The Issue with going all Electric

Discussion in 'Electric Propulsion' started by jehardiman, Sep 5, 2022.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Flotation
    Joined: Jan 2020
    Posts: 165
    Likes: 29, Points: 28
    Location: Canada

    Flotation Senior Member

    The problem is implementing that solution is even more politically unrealistic. And it will make the technical capabilities of our society collapse in a way that makes reaching the preferred goal even further away. It is possible too keep most of the amenities of our current society in tact and even make them available to more of the less fortunate on our planet. If we use what we know in a smart way.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2022 at 4:32 AM
  2. Flotation
    Joined: Jan 2020
    Posts: 165
    Likes: 29, Points: 28
    Location: Canada

    Flotation Senior Member

    Did that thread end with the a response only containing the words "dog vomit" by the person denying humans have impact on our climate, in almost all of the 184 pages of that thread? Or did it end with my response illustrating the root cause of the problem?

    The tread was titled "Is the ocean broken?" and partially devolved into a climate change discussion. These problems are deeply intertwined and by definition highly political in nature.
     
  3. Ad Hoc
    Joined: Oct 2008
    Posts: 7,372
    Likes: 1,274, Points: 113, Legacy Rep: 2488
    Location: Japan

    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    Im more than aware of the threads MO.
    And I am more than aware of the consistent and endless deviation and highly subjective debate that is now ensuing.

    Constant repetition of the same thing and expecting a different reply is also the definition of madness!
     
    fallguy likes this.
  4. seasquirt
    Joined: Dec 2015
    Posts: 34
    Likes: 10, Points: 8, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: South Australia

    seasquirt In the beginning there were waters.

    Could a network of microwave links, or giant lasers transmit energy via the air, to receivers at local sub stations, for local network distribution, and directly to large power users ? This would reduce need for metals mining, and cooked birds could fall from the sky like manna from heaven.
    Inland and coastal shipping and airways could run on beamed power with no fuel or battery weight.
    And I want a hover board, and a time machine, and . . .
    Hot air wind generator.
     
  5. seandepagnier
    Joined: Oct 2020
    Posts: 57
    Likes: 12, Points: 8
    Location: the sea

    seandepagnier Junior Member

    So are you stating that we will never reach zero carbon before society collapses? This does seem most likely.

    If we did reach a net-zero and co2 levels are not increasing each year (or even decreasing) I dont see how its possible to provide a gallon of hydrocarbon fuel at anywhere near the current prices compared to the cost of other goods. It will just have to be far more expensive. Saying we can keep cheap energy and stabilize CO2 is a false promise. If you consider all the people driving around on power boats for example, wasting energy, it is clear energy is actually way cheaper than it needs to be without any sacrifice. Making it even more expensive would require some sacrifices (like reduced meat production if that is even a sacrifice) and so forth.

    We are currently in a situation where an hour labor of minimum wage can buy 5 gallons of diesel. It is time to gradually reduce the average buying power of hydrocarbons to reach emission targets, and since so much of it is for excessive use, it won't really be any sacrifice, people will just be more careful about how they consume. I for one, can easily afford a $40 per gallon fuel and the associated price increases that go along with it for other goods. I would welcome a swift transition.

    The secretary-general of the United Nations continues to make more and more alarming statements about the state of the environment as overall consumption increases, but inequality also increases as poor people around the world are facing reduced standards of living while the richest people continue to have more toys.

    I see more and more kids on electric foil boards and ebikes.. they even allow 10 year old kid to ride 28mph electric motorcycle on the greenway here without pedaling. I guess it doesn't matter how the cobalt for the battery is mined, it doesn't matter how the copper or rare earth magnets are produced, and it doesn't matter how the energy is generated, because it doesn't matter that these new toys that never used to exist now every rich child has. along with smart phones etc.

    It doesn't matter that motorized vehicles are allowed on the bike paths as long as they are electric, and it doesn't matter that the level of intelligence and fitness is decreasing each year along with life expectancy (because of pollution in the air, water and food)

    In my mind, electric boats should be limited to 8-10 knots. If you want to go above 10 knots you can use sail power or paddle really hard. combustion powered boats no longer have a place in our society outside of rescue operations. This speed limit would make sure they don't significantly exceed the speed of sail boats in most conditions (safety) as well as ensure the resources to produce them are not in excess. It also ensures we dont have rich people not changing their habits and continuing to zip around at high speed when it will be (and always was) not affordable for an average human to have a powerboat that can go those speeds.
     
  6. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
    Posts: 15,934
    Likes: 1,282, Points: 123, Legacy Rep: 2031
    Location: Milwaukee, WI

    gonzo Senior Member

    Interesting. How have you travelled all over the world? I assume that not buying gas includes no mode of transportation that uses fuel.
     
  7. seandepagnier
    Joined: Oct 2020
    Posts: 57
    Likes: 12, Points: 8
    Location: the sea

    seandepagnier Junior Member

    You continue to make assumptions: why? Not buying gas means I don't pay someone for gas. It so happens this includes gasoline, diesel, propane and a few others. I also refuse to ride in cars, fly, use power boats even ride a bus etc.. but that is not what the statement said which was simply that I don't buy gas. The point is: buying gas is a choice that you don't have to make.

    You continue to make jesting comments to try to pry uncomfortable truths that turn out to be false anyway. This is the same old story repeated, about how the guy with 200hp motor tells the guy with 2hp motor "we are burning the same gas" as if they equally share to blame. Making similar comments about how much energy this forum requires, but then rather than researching posting actual figures, you try a new angle of attack. I already can guess your next post will be. Why not simply assume you are mistaken and not bother?

    Do you have any insightful comments to share regarding electric boats?
     
    Flotation likes this.
  8. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
    Posts: 15,934
    Likes: 1,282, Points: 123, Legacy Rep: 2031
    Location: Milwaukee, WI

    gonzo Senior Member

    Long response, but no answer. How have you travelled all over the world? You and I are in agreement that if you take a plane or a bus, it is the same as buying gas. I am simply curious.
     
  9. Flotation
    Joined: Jan 2020
    Posts: 165
    Likes: 29, Points: 28
    Location: Canada

    Flotation Senior Member

     
  10. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
    Posts: 6,364
    Likes: 1,293, Points: 123, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: usa

    fallguy Senior Member

    I think the moderator ought to close the thread. It seems to have reached a point of diminishing returns. Personally, in my 4-5 years of contributing; I may have asked this one other time.
     

  11. Flotation
    Joined: Jan 2020
    Posts: 165
    Likes: 29, Points: 28
    Location: Canada

    Flotation Senior Member

    I posed viable solutions to the problems addressed in the IEA study that is the topic of this thread.

    Those solutions were met with "They will probably need wagons pulled by unicorns to get to work." by a person also downplaying the negative impact humans have on their environment by saying "some species that were almost extinct have been brought back". While in reality Extinction rates today are much higher than background rates and rates from previous mass extinctions. Note I never mentioned species going extinct in this discussion before. If someone makes them part of the topic by stating manipulative data don't see why they couldn't be corrected though.

    The same person had not put a single reasonable solution on the table and has been ridiculing contributors that did.

    Not a healthy basis for a good discussion indeed.


    Edit: real data about extinction rates.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2022 at 3:20 AM
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.