The Raid Boat

Willallison

type in google "raid boats" you will find that there are specs etc on this type of event, its mainly from England to which raids are conducted into Europe, I think off memory the last one was in Finland so a boat had to meet that requirement it changes every year. Also raids are now taken off in the US and Canada. Now it will Australia's turn or then again maybe not.

 

When you do google for 'Raid Boats', an article from the Smallboatforum by Tom Vetromile comes into view. A very nice article, and it illustrates what I mentioned above, that Raids and Raid boats do have a 'traditional' look.

However, that article that I think appeared in January 2006 is a bit outdated already, because it does not take the latest raid boat designs into account.
In 2005 the British Magazine 'Classic Boat' had organized an official Raid Boat design competition, and the winning boats were presented in the December 2006 issue. ( Reference can be found on the website of www.Swallowboats.co.uk under 'Magazine Reviews .. SeaRaider').
Interestingly, the first prize of that design competition went to Australia, to Thomas Payne, so maybe there will be a Raid in Australia too very soon.

And one other, more general point concerning 'Raids'.: The design of the boats must be excellent of course, but is not all-decisive.
What finally makes the winner, is to a very high degree the physical capability of the crew, especially because of the rowing legs frequently involved. Often rowing is not prescribed, you just have the freedom to change to rowing anytime and anywhere when that offers better speed.

We had seen an athletic crew of hardy Norvegians rowing up directly to windward with six knots, it is quite impossible to match that under sails alone, whatever the boat design may be. A good design AND some drops of the old Viking blood make a Raid Boat a successful one.

Claus

 

Another waterballasted Raid Boat

Swallowboats Ltd. are already doing another water-ballasted Raid boat, 20 ft. BayRaider, renderings are on their website.

One boat has been ordered from the US, Oregon, and will probably pop up in one of the upcoming US raids.

Claus

 

After the experience of the first Shipyard Raid in 2005, the 2006 fleet was smaller, lighter, and easier to row, including a number of sliding seat rigs.

I think the faster boats carried beer in bottles as ballast, but little water and certainly that disappeared during each leg.

I found the Classic Boat design contest winners odd in that all included motor wells? Perhaps suggesting the designers were after more than a Raid entry.

Tad

 

Engines a MUST HAVE.

Maybe the market in Europe is different from the U.S.. Europe has fiercely tidal conditions in most popular sailing areas like the Solent, Scotland, Brittany, and there are also thousands of miles of fast flowing navigable rivers and canals to use or explore.

Besides, not all buyers would intend to do serious raid racing with their boat, they just want the versatility and speed potential of these boats.
But even if they are very active raiders, they would use their boats 80% for other general uses too, like single handing, fishing, pottering about.

So the key isssue is probably NOT whether to have an engine or none, but to provide for an engine AND do it in a way that the sailing and rowing capabilities are not reduced.

Our own engine is an aircooled Honda 2.3 short shaft, good enough for over 5 knots. There is just a small slit in the bottom of the boat for the propellor to fit through, and when the engine is tilted up, that slit is closed with a flush fitting fairing flap. No drag.

We can keep the engine in during races. At a weight of 12 kgs, (same weight as the anchoring gear) that extra weight is not significant, our full complement crew alone weighs around 400 kgs.

And it often comes in handy: In this years Sail Caledonia raid in Scotland, we finally came into a situation where we had to lock out through a sea-lock into a pretty wild open sea, and the moment the lock gates swung open, a full F7 was hammering its seas head-on into the lock chamber and all boats started to go Polka. There would have been no way for any of us to get out from there under oars alone.

C.

 

Thanks for your comments Claus,

Different Raids, different focus. To me, and as I state on the Shipyard Raid site, the Raid's purpose is to promote cruising in open boats under oar and sail. The unwritten text is that this cruising is done without engines. Of the 10 boats in the 2006 Shipyard Raid none carried engines, and only one even has the ability to do so. All the other boats are designed and built to cruise (or race) under sail and oar alone.

Thus to me an ideal Raid boat does not include an engine because there is no need of one. She will be able to make good progress (really good) under oars alone. This means the rig is light and comes down or you can row and sail at the same time. These are not heavy sailing cruisers that can just barely be rowed.

Different conditions? We have a 15' tidal range and the first hour of the Shipyard Raid sees the passage of a narrows which can run at 7+ knots. Currents of 3-4 knots are not unusual in the various passages and channels we traverse during the Raid.

Kayaks cruise extensively without engines. The boats that are being developed to compete in our Raid are one step up in endurance and add the ability to sail and sleep aboard. I love the look on the predominate powerboater's faces when a group of small boats arrive silently, unpack, camp, repack, and leave again in total silence. And appear to be having great fun in the process.

I guess that is the idea, you can have fun in small boats without infernal combustion!

Tad

 

Puzzled.

Tad:
I am a bit puzzled.

So you do not want boats with engines in your Shipyard Raid, fine.

But do you really think modern Raid boat designs should not provide for any engine? You think boats without an engine well have wider appeal and would sell better than boats with a well?

To me, an ideal raid boat not only sails and rows well, but also appeals to many and sells well.

C.

 

Love the philosophy of raid boats being engineless. People are drawn to them for that very reason.

They have enough appeal without an engine.

Ive rowed and paddled and sailed my boats and it was more satisfying to curse god than thank Yamaha.

 

Tad....

 

Tad:
We seem to speak into different directions and I wonder why that must be so.

You yourself put an outboarder well into your own design raid boat 'Ratty', and still you call it 'odd' that other designers provide for an outboard in their designs.?

And I think you go wrong when you disregard the good that John Watkinson had in all his Drascombe designs, the total versatility, the seakindliness, the all-weather sail plan, the thousandfold proven reliability.
For an ideal Raid Boat the task is to further improve on that.

Therefore some modern raid boat designs still look like Drascombes from afar, but they sail and row very differently.

>>our rules don't require the presence of an engine, thus it would be excess weight so they’ve gone extinct. <<

: No raid rules I know ever require the presence of an engine, but sometimes the real world conditions do, as I had experienced and described above. In such conditions you either have an engine aboard, or you must ask others who have for a tow, suits yourself which you prefer.

And again, my point was that modern raid boats should in principle be able to carry an engine along, but without compromising their sailing and rowing performance. That is the real task for the designer.

One is always free to leave the engine itself at home.

C.

 

Sorry Claus, I don't mean to seem obtuse, just not explaining myself very well I guess.

On the origins of my boat Ratty.
Ratty was originally designed to illustrate an article on cruising sailboats in WoodenBoat Magazine. The drawings were done in the late 90's but the article wasn’t published until the end of 2003. When she was drawn I was only vaguely aware (if at all) of the existence of a thing called a Raid. She was intended as a family cruiser very much in the tradition (and in appreciation of) of Watkinson's Drascombe cruisers. When my life allowed the construction of a small boat for family cruising, the Ratty plans were already done, and so she was built. After that I became involved with the Shipyard School and several years later began looking for a way to publicize the School's activities. In mid 2003 we conceived the idea of a Raid, and as my own boat fit the criteria, she was the first entry. But it was all happy coincidence, as was her win in 2005 due to excellent crewing.

For the 2006 Shipyard Raid Ratty was totally outclassed, but if it had blown 20+ knots all week, things might have been very different. Alas the wind hardly made any appearance at all, and thus the sliding seat rowboats controlled the lead.

After the 2005 Shipyard Raid I was asked to design a new boat to win in 2006, which became the Barefoot 517 posted above. Unfortunately the boat was not built before the 2006 Raid, and though she is currently under construction (to compete in 2007) I fear her design is already outdated.

Designs I admire include Gilles Montaubin's Wabi, and the very interesting Plume class designed by Gildas Plessis and Pierre-Marie Bourguinat. The Plume doesn’t seem to allow for either rowing or engine?

Perhaps our different views come down to a definition of ideal? My ideal Raid boat will make no concessions to any role other than winning a Raid, whereas your ideal would lead a full life as cruiser, after the Raid?

All the best, Tad

 

Tad,
thank you for your clarifications.

No. And it's also not 'traditional' in any way, so it would not qualify for your Shipyard Raid. If that boat is what you consider to be an 'ideal Raid Boat', we disagree very much.

Yes, my ideal raid boat must be able to win a Raid, AND serve the rest of the time as stable allround fishing boat, family boat, and coastal passagemaker, both with crew and single handed. A boat just for winning a raid would be too easy to design, and besides, few fellow raiders would like it.

Claus

 

I am starting to wonder just what is acceptable to a raid committee. The key seems to be "traditional" but in a race specially designed boats will inevitably appear even though some will disapprove.

Whose tradition, by the way? Would you allow paddles instead of oars?

Kayaks and Baidarkas have been around for long enough to be considered traditional and a long double will beat the pants off any oar-driven boat short of a racing skiff, and they can handle a decent sea.

Sailing? I sail my kayak using a home-built retractable mast and Bruce Foil. It is speedy in any direction except into the wind, it can be tacked but it is faster to paddle.

Safe? I can erect my rig and pack it away again in one minute in the event of trouble, or even toss the mast and sail over the side for later retrieval. It's strictly lakes and rivers for me due to chicken DNA but if the rules will bend far enough to admit sliding seats and composites this would be my ideal raid boat.

 

: Ultimately that is up to the respective individual committee decision, which will probably be guided mainly by practilities, how likely they consider your boat -or you both- may cause trouble in the usual sea and wind conditions during the raid. They certainly do not want to risk loosing a boat.

For example I would think that in the Dorestad Raid in the Netherlands a boat like yours will be perfectly fitting and welcome, in the Sail Caledonia it will probably be declined. These two raids probably are the xtremes on either side of the raid character span between sheltered and demanding.

BTW, if you lookup the participants ('Deelnemers') of Dorestad Raid 2005 (www.natuurlijkvaren.nl) you will see two boats similar to your own, 'De Harp' and 'Plezier'.
On the other side, at the Sail Caledonia website (www.sailcaledonia.org) website there is a link to a huge photo gallery of 2006 participants and situations. None of the boats depicted there are like yours.

Just contact the respective organisers, and ask them.

Claus

 

Tad:
I just read that you will have one of the new BayRaiders in the Shipyard Raid fleet this year.
That is one of newly custom designed raid boats I mentioned that CAN take a small engine along without compromising their rowing or sailing capability in any noticeable way. They have a flap underneath that flushly closes the outboard well when the engine is tilted up into the hull.
Again, I was not advocating the USE of an engine, but I am convinced many buyers prefer boats that CAN accommodate one.

C.