What Do We Think About Climate Change

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by Pericles, Feb 19, 2008.

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  1. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    it takes 260 lbs of grain to make one tank of gas
    thats enough food to feed a man for a year <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<,,that used to be true when our grain was food,,,,,,,,but our grain isnt food anymore,,,,its fuel,,,,,,they dont grow "food" corn,,,,,,the corn we have now has almost NO value as food,,,its been genetically altered to produce MORE un-eatable corn to humans,,,,,its a "filler" and cattle food, and fuel.,,,,,theres only 1 place that has corn that was here 100 years ago,,,,the REAL food corn,,,,,we've been using corn for everything except for CORN as food for us. so now,,,,for us to "live" off from corn,,,we'll need at least 3 times what it used to take.
     
  2. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    actually they jam corn syrup down our throats cause they have more of it than they will ever know what to do with
    its kinda like fluoride
    they had but loads of it
    they knew it was mildly toxic
    but had nothing else to do with it
    so they stuck it in toothpaste and municipal water systems
    and claimed it was good for teeth
    stuff sure does seem to kill cavities
    but
    same reason it kills cavities means it kill other **** as well
    ever wonder what that other **** is

    corn
    now that is a can of worms I should not have opened
    why is it bee's are dropping like flies
    or in this case like bee's
     
  3. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    the bee problem will kill us before pollutants do,,,,,next year we'll have a bee population that is 60% less then 3 years ago.,,,,,and YES thats not the exact %,,, its something like 64 or so,,,but im not smat nuff to look it up again,,hehe :D;)
     
  4. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    so I would reiterate

    aerobic stratification of the oceans
    you dont need an explanation as to why carbon is rising
    it is
    and it doesn't mater weather it proceeds or follows temp rise by a few hundred years
    they are closely related
    and
    if you calculate the temp vs carbon ratio
    our present temp has some catching up to do if you accept that they are related
    and that does seem to be what’s happening
    but carbon isnt really even the question
    nor is it necessary to believe in the carbon cycle

    why will aerobic stratification occur
    for whatever reason
    ( personally I think we have a lot to do with it )
    the ice is melting
    fast
    really fast
    that rapid influx of fresh water into the marine environment overwhelms the oceans ability to mix the additional water
    and the currents slow
    eventually fragmenting
    end of little Billy's soccer game

    fishing the oceans to extinction
    it wont be next year
    or in ten years
    its today
    95/100 fish over 12 inches long are gone from the sea
    we ate them
    enter the theories of of Darwin's debt and trophic cascade
    and the observations that prove them true
    those fish species we have taken to ecological extinction are not likely to be back any time soon
    name one fishery that has ever come back from commercial extinction
    oh you may get some small recovery in some areas
    but overall the niches once inhabited are gone
    down to the bottom of the chain
    trophic cascade

    polluting the oceans to extinction
    in 1999 visible plastic in the ocean outweighed plankton by 6/1
    in 2002 the number had risen to 10/1

    what do you suppose it might be today
    ( oh and visible plastic only makes up about 15% of the plastic load in the sea )
    ( the rest has turned into a snow shower of molecular plastic )
    what happens if you dump 60,000,000,000 tons of plastic into the ocean
    once it photo-degrades into its more indestructible constituent components
    it goes into what appears to be a relatively permanent cycle of accidental ingestion
    the digestive process does not break down the plastic
    but plastic is a great bio toxin accumulator
    and the toxins do get released by the digestive process
    so not only do the animals dependant on plankton starve due to accidental ingestion
    but they become so contaminated they in turn are not safe to eat by the next guy in the food chain
    course the next guy doesnt know that
    and down the hatch it goes
    in the end
    polar bears and killer whales today would qualify for burial in an epa approved barrel
    penguins arent far behind

    enter the rise of the microbial sea
    in the gulf of mexico alone
    twenty or so years ago
    150 million or so green sea turtles once ate 500 billion or so pounds of turtle grass annually
    and thats just counting the adults
    what do you think happens when you choke the turtles out of existence with plastic bags indiscriminately dumped into the sea
    aside from a tragic loss you end up with a but load of turtle grass
    10.000.000.000.000 or so pounds of rotting grass in the gulf alone
    what happens to that now overgrown turtle grass
    it becomes diseased
    virus and bacteria thrive on the biological leak from the turtle grass
    and the jelly fish population explodes
    now free from the predation of the turtles
    who ate the plastic bags thinking they were a jellyfish sandwich
    its not a pretty picture
    but thats just one small scenario that has already happened
    the jellyfish now own the niche that the turtles once did
    except that the system is unstable as eventually the turtle grass will rot itself out of existence

    enter anaerobic decline
    you dont even need to have a stratification event to have an anaerobic cascade
    but the global anaerobic event
    has happened twice before
    look at all the black slates throughout the world
    the geologic record tells that tale loud and clear


    give it twenty years
    maybe ten
    and we are going to make a lovely black slate ourselves
    with little plastic inclusions
    that Im sure some one will find quite attractive
    on the space ship bath room floor
     
  5. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    well Jimbo
    I found this and couldn't resist
    its just seldom I ever actually meet any one with these attitudes any more


    Quote:
    By most accounts CO2 in the atmosphere takes on the order of 200 years to equilibrate with the surface ocean. Hence the pH drop we've been recording is just the proverbial tip of the dry-iceberg.

    ( Jimbo says )
    Inaccurate. The science on this subject WAS well established that co2 had a very short life in the atmosphere. The idea that it is much longer came along AFTER the AGW alarmism took on political legs and when the lab toys we call "Global Climate Models" could not produce sufficiently scary predictions with the established science, so the postulated new 'science' of 200 year old CO2. Evidence for this: NON-EXISTANT.

    Quote:
    Those hundreds of billions of tonnes of anthropogenic CO2, the bulk of which we've prescribed and put en route in the past 75 years, are slowly dissolving into the surface ocean.

    ( Jimbo says again )
    Inaccurate. Large scale CO2 releases started after WWII. WWII ended 63 years ago. AGW alarmists have for years tried to stretch the time frame for anthropogenic CO2 releases. There's a simple, (and COMPLETELY scientifically dishonest) reason for doing this; it gets them around explaining why atmospheric CO2 levels were rising BEFORE significant anthropogenic CO2 releases began, meaning those increases were (and still are) due to natural causes. You'll even hear them say that "CO2 has been rising since the start of the industrial revolution, since circa 1850". This is true of course. What is NOT TRUE is that humans were releasing CO2 in any significant amount since circa 1950, and not for circa a hundred years later. Yet CO2 was indeed rising during that century. In fact, the more recent increases fit nicely on that same trend line

    We wouldn't put up with such factual sloppiness from politicians. So why should we put up with it from eco/ploitical pressure groups? ******** is ******** no matter who says it.


    could you please identify the “ AGW ALARMISTS “ for me Ive not met them and Ild like learn more about this agenda you speak of

    so here is one of hundreds of corresponding graphs

    http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r420/maxtanks/carbonem.gif


    Im curious about your assessment of the rise in carbon
    your saying its not human caused ok
    so were did it come from
    what natural causes are you talking about
    if you were to identify them for us we could end this hole global climate change thing right here and now
    but you refuse to point the finger at the 14,000,000,000,000,000 pounds of co2 we know humans spew into the atmosphere every year just threw burning fossil fuels
    not including the rest of human activity
    natural causes can best be measured in era’s proceeding the industrial revolution
    and in those recent era’s carbon in the atmosphere was roughly .75% of what they are now
    what natural events are you noteing
    has there been a dramatic rise in termites
    there has been a rise in cattle
    hmmmm
    must be the termites
    sooooo
    were are you getting your data
    and were do you attribute the additional carbon as having come from

    http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r420/maxtanks/co2_graph_rt.gif

    Im looking at about a hundred graphs on atmospheric carbon
    and they all show pretty much the same thing

    how about one relating temp to carbon

    http://i354.photobucket.com/albums/r420/maxtanks/zFacts-CO2-Temp.gif

    looks like a steady rise to me
    no catastrophic natural events that I can see
    just a steady correlation between fossil fuels, carbon and temp
    proceeding or preceding is irrelevant

    I will readily admit there are anomalies in the data
    but the idea that our present rise in carbon is anything other than caused by man
    simple flies in the face of hard data
    there is no evidence of a natural event leading to such a dramatic rise in global carbon
    occurring with in the time period noted
    doesn't mean there isnt something we missed
    but its becoming less and less likely every day

    I think what you are saying concerning the longevity of carbon in the atmosphere
    is that at some point it will level out based on the idea that as we dump carbon into the air the carbon that is already there will be metabolized out leaving a stable condition
    doubtful
    sounds like the classic oil industry pseudo scientist jargon
    and it doesnt look like anything is leveling out to me as we should by your numbers be starting to metabolize some of that ww2 carbon right about now

    that logic is kinda like the cigarette companies pseudo scientists when they told us for years cigarettes were harmless
    hell the pseudo scientist cronies working for the cigarette companies still spout that crap
     
  6. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    cigs aint harmless?:confused: :rolleyes: :p
    theres ANOTHA thing for my list,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
    ya know,,,, its hard to quit smoking, when all your life EVERYBODY has told you "never be a quitter!"
    hehe ;)
     
  7. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
    Posts: 4,955
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    Text wrapping

    Just curious Boston, why is it your postings are so disjointed in terms of text structure?? Is it some sort of 'text wrapping' function...I'm not a computer expert.

    It's just a bit troubling reading your post...but I do find them very interesting
     
  8. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    thanks
    Im kinda one of those people who is border line savant
    I speak fine
    I read fine
    I can walk and talk and eat and chew
    I cant write to save my life
    I dont use contractions well
    the notation process just never made sense to me
    it seems I have some wiring defect with random systems analysis
    spelling and grammar fit that mold
    I also get lost a lot
    its frustrating
    but there is an upside
    I tend to have a nearly photographic memory
    and facts and graphs come easily to me
    I can read a paper and years later remember what is in it
    being able to refer even to the given page
    or see a blue print and understand about 90% of it with out the need for a second referral
    it has its ups and downs
    once the various universities I attended got over it
    they quit trying to torture it into me
    and this is best I can do

    I wish I could fix it for you
    I wish I could fix it for me

    thanks for the ask

    B

    remember
    all is not lost
    we can effect positive change
    if we only admit there is a problem to solve
    and act
    now
    together
    I do not advocate disaster
    but there is a cliff ahead
    we need only turn the wheel
     
  9. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
    Posts: 4,955
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    No problem, don't worry about it....content is much more important.

    I only wish my memory served me as well as it use to...I can certainly detect some loss in capability, and the need to reread many things
     
  10. Boston

    Boston Previous Member

    cool
    but its also nice to forget some things
    I often wish I could
    seems Ive got sticky brain syndrome
     
  11. safewalrus
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Cornwall, England

    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    So we're all going to die!

    Wow whats new?
     
  12. Butch .H
    Joined: Apr 2008
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    Location: South Africa

    Butch .H Senior Member

    No all the ice is going to melt and we are going to have more sea cool I got a yacht or two works for me. Um but then the Atlantic conveyor is going to stop and the world will freez um ok yes we are going to die but not befor I use that extra sea:D
     
  13. artemis
    Joined: Oct 2004
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    Location: USA

    artemis Steamboater

    Your days are numbered! All of you! :p :D
     
  14. Butch .H
    Joined: Apr 2008
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    Location: South Africa

    Butch .H Senior Member

    Not befor you guys run out of fuel.Will make interesting TV:p
     

  15. safewalrus
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Cornwall, England

    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    the Altantic Conveyor was sunk in '82 not far from you Butch
     
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