TopSail schooner

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by tomwolodarsky, Oct 3, 2007.

  1. tomwolodarsky
    Joined: Sep 2003
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    tomwolodarsky New Member

    hello to all , i'm a final year naval architecture student and i wondered if some can get me information and some drawing of a classical topsail schooner . any suggestion regarding material choice will be helpful as well .
     
  2. Gilbert
    Joined: Aug 2004
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    Gilbert Senior Member

    Google Pride of Baltimore II for an example.
     
  3. safewalrus
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    Gilbert that's an EXTREME example! A beautiful one in the right hands but in the wrong hands ............extremly risky, but yes very beautiful and fast! with a capital F
     
  4. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Safewalrus, the Pride of Baltimore II is not particularly extreme, in fact has a reasonable stability curve, ballast/displacement ratio and about half the canvas of the original Pride.

    The original Pride was a witch, by anyone's description who'd sailed her. Built as a reproduction of the "Chasseur" an early 19th century, "sharp modeled" Baltimore schooner, well noted for her speed, battle tested ability and rakish style. This was a poor choice.

    Built in the early 1970's using traditional methods, she was not to be sailed by the well crafted and learned men of the sea she originally had working her decks. The amount of skill the average seamen possessed was astounding by modern standards, much of which has been lost.

    I don't think seamanship was a factor in her sinking. She was struck by a micro burst, with her trade wind rig flying and capsized, sinking in just a few minutes (open hatches on an other wise lovely day). 4 men, skipper included lost their lives. I was friends with Barry Duckworth and Vincent Lazarro, both of which didn't came up from the wreckage.

    The Pride 2 wasn't going to make the same mistake twice. She carries about half the sail area of the original and really is a "replication" not a replica or reproduction of an actual Baltimore clipper as the original was. These boats were built for speed. The ship and crew were "expendable" which was typical of business practice at the time around the world. The type developed as a result of participation in elicit trades, which required fast and weatherly vessels. The Baltimore model was so well noted that the Admiralty forbid British war ships to engage them during the 1812 war.

    The original was an extreme example, but the Pride 2 isn't, having A/C accommodations and quite a comfortable motion at sea (D/L in the 260's), not the twitchy ***** the original was.
     
  5. Sailormann
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    Sailormann Here - Pull this ...

  6. tomwolodarsky
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    tomwolodarsky New Member

    thanks allot guys , i will continue and if you all have a new idea's and drawing please please let me know , as well as any comment regarding construction method and material (i.e riveting steel , aluminum ??? wood :) )
     
  7. safewalrus
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    safewalrus Ancient Marriner

    PAR my appoligies, I was under the impression that the 'two' was a rebuild of the one! Obviously not! OK so she had a knock down in calm weather from a squall, but as any 'seaman' will tell you 'anything can happen at sea'.

    Yes the Baltimore clippers were beautiful ships and damn fast - they needed to be - however great skill was needed to operate them and this included the sensible precaution of not being caught at sea with your hatches open - sorry for the guys who lost their lives but this was in my view a case of poor seamanship!

    As it says on the clock tower at 'Stirling Lines' (Hereford), or used to "Death is natures way of saying you've failed", rather pragmatic those guys!
     
  8. dbraymer
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    dbraymer Junior Member

    drawings online

    www.dirigosailing.com

    has online drawings of a 72 foot Alden design. 7 sail double topmast, you can't go wrong studying these.

    Alden design associates charged me a bundle, but I could get you some physical copies in the mail for meal money.

    Capt DonB
     
  9. M&M Ovenden
    Joined: Jan 2006
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    M&M Ovenden Senior Member

    A great source of schooner lines and drawings is Chapelle's book "The American fishing schooner". Also a lot of historic information on the sail plans and rig.

    Murielle
     

  10. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    Thank you Guest for the very true story. To many people think they know and tell stupid things about the Pride. Even in this thread.
    Muriell you right Chapelle is the source to go.
    Daniel
     
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