Wide Viking Boat

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Michael Robert, May 14, 2020.

  1. Michael Robert
    Joined: May 2020
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    Michael Robert New Member

    I'm building a 5-6 person fishing boat that I'd like to imitate an old viking boat. I'd like to combine the two designs to make an extra wide fishingboat/faering. I'm drawing plans to have is 18 feet long from end to end and 6 foot 6 inch wide beam. I'm thinking it'll look like someone sawed the backs off 2 wooden dinghies and attached them together back to back.

    For all those boat design experts out there, is 6.5 feet too wide for an 18 foot long faering? It's my first time building a boat and I know that wider boats are more forgiving when it comes to balance, also the weight distribution of a wider boat seems more solid and steady to me and I like that. I assume narrow sterns decrease drag and controlability while wider sterns increase drag and controlability, so does having a wide beamed faering make sense? Will the large width of the middle counter act the thin stern? Will I end up having a boat that goes where ever it wants when there's any small current?

    I'm thinking standard lumber frame(I have so much I need to use up), marine plywood hull (possibly fiberglassed over), and a resin finish. Can I use long strips of 6 inch wide plywood for the hull, or must they be solid planks. And what's the difference between making them flush with each other or overlapping them? Once again, I'm new to boat building so all criticism is helpful.

    I'd love feedback I primarily row 12' ocean surfboats 4' wide beam 3' stern. That's what I'm use to and I'm not really sure how other boats work. I posted some inspiration pictures below. I haven't finished my plans yet.

    New Edit:
    After reading some of the book recommended by bajansailor I think I'm leaning towards a clinker build. It might not be as smooth, but I think it makes more sense for my level of boat building. In the book the author talks about using screws as well as glue for thicker plywood. I'm contemplating this because I feel that a 17-18 foot long vessel needs more reinforcement than just glue.

    I sketched two scenarios below, one of clinker pattern and one of screw patterns:
    In the left side of the boat (1) has a normal overlap, and the right side (2) has an upside down overlap. Both showed up in examples of the book, but I'm not finding anything taking about this. What's the difference between the two and Why would you have the upside down one? Isn't the original direction (1) more traditional? It looks like it makes more sense too.

    In the second scenario there are a bunch of screw options. In (1) the screw connects the plywood sheet to the solid wood frame. In (2) the screw connects two sheets of plywood together without touching the frame. In (3) The screw simultaneously connects all three pieces. All of these examples were shown in the but which are most useful? I'm thinking a combination of (1) and (3) up the ribs , with (4) in between ribs. Is that overkill?

    Thanks Guys!!!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: May 15, 2020
  2. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    I've always wanted to make a quick and dirty faux Viking boat/big canoe/longboat by joining two aluminum runabouts at the stern (gotta use boats that are 90 deg at the gunnel-transom, then figure out a cute way to connect them taking into account the neg sloped transomes . It wouldn't be the most svelte version of whatever boat it was imitating, but at its low speed that wouldn't be too much of drawback, but it would be durable and with much pre-engineered built in safety.

    The idea would be, if worse comes to worse, you'd still have two usable nice little runabouts, rather than Another Big Weird Project Gone Wrong for the landfill.
     
  3. bajansailor
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    bajansailor Marine Surveyor

    Welcome to the Forum Michael.
    In case you have not heard of Iain Oughtred before, may I commend his website to you - http://www.oughtredboats.com/
    He has designed various faerings - click on the catalogue, and in the index on the far right are mentioned three different faerings for which plans are available.

    Edit - here is a direct link -
    Oughtred Boats : plans kits building sailing rigging & lots of boat stuff : Iain Oughtred Designs http://straydogboatworks.com/oughtred/mainpages/norwegianhardangerfaering.html
    Edit again - I see that you have attached a plan for Elfyn - 16'6" x 4'9", so she is a bit smaller than what you are thinking of.
    But you could perhaps use his designs for guidance re your design?

    Iain has also written a clinker plywood boatbuilding manual, which is very well regarded. A book like this would help to answer questions such as the merits of lapstrake / clinker vs carvel construction.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2020
  4. Michael Robert
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    Michael Robert New Member

    Sounds like fun :) I was thinking of modifying an aluminum boat, but I'd love to use up my leftover lumber, and I've been woodworking ever since I can remember. Maybe a future project though :)
     
  5. Michael Robert
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    Michael Robert New Member

    I stumbled into his sight before and saved the picture, but that was last year and couldn't find it again, so thanks!!! haha
    And I'll give the clinker manual a look, It's exactly what I need!
     
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  6. kapnD
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    kapnD Senior Member

    I like it!
    You could hinge the two to fold together at the top of the transom for easy transport on one trailer.
    I think you’d have to rebuild the transoms to plumb, or build a removable filler, perhaps held in place with the bolts or pins that hold the halves together.
     
  7. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    Concept occurred to at some Sierra Mtns, CA State Park lake where they rented little aluminum boats with little nasty two-stoke outboards for fishing. You'd see a dozen little boats all sputtering along at "trolling speed" with a couple guys fishing. Looked miserable to me. If I'm out on a mountain lake fishing last thing I'd want to do is hear (and smell) a nasty little two stroke for hours on end!

    Seeing how even on a mostly calm day, tiny boats with two men on a big lake were also rocking quite a bit, it seemed like doubling the size of boats by joining would be a neat trick.

    Little cheap older alum runabouts are more likely to have 90 deg gunnel/transom (so at least its not awkwardly wasp-waisted for no reason). They also nest, at least as much as their bench seats allow.

    Haven't yet come up with niffy way to join two such boats, and also leave them intact to return to original useful condition.

    SOR:

    1) cheap and easy
    2) allows boats to return to original config
    3) fairly streamlined, as boats will most likely be now human powered
    4) looks ok, figure whole "new" boat might be repainted to appear more "organic".
    5) sturdy, plan on it being abused and over-stressed, like any resort rental equipment.
    6) I guess there needs to be provision for canoe style asymmetric side mounted outboard bracket. Extended-middle between the transoms OB motor is an idea, but thats getting into more stuff.

    Generally, the idea is to create, without spending thousands or tens of thousands, an 18-28' big canoe/longboat that is maintenance free, stable, safe and durable for lots of casual/first time users to go paddling or rowing in a "primitive" boat and LARP as Vikings, Indians, explorers, etc.

    I'm thinking the main connection is going to be two straight beams attached to the gunnels at least 2' on each side, because that would handle the weight of 800lbs of humans moving and concentrating their weights while waves try to bend the hulls.
    These boats are durable, but also pretty light and not engineered for taking that sort of stress only on the transom. Most of these boats have no external keel to attach to, and I'd like to stay away from adding new stress to anything below the water line.
     
  8. bajansailor
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    bajansailor Marine Surveyor

  9. clmanges
    Joined: Jul 2008
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    clmanges Senior Member

    I thought I recalled seeing 'faering' on CLC's site ... see here:

    Chesapeake Light Craft » clcboats.com Site Search » Chesapeake Light Craft | Boat Plans, Boat Kits, Boatbuilding Supplies, Boat Kit, Kayak Kit, Canoe Kit, Sailboat Kit https://www.clcboats.com/sitesearchgoogle.html?q=faering

    You're not going to get five or six people in that, but they're only about five feet wide. The double-ended hull makes for low carrying capacity. Of course, you want it without the cabin, but I don't think that would make much difference. Might be inspirational, though.
     
  10. gonzo
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    gonzo Senior Member

    Considering your level of experience, buy or get a set of proven plans and stick to the dimensions. It will result in a better boat. Also, you won't have to spend years learning boat design; just get on with the building. A common mistake by amateurs is to mix and match designs and building techniques. Traditional Viking boats have very particular construction techniques. They did not have saws and everything was split or carved. I suggest you find a modern version made to use plywood and sawn lumber.
     
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  11. Waterwitch
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    Waterwitch Junior Member

    Although a bigger boat than what you are looking for, you might take a look at Shetland Island sixerns for inspiration. They are a wide viking boat in origin, meant for a crew of 6, rowing single oars for offshore fishing. There are printed plans available but it is a big clinker traditional project to take on.
     
  12. Michael Robert
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    Michael Robert New Member

    Could I get links to where to get those plans? And also the names and credibility of the designers? Thanks!!!
     
  13. bajansailor
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    bajansailor Marine Surveyor

    If you type 'Shetland sixareen' into Google you should get a lot of interesting links coming up.

    Have a look also at Iain Oughtred's 'Double ended beachboats' on his site http://www.oughtredboats.com/
     
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  14. Waterwitch
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Waterwitch Junior Member

    You are wise to research the plans before undertaking a build. The sixareen which seems to be the preferred spelling, that I have sailed was commissioned by an Outwardbound type school as a youth sail training vessel. So it was the lines taken off of an traditional vessel and gone over and tweaked by a naval architech. The boat was well balanced stable with a modest dipping lug rig. I don't have time right now to track down the particulars of that boat right now.But you have piqued my curiosity to do so. If you have done a google search as suggested you will find some resources for further research. If you ask on the woodenboat forum there is an active participant on the forum from that part of the world who owns that type of vessel. It is a big commitment to learn traditional boatbuilding, source materials and sailing to safely manage an open boat with a big rig.
     
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  15. bajansailor
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    bajansailor Marine Surveyor

    I just saw that Michael has added this edit to his original post - have a look at this post for the sketch that he added.
    ----------------------
    New Edit:
    After reading some of the book recommended by bajansailor I think I'm leaning towards a clinker build. It might not be as smooth, but I think it makes more sense for my level of boat building. In the book the author talks about using screws as well as glue for thicker plywood. I'm contemplating this because I feel that a 17-18 foot long vessel needs more reinforcement than just glue.

    I sketched two scenarios below, one of clinker pattern and one of screw patterns:
    In the left side of the boat (1) has a normal overlap, and the right side (2) has an upside down overlap. Both showed up in examples of the book, but I'm not finding anything taking about this. What's the difference between the two and Why would you have the upside down one? Isn't the original direction (1) more traditional? It looks like it makes more sense too.

    In the second scenario there are a bunch of screw options. In (1) the screw connects the plywood sheet to the solid wood frame. In (2) the screw connects two sheets of plywood together without touching the frame. In (3) The screw simultaneously connects all three pieces. All of these examples were shown in the but which are most useful? I'm thinking a combination of (1) and (3) up the ribs , with (4) in between ribs. Is that overkill?
    ----------------------
    I do not know much about clinker boatbuilding, but I am sure that others on here can offer opinion re your questions above.
     
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