What floats your boat.

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by tom kane, May 6, 2015.

  1. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    This happens every time myark joins in and turns the thread into his personal promotion platform.
     
  2. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    myark Senior Member

    The last 3 post reminds me of the Australian bush flies when I was working on the Karratha Sino iron project.;)
     

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  3. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Ah, the old Austrian bush fly ! Arnie Schwarzenegger never mentioned them !
     
  4. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    starting to lose count of the threads invaded by myark rocket science. Com.nz.
     
  5. Barry
    Joined: Mar 2002
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    Barry Senior Member

    Not sure what they do down under but in North America, it might be unlikely that you can get a set of brakes to fit behind the 10 inch rims that Tom is suggesting for his trailer.
    I think that, for drum brakes anyway, the minimum size of wheel that will allow a rim to fit with a zero offset wheel is either 12 or 13 inch wheels
     
  6. waikikin
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    Location: Australia

    waikikin Senior Member

    The trailer weighs 660kg, it's registered to be 2000kg total on road but built for 3600. I have it for large but light composite objects & also as a frame for laminating table.... so not so heavy, just long because it needs to be.... one sunday I watched Lucille Ball in the long long trailer, sketched it during the ad breaks, bought the steel on the monday........

    Dual axle, leaf slipper springs, electric drum brakes to all wheels, handbrake, breakaway system as well but all very simple. My Son has a small flat top trailer at about 280kg, I'd love it to have a handbrake!

    Jeff
     
  7. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    Location: Thailand

    myark Senior Member

    A trailer that weighs 660kg with out its load naturally would need brakes especially if you could load it up to 3600 kg or even at 2000 kg as how are you going to weigh the load each time to be sure of the adding weight ?

    A trailer at 280 kg would depend on how much a load is placed onto it and depends on what is towing it.

    As you can see in the information I placed about the majority of the USA are about 3000 lbs before brakes are needed so if you sum that up the majority of the USA speaks for it self, and sure if you got the cash to splash for extra parts and weight on a smaller trailer, you can do what you want as in each to your own as long as not breaking the road laws.

    As I mention about the Myark folding trailer barge designs that are built to be light and well within the strict vehicle manufactures requirements for towing, plus you may understand the pontoon structures are actually the trailer and not like a heavy trailer with a load on it like your 660 kg trailer that can be loaded up to 3600 kg.
     
  8. daiquiri
    Joined: May 2004
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    Location: Italy (Garda Lake) and Croatia (Istria)

    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    Perhaps the title of the thread should be changed into "What stops your trailer".
     
  9. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    Plans for a standard 6x4 utility trailer must be pretty common, or easy enough to figure out. "clear up the trailering options" must mean something, but there's no telling what. Never heard of them or why they have to be cleared up. Are these options something you can't disclose?

    You have the cart before the horse, as 'the trailer must not be wider than the boat', but you won't say how wide the boat is. Actually, why the trailer design has to be rectified before the boat is designed is literally putting the cart before the horse. It makes no sense.

    Since you will almost by necessity have to put the boat on top of the wheel wells, (The trailer must not be wider than the boat.) you might as well make it a box trailer and then you could put a pop-up tent in there and have a pop-up trailer like this. Is that a 'trailering option'?

    How about making it a tilt bed trailer, then you could launch and retrieve without backing into the water too much. Or an extending tongue. That sounds like an option. Or make it from aluminum, another option.

    [​IMG]
     
  10. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    They do have brakes compatible with 10 inch wheels barry. A lot of aussie boat trailers used to be factory fitted with 10 inch wheels to keep the trailer low for launching. even braked tandem trailers. They were horrible to tow on long trips because the small tyres generated so much heat . No one uses them these days because of the high failure rate.
     
  11. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    myark Senior Member

    I understand the boat for the customer is to be made 2.m wide, its a pity the customers other choice is to make the boat from wood.

    Sam suggestions to make the trailer from aluminium is best and his idea to have a tilting system is good if you do not want the wheels axles to go into the water.

    The trailer could have a sliding mechanism that allowed the tilting part of the trailer to extend further into the water or a fold out tracking system that can winch the boat back onto trailer, keeping axles out of water, especially if wanting to unload the boat on land so the customer can use for a basic car trailer.

    I understand the customer does not want brakes which are not needed, how ever 10" tyres braked are no problems as I have used them on the 10.m X 4.8 meter Myark folding trailer barge that weighed 2000 kg and never had any problems, they have smaller tyres on planes for landing so its obvious they are reliable if you do not buy the cheap versions that are made for very light trailers.
    Heavy duty quality 10" tyres allows very low to the ground if placed on a rubber cord torsion suspension and allows the trailers out side wheels to be the 2.m wide distance the customer wants, especially if there is a slight V in the hull for the tyres to fit under, also because the Torsions suspension set up is very low to the ground this makes launching more viable with out getting the axles wet.

    Most likely an extending system is not needed and a tilting tray will do which would be handy as in any house hold trailer if used for unloading lawn clippings etc.
     
  12. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    Let us (by reading posts properly) see what the customer wants, he gives no fixed measurements or weights, but wants a boat design similar to the image in post #6 for the purposes stated.

    No one has recommended that a flat bottom for this project is best and the customer wisely has ruled a flat bottom out.

    The trailer has brought up interesting information and opinions and is is important to the whole project, and will be decided by the customer when considering the range of boats
    he wants to put on the market.
    All customers want a choice that suits their purpose such as beach and road travel in respect of wheel dimensions,this has to be catered for.

    The construction in wood of the boat (because it is a prototype) makes sense because it can be changed easily at suggestions from people involved in the project working and testing ideas on a full sized model. Standard dressed timber can be used.
     
  13. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
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    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

    The next step, truely, is to provide a lightship displacement at launch and to set some limits on how much weight gets carried onto the boat after it gets launched. You can fiddle the design if the boat breaks down and much of the weight is carried in the trunk of the car, but this is something of a pain. Or you can go the other way and store your vacation kit in the boat while you travel. This has a pretty big impact on the design.

    My assumption is that the trailer looks a lot like a std galvanized C channel boat trailer with torsion suspension and 3 bent cross-members, center rollers, and bunks. The boat would have a slight warped bottom allowing the bunks to take the load as the last 2 feet of strap is winched in. Tilt-bed design. The utility body is an add-on. Estimated weight for the boat might be 800 pounds light ship, with the ability to transport at least 500# of gear inside going down the road. This could be offloaded before launch for difficult launches.

    Frankly, if the trailer width is an issue, I think a plug-in torsion axle option is the way to go. Let the trailer frame be the width of the boat and let the entire wheel, hub and suspension unplug from the frame as an option. These setups are commercially available.

    example - http://www.pacifictrailers.com/Trailer-Buddy-UFP-3750lb-Trailer-Torsion-Axle-rubber-torsion/
     
  14. tom kane
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Hamilton.New Zealand.

    tom kane Senior Member

    We are not building a trailer just for one customer or one size boat, the customer has seen a trailer design he thinks is suitable for multi purpose use for different size boats.

    A campsite owner would want a trailer easy to run on beaches and do other work saving often six monthly or 12 months Warrant of Fitness checks and Relicensing road cost plus any maintenance and space for parking.He can have a choice of wheels.

    Any of the boats put on to a trailer for an outing would need to have on board all the needs for the outing without moving gear at launch,and forgetting something.

    A private owner would want a trailer to suit mostly road transport but still easy to launch and ready by just removing the restraining belt, disconnecting the winch,grabbing the painter and launching no messing about especially at a busy launch ramp.No changing of trailer draw bars or other time consuming tasks.Just let`s go fishing,
     

  15. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
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    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    How is the "customer" going ?
     
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