VW electronics cheating the EPA

Discussion in 'Diesel Engines' started by powerabout, Sep 24, 2015.

  1. Petros
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    Petros Senior Member

    most recalls in the USA require the owner to make an appointment at a dealer or contract repair shop to incroporate the change. If the owner never makes the appointment, I do not think there is a way to enforce it getting done, but there is a data base with all the cars' and truck's serrial numbers showing which have had the recall orders done. When you get a vehicle check done (carfax) when you buy a used car you will get a listing of recalls and major repairs done, as reported by the dealer or auto repair shops.

    It is possible that in some states, if not all, when it comes time to renew your registration your car's serial number must show up in the data base, or you can not renew the registration. This would greatly reduce the resale value of the car to either a parts car, or for sale in the states that have no such process (if there are any). Or it can only be used off road on private property.

    one of the reasons I keep fixing and driving a 30 year old toyota; no computers, no recalls, no emissions testing required, reliable, easy to fix and parts are cheap.
     
  2. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    I'm not aware of any states in the US which check to see if a recall repairs have been performed before renewing registration.
     
  3. FAST FRED
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    FAST FRED Senior Member

    every shop can test for Nox as it has been part of testing for years

    I stand corrected , guess I have never seen it done ,
     
  4. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

    same machine that does the other gases
    but thats all academic as VW worked out how to pass the test.
     
  5. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    There are two fundamentally different types of vehicle emission requirements and certification tests, which have been confused both in the press and in this thread.

    The first are the regulations and corresponding tests which new vehicles must meet to be sold legally. These regulations specify permitted emissions in absolute values, usually as grams or grams/mile (not parts per million). The tests for these emissions are conducted under tightly controlled conditions with the vehicle on rolls being driven at a defined speed vs time curve. (In the US test cycles there is almost no constant speed operation). The vehicle is on rolls and rolls are connected to a device which simulates the inertia of the vehicle, and the tire rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag of the particular vehicle. VW used software which detected these tests and then modified the engine and emission control behavior for the duration of the tests.

    The second type are the regulations and tests which some but not all jurisdictions require periodically (typically annually or semi-annually) or when a vehicle over a certain age is sold. The regulations are based on pollutant concentration in the exhaust gases (parts per million), not absolute emissions. Vehicles are generally tested at simple constant speed conditions. These regulations and tests are generally designed to identify vehicles with emissions orders of magnitude greater than those permitted by the certification regulations. A vehicle could pass these regulations while not being close to meeting certification requirements. I haven't seen anything from a reliable and knowledgeable source confirming that the VW software was also designed to "beat" these regulations and tests.
     
  6. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

    Thanks for that DC
    I see in the UK car tax is based on emissions, oops more court cases.
     
  7. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

  8. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    For aussies i think there is a 60 minutes story this weekend about the vw saga. A lot of the stuff we have discussed is happening . Such as class actions which are getting underway. Vw sales have collapsed. There will be time limits on repairing the affected vehicles and after that expires their registration will be canceled. Not looking good for them.
     
  9. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    EPA sets unrealistic standards for engine manufacturers, which led to acts of desperation and fostered a climate in which dishonesty became a survival tool. Reign in the EPA and other heavy handed bureaucrats.
     
  10. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    Why then have others managed to comply without cheating.
     
  11. Rurudyne
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    Rurudyne Senior Member

    They may just be better at not getting caught.
     
  12. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

    this one is clear cut profiteering and not an unrealistic rule.
    All others had post combustion treatment to meet the spec, VW passed without it.
    I think the EPA have learnt as well, I believe they are changing to on road testing
     
  13. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    In this country, at least, EPA put rules into place that were not agreed to by the American people or the elected representatives they sent to Congress. It is tyranny, taxation and punishment through bureaucratic fiat.
     
  14. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

    but you grew up breathing lead fumes and your mother took thalidomide when she was pregnant because ill informed public know whats best for them?
    And the air is not clean in LA compared with 30 years ago?
     

  15. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher

    If you thought the American public was ill-informed back then, you should see us now! I never saw so many mrorns swimming in our gene pool as I do now.

    My mom never took thalidomide. Leaded gas smelled better. I typed this with my feet. The air in LA has more weed in it now.
     
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