We love Ferro cement but beware !

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by manta.bay, Feb 23, 2008.

  1. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    Brent, I think you are missing the point that has been iterated so well, so many times, that wood has an irreplacable part in boats, especially in the lighter, maybe trailered sizes. Steel hulls might be emmintly suitable for your sizes and purposes, but to write wood off in such a finite way is just ignorant.

    You do yourself no service being so blatently one-eyed about it.

    If I visited your boat, there would be no timber on it at all right? No linings, trim, console furniture ???

    I know what I would rather build a yacht tender in, definitely not steel, and preferably not pure fibreglass.
     
  2. Andy
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    Andy Senior Member

    Any chance this could go back to being about Ferro boats chaps?
     
  3. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    rwatson, i hadnt read that about the Ferro Ahwanee being lighter and i find it somewhat surprising but i sure wouldnt dispute it if thats what Bob claimed. I was flipping through their book "Bluewater" last night and he mentioned that they had put 70000 miles under the keel of the second (Ferro)boat which of course included the Antarctic circumnavigation in which they encounted the worst weather of the 200000 miles sailed in both boats and they encounted plenty,no weather routing in those days. Its funny,i remember seeing her back in the early 70s and she was no beauty as i recall,one of those roughys that folks these days would think gave Ferro the bad name it enjoys today.
    Steve.
     
  4. Brent Swain
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    Brent Swain Member

    Wood is a wonderful material for interiors,and cheap masts , but for smaller boats, nowhere near as good as fibreglass or aluminium.
     
  5. Brent Swain
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    Brent Swain Member

    I've built 36 foot hulls in two days . Try that in wood. I've built dozens outside with no shelter. Try that in wood.
    You say that wood is more fire resitant than steel? Give your head a shake. What created the heat that melted the steel beams ? Probably wood burning.
    Try building your woodstove or frying pan out of wood.
    Natural buoyancy is only relevant in rafts.
    I can build a 36 for a fraction the cost I've seen most wooden builders spend for a similar sized boat. When a wooden hull is done , the real expenses begin. You will spend more time and maintenace on a wooden boat in the next ten years than it takes to build a steel boat.
    Whatever material you use, you will save a fortune fitting out by buying some metal working tools and building your own gear and anchors.
     
  6. troy2000
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    troy2000 Senior Member

    What do you think the odds are that I could build a 36 foot hull at home in two days out of steel, using the tools in my shed and garage? Somewhere between slim and none, I'd say.....and I'm willing to bet there were no compound curves in the boats you built, unless you had your panels pre-shaped elsewhere at considerable cost.

    I didn't say wood won't burn. But it certainly fares better in a fire than GRP and a host of other synthetic materials, and it doesn't put out toxic fumes that can kill you. And the picture I mentioned of I-beams draped across charred wood beams is a genuine photograph. Structural wood members often survive fires better than steel ones do.

    Are you honestly trying to tell me that if I built a wooden boat today, it would immediately start costing me thousands a year in maintenance? That's complete nonsense, particularly for a boat that's dry-sailed most of its life.

    I'm not trying to tout wood's superiority to steel; I simply object to your complete dismissal of it, when it's being successfully used all over the world for boats. Why don't you spend more time talking about the good points of your chosen material since you like steel, and spend less time telling us what crap wood is?

    While we're at it: I live in a wood-framed, wood-floored, wood-sided house, with interior walls sheathed in....wood, strangely enough. It was built in 1940. It'll still be there when you and I are gone, most likely, because there isn't a spot of rust on any of that wood.
     
  7. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    Brent,clearly you are not talking about MODERN wood boat construction which will require much less maintainance than a steel boat over 10 years,in fact a modern wood boat will require the same maintainance as a fiberglass boat,no more. I am currently carrying out repairs to a Searunner 25 Tri which is 28yrs old and apart from needing buffing and waxing it has absolutly NO issues at all,zero rot,its sheet plywood with glass taped chines and everything else is epoxy sealed ,primed and painted with some 2 part paint.
    The repairs stem from it dragging its mooring and being blown into a commercial dock.The damage was fairly minor,about 60hours worth.
    Steve.
     
  8. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    As already noted before several times I suspect, the cost and time to build the hull is only part of the whole. Wood is a great material for the amateur and makes a satisfactory boat; just watch out for rot. Steel is a great material for the professional, just watch out for rust. Fiberglass ditto just watch out ... well you got the idea. People will buy any of the above.

    Many people will love and treasure a wood boat, most will neglect a fiberglass one. Glass over wood will probably outlast most other materials.

    Ferro-concrete makes an adequate boat but is evidently not as easy as it might seem, and the market negatives make it a poor investment in which to sink the rest of the money that goes towards making a boat.
     
  9. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    Brent, now you exagerate to make a point. You know perfectly that what you said is far from reality. Don't pull that stunt. Nobody on hearth built a 36' in two day, this is childish to say that.
    We are not in a kinden garden contest.
    If we are I tell you I will built a 50' in three hours. What about that? amazing right? No stupid.
    So wake up, and tell us something constructive and true.
    Your comparaison with wood stove is so stupid that I will forget I read it.
    But I have one for you: Try in the middle of winter to have a steel fire in your fire place. Is that not completly stupid? Yes. But it is a Brent theorie.
    As for the fraction of the cost, remember you talk to professional, son please think before writting.
    The last report show that the maintenance of boat is not in the material (plus or minus 10% depending the material) of the hull, but the systems and mecanicals. You should read reports sometimes, they are boring as hell but full of good stuff. If you are a member of a Society, they will provide you that at no cost in three days!
    As for outside building and no shelter, wooden ship whas built like that for several centuries in Maine and down the East Coast. And they continue. What a revelation! No shelter! Brent that is a discovery!
    Steel, wood, fiberglass ferro, alu, all these material are great whith their own value. You have to know that if you are a good builder and designer.
    Cheers
    Daniel
     
  10. troy2000
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    troy2000 Senior Member

    As soon as Brent stops riding his hobbyhorse around the stage...:p
     
  11. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    Daniel: no problem, just chop down a couple of trees, lash 'em together and off you go! Problem is finding trees that are under cover :)
     
  12. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Fly on the Wall - Miss ddt yet?

    Plus during those same 2 hours, your freshly poured ferro anchor will set.
     
  13. troy2000
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    troy2000 Senior Member

    Everyone makes that sound so easy. They never mention what a pain it is to pour the matching ferro anchor rode......
     
  14. wardd
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    wardd Senior Member

    how do you weld cement?
     

  15. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Fly on the Wall - Miss ddt yet?

    jb weld
     
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