxy as it is now.

I'am facing the same problem at the moment, having a sharpie on my drawing board and trying to get good looking proportions and sitting headroom at the same time.

Grrreetings from the Noth Sea Coast, Michel

 

Unfortunately, I've reached the point where what you see is probably what you get. If I reduce the cabin any more, I'll also be reduced to crawling around it on my hands and knees.

I believe part of the problem visually right now is the lack of trim, bulwarks/toe rails, paint job, coamings, etc. My considered opinion -- at the moment, and always subject to change, of course -- is that the hull and cabin will will marry better when it's done. If not, I'll change things; that's why I'm building a model.

But nothing I do is going to squeeze that cabin down to where it would be on a deeper boat; past a certain point I think it's just as well to remind myself that it's a sharpie, not a pilot boat.

The cabin already takes up ten feet, on a hull that's less than 29 feet in length overall, and the foredeck is already scanty. I think extending the cabin would unbalance the proportions, and make the boat look nose-heavy.

Thanks for your comments, though. I don't mind a chance to step back and look at the project through someone else's eyes occasionally.

 

I just saw that I missed page 22 and 23 or so where there was a discussion about headroom. Sorry to warm it up again. I agree that 4 feet are enough for a sharpie in this size. Sitting headroom is essential! My feeling is that you should not try to repair proportions with details (paintjob toerails).

Do you make papersketches of alternatives before you work on the model?

Grrreetings from the North Sea Coast, Michel

 

just a thought but if you include a number of horizontal lines into the trim details of the deck house you can "make" it look smaller than it really is. By the same token you could "make" it look taller by including a number of vertical lines in the trim detail.

Thing is you can hide a world of sins behind a few illusions. Kinda like make up on a model, angle of photograph, little air brushing and just about any dog can look like a darling

my two cents
B

I'd fake the roof to look thicker at the overhang, makes the height of the cabin side seem lower and then divide the cabin wall space with a horizontal trim board of flat panel type details

 

One comment: in the picture we are looking at it from a helicopter's viewpoint. That won't happen often in the real world.

 

It isn't a matter of "repairing" proportions with details; it's a matter of visualizing what the cabin will look like in context, as it were, when the boat is done. Even the profile of the forward hatch will affect the perceived height of the cabin top.

To tell the truth, I'll defend the proportions as they are; I think it's going to look pretty good. And I'm not a complete novice when it comes to principles of design. I spent several years designing and/or building sets for plays, TV commercials and low-budget films before I moved on to residential construction. Afterwords as a general contractor, I drew most of my own plans for everything from houses to custom kitchen cabinetry and furniture.

Although that might not translate directly into boat design, I think I have a reasonably good eye when it comes to working with volumes, empty spaces and lines.

Be patient, and see what the model looks like when I get done. Of course, it certainly isn't going to be as sleek and graceful as it would be if built it as a day sailor, with an open cockpit and no cabin at all. if I had the time, I'd design and build two versions on the same basic hull: one as an over-canvased, open-cockpit thrill buggy for day sailing and showing off in, and another as my weekend cruiser and sleep-aboard. But I'm pushing 61 years old. I think I better deal with one boat at a time....

No, I've done nothing at all on paper for this particular boat; I'm 'sketching' directly in wood. Not that I couldn't be drawing, of course. I'm a reasonably proficient draftsman. As a matter of fact, I did draw out the model of the Egret take-off shown earlier in this thread. But I no longer have a drafting table set up, and I'm designing this boat to a different philosophy anyway: instead of imposing my will on the material, I'm letting the wood tell me what it will and won't tolerate.

It's the difference between drawing a line with a set of french curves and trying to make it look right, versus bending a fairing batten and seeing what line it comes up with.

 

You're right of course, Boston. How it's trimmed out will make or break this boat.

 

To visualize that here an example of a completed 1:10 model of a 20er Jollenkreuzer.

BTW, this is a model of Einsteins boat. (L 7.00m, B 2.35m, D 0.33m / 1.25m)








See this ad (= print version) for pics of a 20er Jollenkreuzer. Save the pics if you like them, the ad won't last!

Good Luck!
Angel

 

Thanks for the pic's, Angel; it's a fascinating boat. And thanks for pointing out the double post too; I've deleted the unedited version.

 

Yes, of course you should defend your work. It's your project and your Eye's have to be pleased with the result (as well as it were your back and knees that would be hurt if your cabin is to low!). Your thread and comments show that you know what you are doing!

I just wanted to be helpful because I solved the problem (to please my eye!) on my 26 footer with raising the deck only 2 inches and lowering the cabin the same 2 inches. It became visible for me, as I drew the sail plan, which has no underwater lines.
But I'am in the second round of the design spiral in paper stage now and modeling will not be before next fall. As designing is my hobby, spring and summer ist for sailing, not for the drawing desk!

Grrreetings from the North Sea Coast, Michel

 

raised freeboard

This Mystic Sharpie has her freeboard raised by 2" and keeping the cabin hight the same. She looks like a box compared to the original. See the build journal for the motivation. I didn't reread it, but far as I remember he forgot to mention the additional windage of the hull as one of the disadvantages. Nice journal, though! We've to thank him for that..!!





For comparison, the one below is build as per plans.









This Mystic was for sale in the Netherlands ca. 2 years ago. She is pro built in the UK in 1985 and it looks like she is the blue and white Mystic that is on Brewer's website. The sale page is still available though not for 100%, but the links on the left site of the page and thumbs to the many pictures are still functional.

Good Luck!
Angel

PS - I posted those links (not the pics) before in post #84

 

The green boat definitely looks boxier. Of course, part of that might be the paint job.

I'm not sure when Brewer designed the Mystic sharpies. Given that the one above is actually named "Mystic,' is there any chance it was the prototype? Or was someone just singularly unimaginative about naming boats?

I was leaning towards naming mine the Cantoo Canoe (I think I explained why earlier in this thread). But I may go with "Egress" instead. Does anyone else remember the story about Barnum putting up "This way to the Egress!" signs, to move the crowds through his exhibits faster?

 

You did explain it in this thread post #1.

Cheers!
Angel