Rubberised paint for steel decks?

Discussion in 'Metal Boat Building' started by Mollymawk, Jan 23, 2011.

  1. Mollymawk
    Joined: Jan 2011
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    Mollymawk New Member

    Hello,

    We live aboard a steel boat, and one annoyance is that the gets so cold as to be very unpleasant to sit on at night, or even to stand on when on night watch (we have to use rubber mats and/or wear shoes). Of course, this problem will only get worse as we travel to higher latitudes.

    One solution we are considering is building a wooden lining to the cockpit, however I am not a big fan of this approach. And it still leaves the rest of the deck being cold.

    A few days ago I mentioned the problem to Nick Skeates. He told me that he once came across a steel boat which solved the problem by using a rubberised paint with rubber dust - ground-up car tyres - mixed into it.
    Apparently the deck didn't feel at all cold, as this paint provided enough insulation, and it was also very durable - apparently the owner showed this by dropping a winch handle from head height onto the deck to show how it bounced off!

    I am, naturally, very curious about this coating and wonder if anyone has any experience of it or knows what sort of paint might work.

    I would have thought that the rubberised paint might not adhere very well to the hard paint below (epoxy or polyurethane), and that this might encourage rust underneath due to trapped moisture. I would also have thought that the coating would have to be very thick to provide the desired insulative properties which would prevent the deck from getting so cold.

    I have searched the web without finding much of relevance; the closest thing being MikeJohns' comment in a post on this forum which mentions using rubberised swimming-pool paint for its non-slip properties. I wonder if it also makes the deck warmer to the touch as described above?

    Thanks,
    Caesar
     
  2. LP
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    LP Flying Boatman

    You might have a look at this stuff.

    http://www.durabakcompany.com/marine.htm

    I'm considering using it on the cabin sole a boat that I plan to fish out of. Epoxy over plywood though. I can't really give you a YEA or NEA on it either.
     
  3. Mollymawk
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    Mollymawk New Member

    Thanks LP, that looks like the sort of thing - in fact, it might even be the product which Nick Skeates' friend used. I had assumed it was a home-made mixture, but I see that Durabak mention using recycled rubber tyres on their home page...

    Another similar-looking thing I just came across is http://www.sanitred.com/BoatRepair.htm, and possibly http://www.promain.co.uk/product/ProtectaKote_Rubber_AntiSlip_for_Floors_Vehicles_Boats_Ramps_id3359 - though there is less info on the latter.

    If anyone has any experience of actually using one of these products on a steel deck, I'd be grateful.
     
  4. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    These polyurethane coatings are gaining acceptance in the retail markets now after several years and a few generations of development. There are a few different types, but all work similarly chemically, though the filler materials vary widely. The most common filler is polyurethane waste (ground up polyurethane pellets of various sizes), some use rubber, probably as a marketing tool more then anything else, others ground up Kevlar and well frankly just about every other material you can think of.

    These products fall into two different categories, moisture cure (true polyurethanes) and cyanoacetate (activated) cure of which there are two sub groups. Common products from these coatings are truck bed liners, tank sealers, elastomeric roof coatings, industrial coatings, ballistic films, etc.

    Like everything they have good and bad points to consider. The good are they are tough, durable, weather and chemical resistant, plus can offer some thermal insulation and isolation. With some of the formulations you can brush or roll it on. Many come with large particulate fillers to act as anti skid or a surface texture, though it can also be had or applied with a smooth finish. Most can be painted. On the bad side of the coin is the gloss retention on most truly sucks and they chalk up pretty quickly. On a bridge this isn't such a big deal. Then can be difficult to apply, especially the high percentage cyanoacetate cure formulations, which also happen to preform the best. These are the really good coatings that can be sprayed on a block wall and 5 minutes later have a car bomb go off next to it with significantly reduced damage. Some of these coatings are being tested for bottom paint replacement, because they don't let things grow on them very well.

    In the end I'm not sure what to recommend, but the research is ongoing and long term testing has the jury still out. Steel is one of the products I tested this stuff on in recent years, but it wasn't my focus, so I didn't record long term results for steel, just general physical properties with age. I was after wood and 'glass results and the products I was testing proved very enlightening. I should also add that the US military is now using these coatings all over it's equipment to protect from the elements, moisture and chemical contamination.
     
  5. girvin
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    girvin Junior Member

    Hey Par what is the leading brand in your opinion?
     
  6. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    I'd be interested in how this bottom paint substitution is turning out??....particularly as I'm looking at both an older wooden boat application, and a steel cylinder floation application.
     
  7. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Brian, your "substitutions" are precisely why I agreed to take the testing and non-disclosure agreement on. I can't revel the brands, though the high cyanoacetate content formulations are the best for DIY'ers. On metal it's working very well and some municipalities are using it on their structures. The oil rig guys have fallen in love with it, so has the military, but they use the complicated, spray only two part formulations. These are pure polyurethanes and imposable to apply by hand. On wood they've shown promise, but the long term jury is still out.

    As a general guide, the hull needs to be tight (freshly repaired and caulked) and fairly dry, externally. And lastly, you can always paint over the coating (which is damn thick, like 30 mils, so not light) if you have issue with the color or anti foul properties. I can say it's better then any paint or coating system I've seen, baring a pure Teflon sheathing. Eventually all coatings will develop a scum line and light "haze" on the bottom, which then progresses into growth. These products permit easy maintenance, which is the whole point and the growth is easily scrubbed of with a brush or even a pressure washer. I know I've beat around the bush pretty good (intentionally), but I hope that helps you Brian.
     
  8. CaptBill
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    CaptBill CaptBill

    Epoxyproducts.com has rubber chips and some experience with this technique. It it quite a job and lots of steps involved but is very rewarding from what I hear.

    http://www.epoxyproducts.com/6_nonskid.html

    Might be just as cheap to find someone who does truck bedliners to come out with their spray setup. Have it a taped ready to spray for then and it's a 30 min job. An idea anyway.
     
  9. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Epoxy wouldn't be the choice and it's much different then the polyurethanes that are showing so much promise. Truck bed liner on the other had is what I'm talking about and very effective. It's not something you can just
    as it requires special tape and prep, but with some familiarity, you could.
     
  10. CaptBill
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    CaptBill CaptBill

    Could be right. I was just suggesting 'subing' out the spraying may be the most efficient route. Do I think they can handle prepping it though? Probably can to some degree. If you see the nice edge they do on a bedliner and the question is ' how did you get that nice of an finished edge?' and 'is taping how to do that'. So, now that you mention it, probably best to let them do that too.
     
  11. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

  12. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Yep, seen them both and am on board with a different formulator. That particular brand uses a the low cyanoacetate formulation, which can be rolled and brushed. I've been working with the higher end stuff with the higher levels of curing agent. The product I'm working with will flash in 20 seconds or less, so is completely unsuitable for hand application. Hell, it's hard to apply with a gun (wet edge), unless you've wasted a few gallons of product first learning.
     
  13. Herman
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    Herman Senior Member

    There is also a very usable product from MAP Yachting in France. Perhaps not suitable for the US market, but for Europeans it is quite easily available.
     
  14. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member


  15. indianbayjoe
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    indianbayjoe Senior Member

    how about spray on or roll on truck bed liner
     
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