Confronting Failure

Hey everyone,

I want your advice on how to confront the failure of a project. My first attempt to build an instant boat has also been my first real carpentry and construction project. I went into it willing to accept the possibility of failure, and with the understanding that I would be learning as I went.

Boy have I learned. Even more than that, almost everything I've learned came from on-the-job experiences, lots of aha! moments where with the tools in my hand and the sloppy cuts on the wood I finally understood what I'd been reading about in Payson's books and elsewhere...even if it was often too late to correct my mistake and I was looking at a lot of new work.

Other learning experiences have included how to deal with situations that are beyond my control. I can only build on weekends, and not even every one. I build in my girlfriend's basement, a ground level garage that is covered on top but only latticed around the walls. Every humid week I sit at work wondering what all the heat and water in the air is doing to those sheets. I've seen a lot of warping, but the almost last straw came a few weeks ago, when I arrived at her place to discover that something or someone (possibly neighbors...its a duplex with divided garage space) had soaked the floor or something. The vast majority of the panels and already cut pieces have what appears to be some heavy water damage, dirt, maybe even mold.

So now I have to decide how to continue. One of the things I've learned over the last six months is that there really is no point at which the project can't be salvaged...I could buy more wood and re-cut everything damaged, etc, but I've also learned that only being able to work on the weekends really hurts my flow. Being a beginner the best working time I had was when I had three consecutive days. Working for one and a half or so and then walking away for a week makes it hard to keep connected to my own plans and train of thought.

Knowing what I know now, I wish I had chosen an easier boat than the Gypsy. Is it beyond my ability? Well, probably not anymore, but I wish I had chosen a faster, easier build, which I'm sure would have still taught me plenty but also made it easier to finish on a schedule like mine, get my confidence up, etc.

For the first last couple of chance I've had to work, I've found myself frustrated to be working, instead of the usual excitement, sense of accomplishment, and in-the-moment zen. The thought of putting this aside, taking some time off, and coming at a simpler boat has crept into my mind.

These are mental challenges I'm facing more than physical ones maybe. But I've always admired the level of wisdom on this forum, both in matters of work and matters of soul, and anyway you guys have seen everything.

So how should I proceed? I don't want to quit, it feels like cheating, but I also don't want this to stop being fun. I've been bitten by the bug, I know I'll never stop thinking about little wooden boats until I'm sitting in one of my own, but right now that seems impossibly far away. Your advice is appreciated.

-Q

 

edison used to say about his failures, he learned another way not to make a light bulb

 

Have you considered a boat that is possible to build in a weekend? A skiff would fit the bill.

 

I don't know exactly what you are working on or how old you are. Working in your girfriends basement leads me to believe that you're fairly young.

I feel your pain. IMO doing restoration is a love/hate proposition. In your case it seems that you don't have the time to properly execute your build or a decent place to work.

I didn't start my restoration project until I retired. I never could have made it as far as I have had I been working full time. I work part time and have summer's off from the end of June until early September. When working I have at least three hours each day to spend with the boat. Even this isn't enough when you're dealing with "time sensitive" work like epoxy and fiberglassing.

I think that folks make the mistake of trying these projects and then find that they run short of time (you?), money or ambition or some combination. I'd council anyone who asks to wait until they have the time and money to do the job right. How much time? At least twice as much as you'l think you'll need. Money? Well you know the old saying.....if you need to ask "how much?" you probably can't afford to do it.

It sounds like the time issue is what's hurting you. In that case I'd agree with Gonzo that a simpler/quicker build might do the trick. After all if you're not enjoying yourself (most of the time anyway) what's the point? Of course what Gonzo could build in a weekend would take me a lot longer!

Regards,

MIA

 

Q: I can make you feel a lot better by sharing my failed build with you.

In about February '10 I was tasked with getting us a charterable 45' cruising catamaran. From that moment, until about April, I researched the boat market and arrived at the conclusion that I could build a better boat for less money than buy. I was elated.

From April to June I spent 40-60 hours a week trying to nail down a location to build, finally settling on a location about 1200 miles away from home because I could afford it and I could work year 'round (summers were not very good though). I spent $3500 on plans for the boat.

In early July, I ordered a $8000 building and spent 3 weeks putting it up in 98 degree Florida heat (Heat index of 108F average). Next, I ordered $10,000 worth of boat building materials and about $4000 worth of tools needed for the project that I didn't have in my standard set of tools. My standard tools were things for fixing boats, not working with wood and epoxy to the level of building.

In August, I was happy to have my wife come for a visit for 3 weeks. We had to be apart for the build because we're kind of on the poor side for this stuff and she had to keep working while I built to ensure we could see the project through. During her 3 week visit, we did nothing but create large 8x8 panels for the hull. Well over a hundred of them. She went home after a hard few weeks at a forced labor camp.

Then, I hired some guys to do the hull layups. We did 2 of them well. The 3rd had a leak in the bag in an inaccessible place. The ENTIRE HULL PANEL (1/4 of my whole boat) was garbage to be cut up and thrown into a dumpster. Add to that the fact that the designer talks up his cylinder mold like you can do it yourself, but he's way too optimistic. You can't. You need crews of 3 or 4 men to move things around and to do many of the steps in the build process.

SO... after spending 6 months more than full time, tons of grueling physical labor, 7 days a week and well over $20,000, my project is also failed. Now I have to go out and buy a boat with whatever I have left after I wasted half my life's savings.

That should help you feel better.

 

You guys are all mentally unstable.... But I have spent over 5 years, a lot over $100k ( a lot more, may be double) and still going. Got at least another $100k to go. And it still won't be finished. On the plus side, I am living in boat on dry land. Everyone in my family thinks I am crazy, And biggest problem is getting boat in water just 20 feet way without damaging it. Have to wait for flood...

Building a boat, a large boat is for crazy people. Oh by the way this is not my first boat, it is about my sixth. But the size fool me. So advise goes like this.

1. Why build it if you can buy and fix
2. Build a smaller boat
3. Double or triple your cost estimates
4. Get professional help for yourself(psychologist) and boat (surveyor, Naval Engineer)
5. Is what you are trying to do worth it?
6. Expect failure and try again.
7. Budget for failure...
8. A boat under construction will wear over time if you take a long time to build. Expect to redo some areas.
9. Build a smaller boat.
10. Have you gotten help yet.

 

Thanks for the encouragement/ shared horror stories. While I knew failure was a possibility going in, I kept a "I'll make it happen somehow someway" attitude. Maybe the "someway" in this case means picking a different project that is more suited to my current life (I am young...ish anyway, at 24, and working full time obviously, so time is a crutch!).

I guess maybe it's time to take a step back and re-evaluate. I'm way too into wooden boats to go off and get a more time friendly hobby, but I'm just glad to hear I'm not the only one whose found they've bitten off more than they can chew.

Thanks!

 

Oh dear, it's sad when someone elses misfortune makes you feel better, life is cruel at times.

But in turn I've seen worse, same size of boat just down the road from me.
Lots more thousands of hours work and $$ than you expended, it was nearing completion and then a fire destroyed it totally and no insurance either.

The builder wiser and older but still with some $$ bought a ready made hull to finish second time around fully realizing the true cost of all the labor.

 

Of every set of study plans I sell, only 20% will buy a full set of plans. Of the full set of plans sold only 30% will have materials purchased for the project. Of the projects with materials on hand 50% will will get past the setup, mold, frame, station form ******** stage. Of these that have erected the molds, planking will be started, but only 50% will finish planking. Those with a finished planking job will fair, paint and roll over 70% of the time. Most of the rolled hulls will get decks and then sit and rot for the remainder of their lives, because the owner has realized, they are now only 15% of the way through the project, not the 60% they thought before the roll over. I've personally purchased builds in this state and lots of them are out there and many homes around the country, have one in that back yard that must be removed, before the house can be sold.

Lastly the small percentage of boats that get their bulkheads, decks and interiors installed actually get splashed. The hardware and fitting costs kill the project, if the wife hasn't killed the builder before hand.

My point is there's a very few that actually complete their boat building projects. It's a fact of life. Smaller craft (under 20') have a higher completion percentage, but they still suffer from the same set of issues. Projects develop and have defined "plateaus" where there are natural stopping points and these are the places we find the project, many years later as they need to clear out the car port for a new car.

Q, anything can be fixed, especially on a taped seam boat. Even if you have screwed up so bad you have to hack it out with an ax, you can piece in a repair with wood butcher's friend (epoxy) and under paint, no one will have a clue how bad you really are. Keep stroking it and don't land on a plateau and settle in for a rest. Bang on it until it get's splashed, trust me it's worth every swat in the back of the head your lady has given you over it.

 

Thanks for those responses. I'm glad my tragedy helped Q feel better, if only a little. Just showing him that he's not alone and many of us face failure. On the positive side, I knew when to fold. I'm also glad folding came early on in the project before I wasted more money. I'm not really interested in building boats. I'm interested in owning boats. I figured I'd build because of the 5 other boats I've owned over the years, I restored 3 of them completely. Some replies in blue...

 

I feel your pain. I live in my motorhome in various RV parks. I built my boat on a picnic table. In the pacific northwest the weather can be difficult at times (does that qualify for understatement of the year?) So first I had to find a place to keep the wood dry. I put it under the RV but elevated off the ground and covered with plastic. (For some strange reason my wife didn't want sheets of plywood inside our motorhome) After cutting all the parts out on the RV pad I had to put everything together on the table. But the weather kept getting in the way, especially after I had stitched all the parts together and was ready to start the epoxy. Well I'm sure you know that the temperature and humidity had to be right. I had to wait six weeks until temp got above the 40's into a range I could work with. Fortunately, being retired, time is the one thing I have lots of.
So eventually I finished it See http://newboatbuilders.com/pages/fl12.html

But, like you, I learned a lot. One thing, make a detailed plan. Lay it out step by step. That way when you stop, you know exactly where you left off. You will probably have to shift things around as you go but at least you'll keep track of where you are. This is basic project management. Write down everything you do. Yes it's a pain in the ***, but you will be really glad you did when you get to some point where you have to tear something apart and do it over.

If you have the money, and a place to store them, go buy all your materials. But if you don't, buy only what you need and use the down times later to go get whatever you need.

Borrow a trick from the sports world. Visualize what you are going to do next. If you can't visulaize it, then the odds are you don't know how. Then it's time to ask for help. Drawing out what you are going to do helps (at least it helps me).

Remember, if you screw up, there is plenty more wood at the lumber yard. Burn your mistake in the fireplace and start over. This way it will have had a use, keeping you warm. Or you can throw it on your scrap wood pile and use it for something else.

Last but not least, be patient. Every boat build is a learning process, even production boats. Each time you build something you learn better ways to do it, or easier ways to do it. What the heck, I am still learning how to do a decent scarf.

Paint covers a multitude of sins!

Get back at it. Your gilrfriend must be a peach if she lets you use her garage. Hang on to her!

 

I truly believe that to build a large boat from scratch requires lunacy.
Nothing wrong with that. A mono-manic with a mission, nothing is going to stop him. A vision - a belief - The Tireless pursuit of the project. Very few people have that. I was very accustomed to building large projects because that is what I did for twenty years. Accustomed to failure, and had failures before and fixed them, had a limitless budget because I work for a living while I build the boat. So time and money was not issue.

I built a boat one time and found a major mistake after splashing it. I cut the Bow of the boat with a chainsaw and fixed it. This present boat got me a little by surprise because boat grew exponentially every 10 feet, huge difference between 45 foot boat and 65 foot boat. Same applies for difference between 20 footer and 30 footer. People simply try to build too much boat for their abilities.

 

Some how this seems about right for you . . .

 

Agreed.... I will always claim innocence for mental reasons...