Sugestion for thrilling Sailing Dingy

Thanks everybody,

Very good information, I checked through all your links and I start to get an Idea of where I want to go.
I understood that something like a moth will be imposible with 2 poeple onboard.
I weight 70 Kg, and my Girl 50 kg. Also, very important, I sail of Barcelona Beach wich is open sea and the sea state is almost never flat when the wind is blowing.
I'm not keen about buying second hand as It's also a fun project to build a boat for me and I have quite a few friend in the boat building industry that could give me a hand.
I guess what I would like is to buy construction plans to build a double handed wing boat. Anybody have some good ones or know where to get them ?
I also saw a few design for cats that uses 2 windsurfer sails, one on each hull, has anybody had experience with such a craft.
Thanksfor all.

 

Wing boat design

Hi Yacht Skipper, If you want a design that is thrilling to sail for 2 persons and has wings to sit out like the Moth, look at the B14. It is almost as quick as the International 14, but a bit easier to handle, and has fleets in many countries. This is the world B14 website: http://www.b14.org/

 

70+50kg. You're pretty light then. A quick and readily home built boat for that sort of weight range is a Cherub. They come in related UK and Australian varieties with essentially similar hulls. but the British ones have much larger sails - probably too big for your purposes unless you sail mostly in light winds.

UK
http://www.sailingsource.com/cherub/chframe.php?menu=build

AUS
http://www.cherub.org.au/


Bloodaxe boats sell plans and instrcutions for building Cherubs from foam sandwch and wood/glass sandwich.
http://home.freeuk.com/bloodaxe/cherub.htm

In traditional wood construction the best but most expensive plans would probably from Farr Yacht Design whose directors built excelent wood dinghies before they went to leadmines.
http://www.farrdesign.com/048.htm

Interestingly the thirty year old Farr design, although outclassed for racing, probably makes a nicer sail round the bay boat.

 

Thanks guys, I'm highly interested on the B14 or cherub, if someone has knowledge of both, what are the goods and bads.
I guess I will go with the easiest to build as I am not profesional builder andI would like to sail before the end of the season.
Any B14 plans outhere ?
Many thanks

 

Hi Yacht Skipper, I went back to your first posting and realized that you want to keep the cost down and get sailing this season. Building your own boat is not the way to go if this is important. It always take about three times as long to build as you first think if you want to do a good job, and will cost about double your first budget allocation. Buying a used dinghy in OK condition and cleaning up, repainting, will be cheaper and much quicker for you and your girl to get sailing.

B14's I think are not home built ever, so there are no plans.

Cherubs are also very good but your 50Kg girl might be a little light on trapeze if it is windy where you sail. Can she sail on the helm? There are many web sites on Cherubs. This one is a good general description of building a dinghy in wood. http://www.sailingsource.com/cherub/chframe.php?menu=build

You have to realize that build it yourself is what many of us do for the satisfaction and not because it is a CHEAP or EASY way to get a boat. Some people might argue with this, but it depends if you are going to cut corners with the quality of the materials. Marine ply, PVC foam, epoxy resin and glues are expensive.

 

The NZ Javelin (not the US or UK Javelins which are very different) is the bigger version of the Cherub; may be overpowering for your crew. One of the best B14 sailors is an ex Jav racer and he says they feel pretty similar. Both are a bit quicker than a 505 I think. The Jav has the advantage that plans are available.

See http://www.javelins.org/

The MG14 was originally a Javelin-type hull with a smaller rig for lighter sailors and female crews. It is not much slimmer in section and less stable. The NS14 is basically the same hull, without spinnaker or trap. The Tasar is a development from an old Javelin/NS hull but the new MGs and NSs are much narrower on the waterline, less stable but significantly quicker (up to 1 minute per leg). Again, plans are available for NS14s and MG14s.

http://www.mg14.com/newlook/index.asp?page=class/history.asp

For speed comparisons - our yardstick says 14' Skiff is 86, FD is 92.5, 29er and (I think) International Canoe are 95, 505, B14 and Javelin are 97, 470 and Fireball are 101, Moth (non-foiling) is 103, Cherub and MG14 are 106, Contender and Tasar are 107.5, NS14 is 108, 420 is 112, Laser is 113, Laser Radial is 116.

These are old figures and in some cases listed as not being fully reliable. I don't think the 29er is that fast (B14 is quicker AFAIK). After speaking with designers, world champs etc the non-foiling Moth should be around 98-100, the NS and Cherub should be 103 or less, the MG 101 or less (the competition is less intense therefore it doesn't go as fast as it should IMHO). The Laser and 420 are rated too fast, I think, as a Laser/Tasar sailo. However these could give you some idea.

 

505 Plans

Given the responses and the fact, that I read about plywood 505s somewhere else, I have to ask: Does anyone know of plans for 505s?

I have similar requirements as to fast sailing, but inexperienced sailor, which might rule out Cherubs and Javelins. No sleeping or overnight tours required, just fast setup and relatively easy trailing for daytrips. It also appears there are far more 505s being sailed here on the East Coast, than Javelins.

I did not see any plans for the MG14, but perhaps it's required to become a member first?

Ruedi

 

Hi Reudi, if you feel that sailing a Cherub or Javelin is too challenging for your level of experience, then a 505 will be also. This is a high performance dinghy with lots of power, but OK if you have sailed dinghys for a while already. Not an easy boat to build, and I doubt that there are fully amateur boats being built these days, therefore obtaining plans will be very difficult. The hull shape being round bilged with concave flared out topsides, lends itself to modern composite construction, requiring an expensive mold and considerable experience in this style of construction.
You would be better off to buy an inexpensive secondhand boat of a type suited for you, and sail it for a while, while you consider exactly what you want to build or buy next time around.

 

Why not buy a used International 14 and modify it as you wish? You can't build a boat from scratch for less than you can buy a used boat. With the I 14, you know you already have an exciting platform to start with, and modifying it won't destroy its resale value, especially if you don't do anything irreversible that would prevent it from getting back into class rules.

I 14's have already flown on foils, so I think they would be a good starting place for a two-place foiler. There are some lessons learned and people you can contact for support and advice.

 

14

I agree; see post #2 of this thread.Fastacraft( john@fastacraft.com ) has supplied foils to several 14's ; there is at least one pix in his gallery here. You can also go to: www.fastacraft.com
John would be able to help you make a first class system.....