Wittholz Departure

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by MikeJohns, Nov 11, 2010.

  1. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Dank U voor de informatie...que vous pour l'information.

    I was hoping Frank had some more info on the metal versions. I found the info you posted as well. (But who'd build in wood, you just clonk your head on the deck beams. ;)

    tot ziens
     
  2. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Duckworks mentions a steel version,* but for plans they link to the same WoodenBoat plans. (* scroll down to 35')
    Here's a blog about a steel Departure, ugly picture but no specs.

    Maybe Frank has some more . . ?

    Cheers!
    Angel
     
  3. frank smith
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    frank smith Senior Member

    Sorry dont have any specs on steel other than that I remember the steel version
    was wider and about 800 lb heavier. The last time I checked was about 30 years ago.
     
  4. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    Departuresteel01sm.jpg

    This is the early steel version of the Departure 35.....

    Charles W. Wittholz studied naval architecture at U of Michigan, then night school at MIT, first apprenticed to John Alden for two years, then moved to the Rhodes office for 8 years (duration of WWII). We talked on the phone a few times.....hell of nice guy to talk with.......
     
  5. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    Departuresteel02sm.jpg

    And this is the later steel Departure 35 with outboard rudder, this was done for stock builder Mooney Marine Inc in Deltaville Virginia.....LOA 35'0", LWL 27'10", Beam 11'0", Draft 5'0", Displacement 16,480 pounds, Ballast 5500 lbs, 586 sq ft sail.
     
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  6. troy2000
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    troy2000 Senior Member

    I'm constantly amazed at the collective amount of information and knowledge displayed on this forum. I'll bet if I posted questions about the rowboat Washington crossed the Delaware in, someone would give me the lines, the name of the builder, and useful construction details...
     
  7. frank smith
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    frank smith Senior Member

    The builder was Earl Chubb ,
     
  8. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member


    Tad
    That's the boat in your last post. If it was a production boat that would explain why there's no lines plans or offsets in any of the drawings people have.

    It's all very helpful. Thanks.
     
  9. mskinner
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    mskinner Junior Member

    Wittholz Steel Departure

    I just found this forum for the first time recently. I realize the postings might be stale but if anyone is still interested in the Wittholz Departure I can offer help. I built a steel 35' Departure back in the late 70's-early 80's in Deltaville, VA and met Charlie a number of times. He redesigned the hull for the Mooney Brothers so they could produce round hulls, as opposed to the hard chine original drawings. The boat was first designed for a Colorado man as a one-off hull with steel hull, and ply decks and cabin. The community in Delataville and the surrounding area was experiencing a profound renaissance of boatbuilding and included Tom Colvin and other name designers. It was the end of a great era of local wooden boat building centered on the hardchine work boats and "buyboats" of the Chesapeake Bay. I worked for a number of yards at that time and there is now a wonderful museum dedicated to the craft and people who established the building trade there.

    I still have my uncompleted hull in a barn in Urbanna, VA. It is a "monocoque," or all steel hull, decks and cabin also redesigned by Wittholz to accommodate me and my builder buddy who wanted an all steel design.

    I have my original drawings sets, including the additional drawings adding steel decks and cabin, new scantlings and estimates for ballasting. Wittholz always included options for ketch, sloop and cutter rigs--mine was to be a cutter-rigged while my partner built his for a wishbone-type, which was fairly revolutionary at that point in time and just becoming popular.

    I sandblasted my mild steel hull and hot-zinc sprayed it overall and then began applying epoxy fillers to fair the hull (West System epoxies and microballoons) and some hull paint undercoatings. The interior was blasted and then coated with urethane epoxy insulation throughout.

    Charlie came down occasionally to visit us and Tim and Paul Mooney. They also produced a 42' Departure. Their hulls were quite lovely "in the round" and they did very high quality work. They folded their business in the mid-80's and returned to Michigan. I stored my hull with the notion I would get back to it one day but it still sits unfinished and neglected in a slowly collapsing barn...
    Back in the late
     
  10. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Thanks for your post and welcome to the forum. Which one of the drawings posted already matches your hull?


    The design work on my part is in limbo at the moment, the owner is trying to obtain the plans through someone who knows Charlies widow.

    For general interest a photograph or two of your hull and the slowly collapsing barn would be great to post here it sounds wonderfully evocative. you might need to email them to me and I'll put them up, I'm not sure if you can post attachments as a new entity.

    Would you like to find a new home for the hull and see it finished by someone?

    You can email me at mikejohnseng@yahoo.com
     
  11. mskinner
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    mskinner Junior Member

    Wittholz 35', cont.

    Mike:

    My Departure is really the Mooney Bros. drawings, which were never done exclusively for them, until they redrew for a 42' boat and the rounded hull. Charlie did some drawings for the 42' hull but the Mooneys engineered the frames and steel themselves--a steel supplier bent the plating to their specs. Charlie's original departure had the hard chine but had us hand-forming the first two and last two steel frames to a light curve so that the plating looked curved just out of the water. It was a clever visual trick that softened the look somewhat. The Mooneys went all the way and fully rounded the steel hull.

    I attached some pics of my hull as is. The "barn" was a large boatshed used for a 50' steel hull built by a friend who passed a few years ago--he let me move my boat in for storage after completing and launching his own. A "microburst" storm toppled some trees onto a portion of the barn and so I have to move it off the property some time soon. I would love to one day finish it myself but that probably isn't going to happen, so I would to sell the hull and see someone finish it. There are custom stainless water tanks the Mooneys built for me and some marine ply, Carolina white cedar and local hardwoods stored with it. Plus more ballast lead ( the hollow keel box is filled with lead and fixed with concrete) to trim once launched. I cast all the lead during construction. A bunch of us bought gear together whenever deals came up and we could pool our buying power, so I have an assortment of stuff stored, including anchors, windlass, stove and heater, winches and a compass with compensators specially designed for steel hulls.

    Why would you need to redraw the keel--to deepen it? Are your clients redesigning the rig? Or is this an attempt to make it a faster hull? The Departure is really a cruising-type boat and fairly sluggish. I intended mine as an around-the-world cruising cutter and was not too concerned about speed overall.
     
  12. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Thanks for that, unfortunately your pictures didn't attach. I've sent you an email from this system.
     
  13. mskinner
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    mskinner Junior Member

    Drawings, etc.

    Mike:

    Sorry about the pics. I will resend them to you via the two addresses you gave me and see if that works.

    My hull draws 4' 3". and I have complete sets of drawings w/lines and offsets. Most are in good shape (I bought two sets of blueprints because my first set got beaten up during lofting and construction).

    I did not realize Charlie's wife is still alive or that she has control of his plans. I once wrote to his old address without success or any messages regarding his archive. I know some things were given to Mystic Seaport.

    As I mentioned to you, I have the drawing sets that Charlie sent me when I purchased them and they include details for both cutter and ketch, including a sail plan for a sloop-rigged option. The ketch draws 5'. I think the Mooneys built to 5'.
     
  14. mskinner
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    mskinner Junior Member

    clarity on previous message

    Just to clarify my first message:

    Charlie redrew the steel cutter to include steel deck and trunk cabin for James Moore, who lived in the Norfolk area and visited with us during the years we were working in Deltaville, VA--we collaborated on construction details and offered him help where we could. Charlie did some new drawings for me , my partner and the Mooneys to roof the cabin in steel. He gave us new ballast estimates and specified the steel gauges and cabin beams for the new work. Obviously, weight becomes critical with the additional steel. He wasn't really crazy about doing it this way and I believe he preferred the lighter plywood construction but he offered the new drawings and seemed pleased with the results once we turned out our hulls.
     

  15. MikeJohns
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Here are some of the pictures thanks to Michael.

    This has been built with care, shame it didn't get past this stage but a great start for someone else.


    I'm not sure you are fully ready to sell this project :) but If anyone is interested in carrying on with the project it has an assortment of gear .
     

    Attached Files:

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