What Do We Think About Climate Change

I saw today that a preliminary estimate of Carbon Tax revenues will be 846,000,000,000 between 2010-19. For that amount we could build over 150 nuclear plants and construct waste recyling & storage for them. That amount of energy if concentrated in the frost belt could remove every home from oil or natural gas heat and phase out all of the fossil fuel generating plants in the frost belt. Not only would the non-threat of CO2 be removed, making AGW totally irrelevent instead of just factually so, but would virtually make the United States truly energy independent. Our domestic supplies of oil could easily handle the transportation demand needs. Of course the specter of unlimited cheap energy would send the Zero Growth crowd into a foaming at the mouth fit of apolplexy. If you don't believe me, watch the derisive and insulting posts that follow from the myopia club.

 

Myopia is right! That club never seems to consider that the unintended consequence of making fossil fuels artificially expensive will be MORE POLLUTION! Many poor people in developed countries will simply switch back to wood which they can get very cheaply.

The poor countries will never transition from burning wood as we did. As 'evil' as coal and oil are, they are still far cleaner in terms of BTUH/unit pollution than wood burned in a stove or fireplace, most especially when those fossil fuels are combusted in a nice modern electric power plant.

As I've said several times on this thread, these carbon emission cutting schemes are a self-defeating fool's errand.

Jimbo

 

Cows belching methane cause more problems with a more serious by-product
then us creating CO2. India, alone has over 500 million pet cows. Plant lots of Japanese Princess trees.......................

 

Plants give up more methane than cows, believe it or not...

I'm in the zero growth club, we need to stop growth (that does not mean prosperity, we can have one without the other!) or we will have a go at destroying each other as push come to shove over resources. Just how you manage that, I don't know, but lets not turn the earth into Easter Island and lets not wreak economic havoc chasing C02 windmills.

No energy is unlimited.

 

Right on target again, Eddy.
"Palaeozoic era the concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere was nearly 5,000 parts per million. That is about 15 times what it is now, yet the planet was in an ice age.", etc.. You will witness "Warmers" morphing into "Conservationists" as their main battle-premiss gets rejected by reason.
They will still attack America, all of those who don't abide by reason. Take Masshit (Mas is Spanish for "more", for he who knows not), for example; Bitterness, jealousy - I don't know what motivates that half-caste hamster but even when there is absolutely no reason to do so, he takes a jab at the nation of the greatest force for good the world has ever known ("...a poor misguided fool of an independent politician more suited to life in America..."). He could take a swing at me, if he dared stand toe to toe, or someone else he doesn't care for but instead he slanders an entire country with his spurious generalities.
One has to wonder what motivates a simple mind like his. Perhaps one of our governments so generous with our money would allocate a grant for its study now that warming is moot.

 

Yey! USA barrrf....

 

Who don't abide by reason....???

Some short lines:

"Weapons of mass destruction".
"Those who aint with us are against us".
"In God we trust".
"Gott mit uns"....

Zeee where this is getting you/ us....?

Before you jump upon a high horse; The two lines first there have resulted in the deaths of some good Norwegian military personell, as we tend to support US/ GB in international operations....
I also believe, if you look it up; Norway have paid more to / tributed more to international "peace" keeping actions per capita than the US of A have, per capita.... Frankly; I don't believe Norway is unique in doing better than the US in some aspects of foreign policy.....

So why this "greatest force for good the world has ever known" attitude?:?:

What motivates a simple mind?
Money...... Oil........:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ptzml1qQvZE&feature=related




And; Where's a crazy Chileean guy when you need one...??

 

Oh, ****!
Please don't go politics in this thread! We have more than enough with the warmers-coolers struggle! Please, please, please everybody!

 

Monthly CO report from climate realists.............

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/monthly_report/monthly_co2_report_may.html

 

and some more...........

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/reprint/climate_conspiracy.pdf

 

Guil, I know that sometimes politics seems to get in the way but to avoid it here is extremely difficult as AGW is about politics and social policy, not climate change or pollution as our friend Zed here has just admitted. Bravo to Zed for coming out of the closet on this. Perhaps he would be willing to start a thread on Zero Growth. That should be a fun one.

 

I was never in the closet ya silly bugger ... I never argued for AGW ????? At the most I said I'm remained open minded because I didn't really see it as an issue that matters given the back drop in energy and resources. That is a coming train wreck that will blow CO2 concerns out the back door IMO. That certainly does not mean I can make any sense of the AGW case!

Its zero growth or a devastating war... that's about the size of it eventually. How you make zero growth work with capitalism, which not perfect but its the best system we have devised, I don't know. Point remains its a real and quantifiable problem that is actually self evident even after a cursory inspection of the issues.

Chris Martenson has a presentation on it called the crash course.

http://www.chrismartenson.com/

The pressures he talks of are also a lot closer that I think anyone realises, it probably a moot point, I don't think you will change any political or social attitude in time to change anything. I'm just treating it as a heads up as to why the next major war will occur and why is in effect inescapable. I can tell you I'm happy to be down south....there is nobody worth fighting down here, it will be a northern hemisphere event, which is fine by me! Anywhoo... like I said I see it as a path we will tread, not as an issue people will want to understand or do anything about in time ---> the exponential nature of it will see to it that we are caught out ---> so I couldn't be bothered to argue it on a thread.

CYA.

 

Norway population =~ one medium size American city.
Seabass? - trying to unscramble his brains after his last run-in with me or looking for his huevos after his wife told him to stop fighting on the internet...

 

Oooooohhhh, open minded........ that's soooo terrible...... In this crowd....??

 

"The day before yesterday they called it "Global Warming", yesterday they called it "climate change". today they call it "energy security". He's a smart cookie.