Voyage to Atlantis

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/201...pundit-ezra-levant-rips-global-warming-lobby/

Most journalists who are most normally the most skeptical people in the room turn into obedient stenographers when faced with global warming salesmen. Any other multi-billion dollar industry would be treated cynically by reporters, not so the Global Warming industry or its high living jet setting tycoons. Journalists become fanboys! Yeah, no thanks. I’m not that obedient. Political correctness accounts for some of this, I mean it’s still fashionable in elite circles to follow the global warming fad and journalism professors are usually left wing

 

Be nice, and the member name is Titirangi, not **** or titie.
I don't need a Phd because I'm not trying to force my opinion on anyone, merely expressing my view, also no idea who you are referring to. You guys need to consider matters with an open mind instead of hanging on the coattails of popular trendy theorists.

If you bothered to acually read my post, you would notice that unlike all those who are polarized (pun not intended) on this issue like yourself and whitie I choose to keep an open mind including allowing for other factors.

I have no issue with protecting the enviroment or improving on how we do things to improve global quality. But I'm also aware that there are naturally occuring factors in our planet that have over the millenium contributed to climate shift or change that was a 1-10000yr event.

 

Tsunamis have absolutely nothing to do with climate change so I don't even know why climate change was introduced into this discussion about the city / state of Atlantis.

 

I think it MIGHT be, because some feel I disrupted THEIR climate change thread and were reciprocating, but I said they were welcome, and their comments.
I'm interested in discussing OLD myths that might be historical fact, about ancient seafarers, AND modern myths being touted as 'science'.
And if the intent was to annoy me, THAT failed entirely!

 

Getting paid for expressing an honest belief doesn't make a scientist a ***** - particularly if those beliefs are the result of research in the field. But aligning those supposed beliefs to agree with whoever is writing the checks instead of with the scientific data does....

The Heartland Institute is a prime example. It was founded by a guy who was once a respected scientist, until in his old age he realized he could make big bucks by selling his scientific credentials and credibility.

If someone makes heavy donations to the Institute, they'll start pumping out misinformation designed to obfuscate the truth by creating a phony scientific debate. Their biggest score before global warming was the tobacco industry. When that money started drying up, they moved on into Exxon Mobile's pocket.
.

 

As long as whitepointer23 is Whitie, your name is Tittie. You have a problem with that? Then start minding your own manners before complaining about mine.

When you try to shut down someone else's opinion, you're forcing your opinion on others.

I did read your post, and what I 'noticed' was that you were sneering at someone else and trying to shut him up by claiming he had no right to his opinions. That's your definition of an open mind? It isn't mine....

Are you also aware that the rapid climate shifts we're looking at today are unmatched by anything we've found in the past?

I'll admit that whitepointer23 wasn't particularly diplomatic in expressing his opinions. But your assertion that he isn't entitled to have an opinion because he doesn't have a Phd in climatology, along with your assumption that he knows nothing about the subject except what he's heard on TV and the news, was egregiously obnoxious and unnecessarily confrontational.

Short version: if you want respect, you're going to have to show respect.

 

One of my problems with your speculations is that while you're willing to accept everything else Plato said at face value, including his physical description of the city, you just casually throw away his very specific description of the actual location of Atlantis: in the Atlantic Ocean, not far beyond the Pillars of Hercules. And that location is backed up by his description of their incursion into the Mediterranean and conquest of the lands therein, including North Africa all the way to Egypt.

Why do you accept everything else he said at face value, but brush off that most basic bit of information?

And of course, there's the inconvenient fact that Plato claimed the Atlantean's conquests were stopped by the Athenians - at least seven or eight thousand years before Athens even existed. You think maybe there's a chance he was sucking up to the locals and their patriotic pride, instead of just recounting established history?

 

Excuse me. But did any of these scientists you don't respect, admit to falsifying data? or not actually having convictions in their point of view?
Remember Climate Gate?
I personally KNOW there is no evidence tobacco causes cancer and it frustrates the government no end. They "link" it to cancer, meaning they are certain but can't prove it.
I also don't believe that man is causing a dangerous amount of warming or climate change. If any. Climate change IS occurring and the earth DID warm, but it's easy to remove man's influence from the data and get nearly the results got WITH man.
So scientists who hold the same two viewpoints as I do, I applaud for being perceptive and NOT caving into the peer pressure!
They are NOT whores because they don't preach YOUR view.
Want respect? Give some.

 

Whoa! Where did he say 'not far' from pillars of Hercules? Gibralter.
He said BEYOND the Pillars of Hercules.
Beyond normally refers to a considerable distance, and NOT 'near'.

South America IS in the Atlantic, at least the Atlantic coast is.

 

If they were all the way across the Atlantic, why would they zero in on the Mediterranean? The obvious inference is that they were conquering lands within reasonable reach of Atlantis, rather than shuttling back and forth across an entire ocean to pinpoint one particular area when there were so many others within easier reach.

 

No. No scientists have admitted to falsifying data regarding climate change.

'Climategate' was pure bs. Hackers went through 20 years of emails, and managed to find a few of those thousands and thousands they could take out of context, and blow completely out of proportion.

I'm sorry, but you're completely full of it when you try to pretend smoking doesn't cause cancer. To maintain that position, you have to play completely asinine word games concerning the definition of 'proof,' and I'm not interested. Go find someone else to play with.

No, you can't get nearly the same results by removing man from the equations. That's also complete bs.

You'll have to look far and wide to find any real, practicing scientists who agree with you.on any of the nonsense regarding smoking and climate change you're promulgating. And it's kind of sad that you're willing to ignore thousands of scientists, and blindly accept a handful instead - especially when most of that handful are paid shills.

 

Actually Plato says "in front of the straits.
That COULD be any distance near or far.

Why is that obvious that Atlantis must be near the Med, to conquer it?
It's said that Alexander the Great wept because there were no more 'worlds' to conquer.
Europe colonized the Americas. Is it too much of a stretch that ancient South American Atlanteans, of an advanced culture, and masters of all lands in the west, might have wanted to colonize Africa and Europe too?
Land being already populated didn't slow down Europe in America!

http://atlantismaps.com/chapter_7.html

When we approach Plato’s works as a recounting of genuine dialogues and adhere more closely to Solon’s detailed description therein, postulated sites lying within the Mediterranean are entirely eliminated. Solon described Atlantis as the following:

“A mighty power which unprovoked made an expedition against the whole of Europe and Asia. This power came forth out of the Atlantic Ocean” from “an island situated in front of the straits which are by you called the Pillars of Heracles.” (Timaeus by Plato; translation by Benjamin Jowett [BJ])

Solon could hardly be clearer, not only does he locate Atlantis beyond the Pillars of Hercules—an ancient term for the Strait of Gibraltar—but he also places its location in the Atlantic Ocean. Still some have persisted and have somehow managed to ignore Solon’s Atlantic location, focusing instead on redefining and relocating the Pillars of Hercules within the Mediterranean to bolster the credibility of such sites as the islands of Sardinia and Malta, but Solon introduces another key element that further prohibits this notion. Solon declares Atlantis to have been a large continent-sized landmass:

“An island larger than Libya and Asia put together.” (Timaeus [BJ])

While the Greeks had limited and varying perceptions of the size of Asia and Libya, a term then applied to the African continent, they viewed the two combined equal to or larger than Europe. Hence, Atlantis was perceived larger and therefore separate from both the combined continents of Asia and Libya and by extended logic separate and larger than Europe as well, thus narrowing our search for Atlantis to a continent-sized landmass beyond the confines of the Mediterranean that excludes the continents of Africa, Europe and Asia.

 

Everybody that disagrees with you is full of BS.

I'm in exalted company!

 

By the way, Troy.
A personal invitation to participate in a new thread, http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/al.../design-diy-marine-composting-head-48281.html

I'm interested in any improvements or thoughts or rots your socks experience you have with YOUR composting head.

I DO like you, as much as I can like anyone who thinks I'm an ***.

 

I like you too, most of the time. I don't have to hate people to disagree with them....

And I seriously doubt that anyone would consider the Americas to be 'in front of the Pillars of Hercules,' instead of way out yonder beyond them.

I'll take a look at your thread tomorrow; I'm overdue for bed and have to work tomorrow.