What floats your boat.

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by tom kane, May 6, 2015.

  1. waikikin
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    Location: Australia

    waikikin Senior Member

    Where is the customer going?
     
  2. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Never mind me, I was being perhaps a little cynical in thinking the customer might have been a literary device !
     
  3. AnthonyW
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Cape Town, South Africa

    AnthonyW Senior Member

    Might I ask would the customer ever cross the road? If so, why?

    If he is a literary device - would he turn over a new page?

    If this bizarre thread ever fell into disuse in the middle of this otherwise interesting and informative forum - and no one noticed - would the other threads laugh?

    On a more serios note, it does strike me as odd that after 22 pages, which stated with rather baffling attempts by intelligent, helpful and educated members to waste time contradicting a website with an astonishingly poor grasp of exceptionally basic junior high school physics, and more recently ended up venturing into trailer load requirements in New Zealand, all surrounding a hypothetical customer who clearly suffers from a variety of memory related issues, and whose concept of spatial perception is so severely impaired that he should probably not be allowed near any form of independant transportation into which he can deliver any form of driver/sailor input, and pertaining to a boat with parameters so poorly defined that it makes a Jackson Pollock painting look like a thesis in geometry.

    After all these pages, all we know about this poor individual is that he has ruled out flat bottomed boats, wants to beach his boat, and probably likes pincoladas, and walks in the rain. Yet this thread goes on.

    I am completely mistified. Such a nice topic. Such a strange thread. So many minutes lost forever.....
     
  4. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    It's only 22 pages, there are websites where similar intelligent, helpful, and educated members attempt to convince people who insist the Apollo moon program was a hoax, of the error of their beliefs, that run to several hundreds pages. And I kid you not, several of the patient helpers have died during it's course, whether or not from the rigors of the impossible task they undertook, in trying to correct the wrong-headedness of these doubters, I don't know.So it is early days ! :D
     
  5. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Thailand

    myark Senior Member

    The reason we never take criticism,
    Is because it's always freely given;
    And if you can't accept it, let pass,
    The opportunity to criticize another;
    For while your two cents worth
    Might have great value to some,
    The one for whom it's directed
    Might appraise your opinion
    At exactly two cents.
     
  6. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    Off topic, since the subject is now trailers, but it would be helpful if the customer stated what aquatic conditions will be encountered in operation of this boat. We have muddy, shallow, reed choked shallows on one extreme, but the other has not been stated. Surely not ocean crossing, but is offshore use expected?

    The hull design might already be done and readily available, at least in this country, in the American design called a bay or flats boat. A very shallow v, as vaguely described in post 160 and 228. Post 277 also seems suitable for large portions of this thread. Of course the hull design might depend on what is used to build the hull, ie wood, metal, fiberglass, rotomolded plastic etc, but for now the material to be used is a mystery or maybe more a guarded trade secret.

    Back on topic,
    Does that mean the problem is solved? Can the customer show us what that trailer looks like?

    The more input and information the customer gives, the faster the whole process moves along. That might be helpful, as the whole venture of designing and manufacturing a boat, trailer and drive system for world distribution, building up all the manufacturing, sales and distribution sites, the network of dealers and repair mechanics...bankers, lawyers, accountants, insurers, blah blah, it seems endless, maybe some kind of general adviser or spiritual guru (that's a joke) and capturing a market share from amongst untold numbers of competitors with as many or more resources as the customer's, will take time. Decades I would think.

    Perhaps though, the customer is just looking for ideas, and will weed out the good from the bad behind closed doors, keeping the product under wraps as long as possible so as to get the jump on competitors and capture market share in the beginning and hold it through name recognition. Memo: put ad agencys on above list. And market consultants.

    Personally though, I'd shelve the trailer development until it's known what will actually be put on the trailer, which I alluded to in the "cart before the horse" remark earlier.

    The customer wants a boat similar in design to the boat in post 6. Similar as to what? A small cabin? High sides? An old timey look?

    Does the customer think one design can be expanded or shrunk in size on a ratio basis without changing the shape? Does he think he can just double or halve the size of everything and the boat will handle the same, only requiring more or less horsepower? I've heard that it doesn't work that way all the time.

    If research for a project continually generates more questions than it answers, how can it ever be end?



    .
     
  7. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    The customer is going by boat and doing well.
     
  8. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    As no one is prepared to recommend a bottom shape for this project and any better trailer design we should take an exciting step forward to the superstructure and sleeping accommodation.
    The customer wants dry sleeping for two and easy access to the quarter deck through a forward hatch so it is possible to set and retrieve the anchor without leaving the nice warm cabin. The reason for this is that changing anchorage at all hours to suit the tides is necessary and of course much safer and more comfortable.
    Another "must" is easy access to and from the accommodation when the boat is aground,on the water or trailer in camping grounds, with out clambering over high sides.
    No walk ways around the cabin to add to safety,so cabin will extend the full width of beam and must be leak proof construction.

    Go.
     
  9. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    Tom you have described the bateau boats hb 18. Have a look at the accommodation layout on their website.
     
  10. waikikin
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    Location: Australia

    waikikin Senior Member

  11. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    Great boat that Garvey 17 whitepointer, with comfy accommodation to make friends and family safe and warm an added bonus great minds think alike.

    The is nothing worse than taking friends or family boating and scaring or making their lives miserable to put them of such boating fun in shallow water places.
     
  12. motorbike
    Joined: Mar 2011
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    Location: Beam Reach

    motorbike Senior Member

    After 22 pages Elvis has left the building
     
  13. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Thailand

    myark Senior Member

    I know the customer does not want a flat bottom shape boat, how ever I recommend he do so as a flat bottom boat design suits all his requirements in shallow water, also recommend to ditch the trailer all together and plug the low maintenance titanium rubber torsion suspension with 10" tyres plugging into the hulls which cuts weight down for towing regulations, also saving cost and making the boat manhandle ashore which the boat would float in about than 2" of water.
    I know customer is wanting to make a proto type from wood but it takes one week to make from aluminium for example 2.m wide sheets are available so no joins, and length 8.m to 6.m that can have the sides pressed in no time which I use a 6.m press that would take less than one hour to do so, also cut the stringers and cross members from the sheets that would take less than one hour.

    Having an inboard takes up space and would also recommend an out board motor that is easy to remove with a your pivotal drive lifting system or something similar attached to the outboard bracket for shallow water propulsion .

    Because the boat now uses shallow draft it needs less HP because the hull is practically sitting on top of the water, a slight lift shape in front and back bottom rocks the boat back underneath bottom level with water surface when accelerated to skip along surface with little friction..

    Because the customer wants the comforts of home in a small living area then a small 10' camper could be placed on top that would be far more comfortable than the cabin boat, also isolated from petrol fumes and has torsions to make the camper a smooth ride on water if choppy.

    The small camper can be towed on top of the boat on road legally and when take the caravan of the boat can be used as trailer for land uses like the customers wants.

    This also allows the camper to be landed and taken of onto a remote river bank, island or lake edge so water skiing is better speed performance and making it safer in rough water conditions if sleeping over night.

    The camper would have all the luxuries such as water supply, toilets shower kitchen for cooking and beds and dinning table.

    The boat that is also a land trailer would have fold down sides so when camper is on top the sides simply fold out to give the extra walking space around the camper, also the sides can removed to allow a flat deck trailer on land or a jetty on water while camper is on a paradise beach front.

    This way the customer can own a car trailer, cabin Boat, and a camper for land all in one.

    The camper does not have to be on wheels, it could be like the removable stag camper and ute pictures for sale at 6500 NZD = $4752

    USD.http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/caravans-motorhomes/motorhomes/up-to-5-metres/auction-865923950.htm

    The owner states "The camper has 4 hydraulic jacks, one on each corner of the unit that are used to jack the camper off the ute. We rarely take it off, but do occasionally when we need to use the ute as a ute. It is not to much of a drama taking about 10 minutes. "
     

    Attached Files:

  14. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    Now there is some interesting suggestions.
    Just taking the example of outboard propulsion that has already been suggested by the customer and the hull will be designed to have the choice of inboard or outboard.
     

  15. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Thailand

    myark Senior Member

    This is an example of a 60hp out board that I built a very simple removable frame in the back yard that took minutes to remove the outboard and remotes with two people man handling it or one person sliding onto a small trailers deck.

    This was done so if a RV caravan on board you could see in the front for steering.
     

    Attached Files:

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