the deck on my Pearson Ensign

[alan white]

As I look at it, you might get away with a small cuddy house about 4 ft wide and 3 ft fore and aft and 6-8" high from varnished wood. Then bring the coamings in to that at an angle that will make building the coamings a little easier. You could then steam the wood rather than laminate it which currently appears necessary based on your drawings, due to that tight curve.

 

[seasailor55]

Alan,

I found this quote from one of your posts back in 2007. I hope you don't mind me using it.

"There's a lot to be said about marrying a fiberglass hull to a wooden top structure. I don't know if you've ever heard of the Cape George Cutter series, based on Atkin's designs, but they are built exactly that way (google the name and see), and there is not a better built boat in the world. Fiberglass decks and cabins always look molded, and wooden hulls just about all leak somewhere. But with a fiberglass hull and the rest wood, the boat looks georgeous and no worries with the hull."

This is what I'm trying to achieve with my boat. A classic fiberglass hull married to new epoxy coated wooden decks, bulkheads, coamings, etc.

Thanks for the inspiration.

 

[alan white]

Alan,

I found this quote from one of your posts back in 2007. I hope you don't mind me using it.

"There's a lot to be said about marrying a fiberglass hull to a wooden top structure. I don't know if you've ever heard of the Cape George Cutter series, based on Atkin's designs, but they are built exactly that way (google the name and see), and there is not a better built boat in the world. Fiberglass decks and cabins always look molded, and wooden hulls just about all leak somewhere. But with a fiberglass hull and the rest wood, the boat looks georgeous and no worries with the hull."

This is what I'm trying to achieve with my boat. A classic fiberglass hull married to new epoxy coated wooden decks, bulkheads, coamings, etc.

Thanks for the inspiration.

The original Ensign gave away its fiberglass origins mostly from its cuddy construction. The same boat with a real wood dog house would be gorgeous I think. Or as you've redesigned it with a flush deck, being careful to avoid clues except up close where it can't be avoided.
Regarding "hybrid" construction like this, few builders do it, preferring to stick with one method or the other. Not because the hybrid isn't superior-- it is in my opinion-- but because the market doesn't support such construction (it involves two distinctly different methods that require two separate sets of tooling, knowledge, and facilities).

 

[seasailor55]

The original Ensign gave away its fiberglass origins mostly from its cuddy construction. The same boat with a real wood dog house would be gorgeous I think.

How would you envision a real wood dog house for an Ensign? Would it follow the original cabin lines, (slightly tapered with a dummy windshield front) or could it be a oval front cabin as an extension of the coaming? I've seen these on classic boats, but I understand that they're tricky to build, and I wonder how one would look married to the Ensign's almost straight sheer and reverse transom. I've attached some sketches of what it might look like with a oval front cabin and counter stern. The flush deck version shown has a 9" deck crown and keeps the reverse transom. The hatches, coamings, transom, and cockpit floor would be bright finished wood.

There are pros and cons to the counter stern. To me it looks classy, especially on a full keel boat. But the boat has no engine, and an outboard bracket that can detract from the graceful lines of a counter stern doesn't seem to be quite as obtrusive on a reverse transom. The flush (crowned) deck will be an easier build, is in keeping with the sheer and reverse transom, and produces a kind of sleek, uncluttered look especially for a daysailor/racer. But, oh! that oval front cabin and counter stern sure are tempting!

 

[alan white]

You're already in pretty deep. The small cuddy house is no big deal especially if you can carry the coamings forward all in one piece. I envision something that can use the doghouse sides as structure (the forward ends of the coaming/doghouse sides are braced to the forward bulkhead by gussets in my vision). i don;t see an oval front doghouse for one simple reason--- too much work with so much else to do.
However, to me, breaking down the foredeck as described, I'd make the coaming/dog house sides perfectly vertical and the squared off front coaming (seen looking aft from the bow) would be at right angles to the deck or angled back to whatever degree you like. No. 2 looks good as you drew it.
Another option would be to build the cockpit coamings separate from the doghouse and that will allow two things. First, the cockpit coamings can be angled better for back support. Second, the doghouse sides can angle oppositely (maybe 10 degrees inward at the top).
I personally wouldn't hesitate to do the cuddy this way since the aesthetic value of that brightwork would make the boat, so to speak.
This all works well with a girder system going fore ad eft as per PAR's mention, the major support coming from the doghouse sides, but also the external hatch slide wood makes good longitudinals as well. If spaced right, no framing besides the doghouse sides and the hatch parts are needed except to brace the mast and a couple of internal longitudinals (1 x 2) from the hatch sides going forward. The side decks, even if wide, could be 3/8" plywood with no frames if desired. The cabin top would be 1/4" as already discussed. now you've got some headroom and a classy looking cuddy that will turn heads.

 

[PAR]

I think a cabin will add about 220% more complication to the decking, cockpit seating situation. Unless you use the blister deck concept, where the longitudinal stringers form the shape and you just glue and screw light plywood over it, the building of even what appears a simple cabin can be a daunting fitting operation.

First off, the cabin sides should lean inboard at the top, for looks and more importantly strength. This means a rolling bevel on the deck opening carlin. Ouch if you've never had to do one of these. This bevel (stringer twist) will roll from say about 10 degrees inboard at the top of the cabin to about the same in the cockpit coming, except the other way (outboard at the top). This provides the coming a good seat back angle and the cabin a good water shedding, strengthening angle. Curved cabin fronts are lovely, but also difficult to template, let alone bend into place. I laminate them from thin plywood, but you'll feel guilty about the waste (50% and over).

I also think you have what you have and silk purses out of sow's ears are extremely rare and all but imposable for the novice. Given your options, you should think simple and not make too much work for yourself, this is project enough for most. The blister deck is doable and not too complicated. It's in keeping with the style of the boat, maybe even bringing it up a few decades. It'll be serviceable for what it'll be used for and still make people look at a dock.

I guess my point is you have a classic set of lines, work with them. Altering the transom angle is a can of worms, you have a few of these already. A proper cabin is something that will be used 1% of the time it's in the water and will likely require 50% or more of the rebuild effort to get it fitted and looking right. A "swollen" deck or blister deck does limit you cabin space, but given what you get out of it, maybe not such a bad choice after all. It is fairly easy to do and kills both the decking and cabin issue with one stone throw.

 

[seasailor55]

The flush (crowned) deck will be an easier build, is in keeping with the sheer and reverse transom, and produces a kind of sleek, uncluttered look especially for a daysailor/racer. But, oh! that oval front cabin and counter stern sure are tempting!

As I mentioned, I'm tempted, but reality check says stay with the crowned deck. I guess it's the traditionalist in me that has always liked those oval and round front cabins, but I've never built one, and I'm sure it's a lot tougher than it looks, especially with rolling bevels. The reverse transom and crowned deck blend well to me. I just wonder if there is way to transition from deck to cockpit coaming that flows a little better.

 

[alan white]

Several ways come to mind. One way would be to run the cockpit coamings parallel with the sides butting into a transverse coaming that's angled forward (at the top) to divert water off the sides. The two angled (plan view) transverse coamings would then meet the main bulkhead where the hatch sides are. Another way would be to run the transverse coaming at right angles to the centerline, again terminating at each side of the hatch. A third way would be to curve each side coaming a full 90 degrees and into the same termination at the hatch. Finally, the side coamings could run another three feet or so forward and the crossing transverse coaming could cross in one piece ahead of the hatch, which would make it easier to access lines and keep the open hatch area dry. Variations of any of the above configs would also be doable. On my boat I ogeed (recurve shape in side view) the side coamings ends both fore and aft and ran a one piece transverse coaming atop the main bulkhead between them with the access hatch mounted vertically on the bulkhead. Not meant for human egress though. But putting the hatch on the bulkhead sure simplifies things and if you're only looking to store a few things, it's the simplest route to go by far.

 

[alan white]

Here's how I did my coamings. Very simple but the hatch is not on top but on the bulkhead.

 

[PAR]

I don't find coamings difficult to make, even the grand curved ones I always seem to draw up. I do it one of several ways, but usually I laminate thin plywood, then cap it with a grooved section of hardwood. Another method I use fairly often, especially on deck with a lot of "spring" to them, is a horizontal laminate of hardwood, stacked until it's high enough to call a coaming. I don't like seeing the horizontal lamination too much, though alternating with light and darker wood species can be nice.

My general approach is a rough carlin and spring clamp a thin piece of plywood or chip board to it, bending it around as necessary, then tracing the bottom of the carlin and the deck line on it. Once removed I'll spring a batten an rough in the shape of the top. Then it's re attached to the carlin and looked at from every angle, adjustments are made, it's rehung, etc. When satisfied with the shape, it's transferred to the actual stock, cut and hung.

The counter stern isn't that difficult a task if you want to add this feature to the boat. You'll be cutting a new transom angle from the old hull rather then adding, so it's just a matter of placing the cut line in the right place (remember the laser level I mentioned) and having at it with a jig saw. Of course you'll need to make a new transom flange, but it doesn't have to look good, just strong. This assumes you'll use a plywood, possibly skinned with hardwood transom. I think the boat will look fine with the counter and a flush deck, if the proportions are right. Then again a hardwood coaming, that rolls into cabin sides and a sloping front too, would be really fine.

It might be easier to make this decision by making a list of the activities on the boat, while in use. Beer drinking, gazing at scantily clad your ladies on beaches, attempting to sail while doing either or, etc. and see how much real cabin space needs pop up. If you have a list of a dozen items you might indulge yourself with aboard, how many require a cabin? Of these that might need a cabin, could you make do without it? Would a boom tent be better or worse for these activities?

 

[seasailor55]

Alan,

Is that your gaffer? Beautiful boat! I've got a 45 year old 16' daysailer with an oval cockpit, sweeping sheer, and lots of deck crown. There's hardly a straight line on the hull. I have a mahogany rudder and centerboard, a gaff mainsail, and a jib for it. It needs a mast, gaff, and boom, which I am considering making out of clear spruce. (Another boat project!)

Thanks for the coaming information and the photo!

 

[seasailor55]

I don't find coamings difficult to make, even the grand curved ones I always seem to draw up. I do it one of several ways, but usually I laminate thin plywood, then cap it with a grooved section of hardwood.

The idea of making coamings from laminated plywood has occurred to me, but I didn't want the layers of the plywood to show. How would you cap one with a grooved section of hardwood as mentioned?

 

[alan white]

Alan,

Is that your gaffer? Beautiful boat! I've got a 45 year old 16' daysailer with an oval cockpit, sweeping sheer, and lots of deck crown. There's hardly a straight line on the hull. I have a mahogany rudder and centerboard, a gaff mainsail, and a jib for it. It needs a mast, gaff, and boom, which I am considering making out of clear spruce. (Another boat project!)

Thanks for the coaming information and the photo!

It's my gaffer. Long full (but shoal) keel. I converted her from a cat rig by adding a bowsprit/jib and moving the mast aft. The boat is probably 40 yrs old.
If you make spars for yours, try fir. It is often available in clear quarter-sawn stock. Not too hard to make those spars.

 

[PAR]

If your vertical laminate (plywood) is say 1/2" thick, then cut a groove on the underside a of a piece of 3/4" square mahogany and glue it over the end grain if the plywood.

 

[seasailor55]

It might be easier to make this decision by making a list of the activities on the boat, while in use.

The basic purpose of the boat would be sailing instruction, (sail handling, setting a course, docking, anchoring, manuvering under power, and giving folks a taste of how a keel boat sails) along with informal racing, evening sails, and an occasional overnight trip to the Gulf of Mexico. The cabin (raised deck) would serve as storage for the outboard, sails, etc., shelter in a rain squall or an overnight trip, and limit the amount of water that could come aboard in nasty weather. The cabin probably won't get used enough to justify a major effort or expense, but will play a part in the overall rebuilding scheme. (The boat needs a deck and bulkheads anyway, so why not raise the crown somewhat and add a hatch in the cabin bulkhead?) The counter stern would be nice, but I probably wouldn't do it unless I went with a full blown wooden sided cabin, which at this point is beyond my abilities and needs.