Yacht survey programs

Discussion in 'Education' started by Boa-Tr, Nov 19, 2011.

  1. Boa-Tr
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    Boa-Tr Junior Member

    Does anyone know any e-learning programs for yacht surveying? Is it possible if you can share us your views about this. If you search you can find some programs, but views are sometimes more important than what they say about themselves.
     
  2. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    What is your level of kowledge? There are online or mail courses that assume you are an expert on boats and only need to learn surveying.
     
  3. DavidJ
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    DavidJ Senior Member

  4. Boa-Tr
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    Boa-Tr Junior Member

    Hi Gonzo, That is exactly what I need. I have more than 8 years of experience in design business, I'm a naval architect. Actually I need to give more specific details. I narrowed my search to 3 distance learning programs. One of them is as DavidJ says Lloyds marine surveyor diploma. The other one is MPI group yacht & small craft diploma and the last one is IIMS (International institute of marine surveyors) I think the syllabus fits to my knowledge is http://www.mpigroup.co.uk/education...ying/mta-yacht-small-craft-surveying-diploma/

    To be honest my problem is that I need to find someone who has taken the mpigroup's diploma. I don't know if they really exist. They have a website, yes. They didn't do anything to make me feel in doubt, I tried to reach people on their reference list, but no one replied.

    At first I didn't give these details because I don't want to direct people to a result. I want people to add here what they know. Maybe they know a course with a different syllabus. Maybe it fits better to what I have in my mind.
     
  5. rxcomposite
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    rxcomposite Senior Member

    The choice of school depends on the job you want to pursue. Do you want to be a class surveyor, independent marine surveyor, or a surveyor specializing only on "small" private yachts. There is a big difference but what is common is it is not an 8 to 5 job but rather a 24/7 job, plenty of odd hours and travel. Ships come and go anytime and don't wait for surveyors. Notice to survey sometimes are given in half hour or less.
     
  6. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    If You are naval architect, why need all those courses? By definition, naval architect can do the survey.
     
  7. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    I agree with Alik. Unless you need some kind of certification, the courses won't give you much more credibility. Accident and Fraud investigation, is a branch of surveying that is interesting. I've had a lot of fun figuring out how and when damage was caused.
     
  8. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    There is opposite problem: often yacht surveyors do not have any engineering degree, but clam they can carry engineering survey and evaluate design solutions.

    I would not consider any engineering survey provided not by engineer/naval architect.
     
  9. Boa-Tr
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    Boa-Tr Junior Member

    Yes being a naval architect is enough for doing many things, but you need some experience and knowledge to be on the decision making side. I mean when a naval architect graduates (Just like any other business in the world) he/she has the knowledge of how to design a boat, but either way NA needs some experience, because designing a boat contains too much knowledge. It is not something that can be understood in just lectures. I'm not even talking about the differences between a tug boat, a container vessel, a small sailing yacht and an oil rig platform. Those are all naval structures, but needs different approaches and different experiences to understand the design and production. On the other hand what I'm trying to say is it is similar to design business. Surveying needs experience just like designing, and I see these kind of courses as good supplies of zipped experience. They force you to study! and read.
    I also agree that being an engineer is a plus and sometimes a must. I see myself more close to yacht surveying.
     
  10. rxcomposite
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    rxcomposite Senior Member

    Yacht Surveying

    Boa,

    Attached literatures from IMP, IIMS, and LR. Hope that helps.

    I work for a group as a third party marine surveyors. The group is comprised of Marine Engineers, Naval Architects, Ship Masters, and Engineers. They say LR course is good but expensive. Most of them took the IIMP course to enhance their learning.

    If your heart is set on Yacht Surveying, suggest you PM Eric Sponberg, a member of this forum. I beleive he has some insight into the topic of private yacht surveying as he has stood as "expert witness", a job top class Marine surveyors get. Of course, this is not to undermine Alik and Gonzo as they belong to another specialized group.

    Good luck!
     

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  11. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    But it allows them to claim they are 'Lloyds marine surveyor' or 'Lloyds certified marine surveyor'. This works for customer... unless someone wants to dig in and find what Lloyd's Marine Academy is.

    I met few guys claiming they are Lloyds' surveyors, but this is false statement!
     
  12. rxcomposite
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    rxcomposite Senior Member

    Quite agree Alik. Unless they are Lloyd's(or ABS, or DNV) Class surveyor, that is a misrepresentaion.

    There are four type of surveyors I know of;

    Class surveyors- trained and in house surveyors of LR, BV, ABS, Ect.

    Independent or free lance surveyors who received their diploma from some of the training institutions, accredited or working with an accredited group.

    Private Yachts and Small crafts surveyors- the new breed of surveyors specializing on private and small crafts.

    Government Surveyors- Those working and implementing the local maritime rules and safety. Yes, they are also called surveyors but working as an office job.


    There are also Class 1 and Class 2 surveyors depending on the degree of training or experience.
     
  13. rxcomposite
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    rxcomposite Senior Member

    I got curious and took out one of the learning modules in my library. The front page shows the LR logo and underneath it is "Marine Training Services".

    The contents of the module is much you would see in an LR design rules but with emphasis on construction and repair, and what to look for. On the opening page, it says "Compliance with Class Rules and regulations must be maintained if the ships class status is not to be affected"... Reading further, it did not refer to a specific LR rule.

    I can only conclude that the diploma does not grant you a class surveyor's certificate (LR in this case) but rather imply that the school that teaches it is a reputable one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2011
  14. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    Yes, but for small craft surveying it is less reputable :)

    Those boat surveyors put a lot of nonsense on their websites, then our customers say 'he is Lloyds' surveyor!'... but those are just crooks.

    Saying that, I respect professionals with or without engineering degree, who know their limits and do not over-advertise their capabilities.
     

  15. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    In the US small craft surveyors are not a "new breed", they have been around many decades. Small craft surveyors inspect small boats for prospective purchasers, owners and insurance companies. Many if not most do not get involved with class certification.

    I have two friends who are small craft surveyors. One has worked with small craft for 60 years or so, the other did repairs and took a number of short courses. Neither is a college graduate.
     
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