seeing the world differently

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Dave Gudeman, Oct 23, 2011.

  1. Dave Gudeman
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 135
    Likes: 27, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 359
    Location: San Francisco, CA, USA

    Dave Gudeman Senior Member

    This article says that architects see the world differently from the way that normal people do and that this leads to buildings that look wonderful for architects but that normal people hate.

    I'd be curious to know what boat designers think of this. Do you think your education warped (OK, "changed" :) ) your esthetic judgment so that you literally see things differently from normal people? I have seen comments on this site that seem to be boat designers showing contempt for the esthetics of boat buyers. How widespread do you think that is?

    Please don't take this as a personal attack, anyone. I don't have any personal problem with modern boat designs; I'm just curious to know what designers think of this possibility.
  2. eyschulman
    Joined: Jul 2011
    Posts: 253
    Likes: 8, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 77
    Location: seattle Wa USA

    eyschulman Senior Member

    All the architects I know are as abnormal as everybody else.
  3. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,887
    Likes: 312, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    Of course this is absolutely true. Boat Buyers and Designers alike are subject to their own personal experiences and understandings.

    As someone who has tried to get designers interested in a concept, it is amazing how different people interpret the same 'brief' so .... differently .
  4. philSweet
    Joined: May 2008
    Posts: 2,550
    Likes: 319, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1082
    Location: Beaufort, SC and H'ville, NC

    philSweet Senior Member

    I think what is valued most is what can be hyped the easiest. As far as aesthetics are concerned, you're at the risk of the reviewer. With a feature, you can prime the pump. I think legal and marketing would prefer distinctiveness over beauty. I bet the vast majority of NAs never get asked to design a pretty boat.

    In the book 100 boat designs reviewed, the editor places special emphasis on designs for the designer himself, his family, and his friends. It is one of my favorite books.

    Oh, to answer your question directly- Yes, of course it does. I happen to think a '95 chevy pickup is one of the greatest works of art on the planet. Contrary to the saying, mostly, you can account for taste.
  5. hoytedow
    Joined: Sep 2009
    Posts: 5,853
    Likes: 392, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 2489
    Location: Control Group

    hoytedow Carbon Based Life Form

    I know what I like; practicality. It doesn't matter how pretty it is, but practical is pretty so it does matter after all, I guess.
  6. WillyG

    WillyG Previous Member

    Like this?

    Attached Files:

  7. peter radclyffe
    Joined: Mar 2009
    Posts: 1,420
    Likes: 66, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 680
    Location: europe

    peter radclyffe Senior Member

    if some architects were locked in and made to live forever in the ugly buildings they design, they would have time to see things differently
  8. peter radclyffe
    Joined: Mar 2009
    Posts: 1,420
    Likes: 66, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 680
    Location: europe

    peter radclyffe Senior Member

    have you read the
    Portland Cement Self Help book for Architects
  9. peter radclyffe
    Joined: Mar 2009
    Posts: 1,420
    Likes: 66, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 680
    Location: europe

    peter radclyffe Senior Member

  10. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
    Posts: 1,868
    Likes: 92, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 1146
    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    Peter my money maker is not boats, most of my boat builds are quazi profitable so in order to live I build or oversee the construction of homes. The most beautiful along with the ugliest have been designed by architects. The most pratical, long lasting, and low maintenance rarely. The problem being house design is their canvas and they all want to paint the perfect picture regardless of the aftereffects. 25% of the homes I have been asked to build or project manage on behalf of the customer I have walked away from because I couldn't convince them of the high cost, high maintenance and impraticle monster they were about to build. Having said that every once and awhile I meet one that is open to input and just a pleasure to work with .
  11. water addict
    Joined: Jun 2004
    Posts: 317
    Likes: 6, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 73
    Location: maryland

    water addict Naval Architect

    Naval Architecture is engineering, and schools train nav archs as such. Architecture and engineering are very different vocations. Architects by and large are trying to make an asthetic statement. Engineers want something that efficiently serves a need or purpose based on customer requirements.

    Yacht designers may have more of an asthetic bent than the more general field of naval architects. A yacht designer is not a naval architect, unless he/she has the formal engineering training. And the formal engineering most definitely makes one see the world differently- I am a naval arch. and my mind has been bent. Everywhere I look I see forces, moments, accelerations, fluid flow, etc.!
  12. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
    Posts: 1,868
    Likes: 92, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 1146
    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    Exactly, as such one would also be more aware of cause and effects but would you be open to input or constructive critisim from the worker that has to put it all together. Therein I feel lies the magic of maximizing the product. That co-respect is so important in forming a succesful team. Been there stayed with some walked from others.
  13. aranda1984
    Joined: Jan 2010
    Posts: 62
    Likes: 8, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 101
    Location: Vancouver, B.C.

    aranda1984 aranda1984

    The following is an opinion! Mine!!!

    With due respect, there are two basic types of Engineers (professionals) in paractically every field.

    The first type, the succesful ones, do things by the book, they seem to be more conservative in design, more strict in life etc.
    They normally end up as heads of their departments.

    If they learned their craft well, then they will do a fairly decent job as professionals. (Otherwise, they are good politicians.)

    The other type, the ones who have also learned the craft, but have an added artistic talent.
    These people might appear a bit more unorthodox. The most important thing for them is creative fereedom! (What is that?)
    They might dress more casually, they might behave in a more flaky way... (sorry)
    However, they can dream up beautiful lines, lovely curves, it is in their blood.
    These beautiful lines might even fit inside the engineering requirements of the project.

    Very frequently they are overruled by the first group or by bean counters.

    This lucky combination of art and science mostly comes out only in projects they do for themselves!

    There is another point worth to mention:
    Art is in the eye of the beholder! (...Ain't that the truth!)

    And this is why some artist can sell a clear white canvas in a black frame, call it something outrageous and get a million dollar for it.
    ..or design a 40 some meter long yacht with stairways going to heaven.. (we have seen it here!)

    In my five decades of engineering, the most problem I had was convincing ignorant people on the merit of a good design. It was obvious to any professional, but people who knew nothing held the purse strings.
    ... Or introducing a new line or shape to one who did not behold beauty in his eyes!

    Yes. Creative people sometimes do look a bit different. They certainly act different!
    They do not repeat the obvious. They need to come up with something new!
    ... Something different, maybe something better!

    Most perceptions in life are subjective. This is why the same thing can appear so drastically different to two people!
    The old saying: every coin has two sides is true, but sometimes the important stuff is printed on the edge!

    There goes my perspective!


    Stephen I. M.
  14. Squidly-Diddly
    Joined: Sep 2007
    Posts: 1,836
    Likes: 145, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 304
    Location: SF bay

    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    Archies I've met want awards from peers, and don't care too much

    about the people who use their building afterwards.

    Some of that seems to come from each building being such a unique case it is hard for blame to find the architect afterwards. Too many other factors muddy the waters.

    Recently, a fad has been imitation "converted industrial building lofts" for apartment or condo design. These are supposed to imitate dwellings created when artists and hippies turned abandoned industial buildings into "lofts". For some reason they all have a top floor with front door, kitchen, bath, dining, and a long narrow steep staircase to a lower bedroom without any door between. Really god awful once the novelty wears off in about 10 minutes, or the 3rd time you use the stairs. Not good for the knees to suddenly climb stairs without warmup, even if you are 14yrs old. Bad HVAC due to big vertical dimension. Bad use of space and materials. Real ***** if something goes wrong with MEP.

    Land Architects get away with nonsense not possible for Naval Architects.

    Some very sensible and practical architecture can be found in CA housing tracts from builders such as Kaufman&Broad. "McMansions". Just nice and liveable, everything where you tend to use it. Just feels right, and you never think about it. Cheaply built but it works and seems to last OK. Lots of low key passive energy saving tricks like placement of overhangs and windows in relation to sun, seasons and room usage. Houses laid out in relation to each other to minimize neighbor conflicts in everything from "eyeballing" to backing out of driveways, to where the garbage cans are stored.

    I don't think they get awards, probably get bashed by snooty peers.

  15. Poida
    Joined: Apr 2006
    Posts: 1,189
    Likes: 51, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 497
    Location: Australia

    Poida Senior Member

    Dave, good thread, I was considering posting something similar myself.

    I have worked in several industries over the years and each new I have learned new skills and view things differently.

    Such as, I used to erect patio roofs, and now when I see a patio roof, I automatically look at the structural design and workmanship rather than just simply look at it as a whole.

    And so it makes me wonder about people who have all the design knowledge on boats. Do they analyse all the lines of the boat in regard to performance, stability and C.O.G and whatever.

    Or can they just look at a boat like I do, place for the fishing rods, tackle box there, seating for my mates. She'll do.

    I love boats and my ignorance of boat design.

    I love those old timber boats with a diesel donk that chugs along at about 5 knots and probably a boat designers eyesore.
Similar Threads
  1. prathab
  2. lewisboats
  3. Squidly-Diddly
  4. wmonastra
  5. mustafaumu sarac
  6. Squidly-Diddly
  7. thenewguy
  8. clmanges
  9. jon haig
  10. Adrenaline Pwr
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.