Requesting Small Sternwheeler hull design and analysis help

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by phrogjlf@yahoo, Nov 18, 2014.

  1. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    Asking for help with hull design and analysis. I think I know what I think the hull should be like, but I'm a carpenter, not a designer. Even 'Windows Paint' is hard for me to work with, much less any kind of analysis software. If I can get the hull planned, I can make a model. Once I have a model of the hull, everything else should be a snap to finish.

    Thanks In Advance,
    Jeff F.
    Cedar Creek, Texas
     
  2. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    I would like to help. Can you show a drawing or sketch of what you want?
     
  3. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    Thanks, I really appreciate the help! I can try...

    Here is a sternwheeler hull design that should help:

    [​IMG]

    Original hull and deck are here:
    http://www.philspaddleboat.com/supplimental-boat-plans.html

    1st step would be to expand the original hull to 7 ft 6 in beam and the deck outline.

    Here is a Lafitte Skiff, used on many Louisiana Shrimp boats, that ravel the bays and bayous and other shallow areas, beaching, to land, without being stuck. I figure I need about half the deadrise (angle from the keel, outward):

    [​IMG]

    I think the center section, forward of and between the paddle wheel arms needs to be more of a cross between the sternwheel design and the Lafitte Skiff, with about 1/2 the deadrise. outside that, I still need the sternwheel arms and the rectangular well. In scaling up, I need the internal rectangular section of the hull to be have a 7 ft 6 in beam and length to be 12 ft, for the cabin. Side decks will be removable, overhanging the hull, foredeck will be partially supported and partially overhanging, like the original Showboat.

    The well, for the paddlewheel should be scaled up, to match. I also will be mounting a pair of trolling motors between the hull and wheel, modified as rudders, but also as alternate power/emergency power. The paddle wheel will actually be dual wheels, so a real keel can transition back to divide that and provide a bearing mount. The trolling motors/rudders will be centered on each wheel.
     
  4. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

  5. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    I guess the first thing you need is someone to do a body lines plan for your boat. For this purpose you have shown 4 ships with totally different hulls, besides the "original hull and deck ". It would be good that you decide for any of them and tell us the main dimensions you want for your boat.
     
  6. SamSam
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    SamSam Senior Member

    If you go to the bottom of the page you'll find "Similar Threads". Try one of those and for each thread you look at there will be more "Similar Threads". There is some good info in all these different threads and also some links to other stern wheel sites.

    Also try the 'search' function at the top for this site as a whole or 'search this thread' for the various forums individually.
     
  7. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    I'm easy. Not trying to make this difficult.

    Here's the Showboat with a profile of the Selway, scaled for intended hull length to match the inner hull length from bow to wheel opening, and I don't know how to do the wheel arms.

    [​IMG]

    I don't mind simplifying, heck putting flat pieces together is easier than compound curves. Problem with the original and the Selway is that they are essentially flat across the bottom. I'm in a muddy area, or it wouldn't be a problem. Sand, grass, no problem, mud is a big problem, with a flat bottom. Heck the thing could be simplified to a jon-boat, but I need some deadrise, to be able to work loose from mud. With deadrise, I can wiggle the stern, left and right, to loosen the bow, or I can rock side-to-side to loosen the hull.

    I also could use a bit more transition from the bottom to the transom, for better water flow to the wheels. Why the Selway doesn't do that, I don't know.

    The original paddlewheel builds like 2 wheels. Making 2 separately powered wheels gives me a powered means of wiggling loose and helps with maneuvering.

    Since she'll be electric, I'll have batteries to shift as ballast.

    I'm not trying to make it harder, I just don't really know how to answer better, so I'm sure I'm not even asking myself all the correct questions.
     
  8. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    I get "Scaling and Ballast" and "Boat Design" at the bottom, and I searched, best I know how, here, with Google, and at the Wooden Boat Forums, before asking for help. Trying to escape that flat bottom, because I have clay and silt mud, where I am. Instant suction, for a flat-bottom boat.
     
  9. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    Maybe simply angle the transom down and forward to where the waterline meets the profile, for the aft transition, to feed water to the wheels?
     
  10. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    Now I said jon-boat, this popped up in a search, and it was here in the forum...

    guest03062010
    Guest

    Posts: n/a
    here u go wolfgang
    here i made this small 3.5m low angle bottom hope u can use it
    attaching a pic with measurements and freeship+ file so u can play with
    and adjust some measurements

    /mike


    [​IMG]
     
  11. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

  12. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    A cat would push the cabin and the deck up too high, and sits too deep for what I'm on, along the Colorado River, East of Austin.

    Trying to keep the deck at a level that swimmers can pull up, out of the water, and pushing the cabin up makes it too top heavy. With the main cabin at hull-depth, I can push the wheelhouse section up to deck level and see aft, over the cabin. To keep visual scale, I'll have walls from just above the bottom to about 5 ft 6 in, then a mollicroft down the middle, for headroom (like lowering the sides of a bus roof, down to the shelf level, but leave the aisle high, with headroom and windows for light and ventilation). Then step up, like an old tugboat, to the 'wheelhouse', at main deck level.

    She's not a live-aboard, but room enough to crash-out and carry the stuff to go camping. Kind of the teardrop-trailer of sternwheelers. Take along a port-a-potty, camp stove, cooler and water, and you're set for a weekend trip... Day-time escape from the house, as my own space.
     
  13. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    I don't know how to really push and pull on a design, but I think that jon-boat is more workable than the others, if given a profile more like the Selway, and an angle to the transom, it should be right on the money, for this. If I had found it first, this would have been easier, already.

    Nice thing about a sternwheeler, the wheel doesn't extend much, if any, below the hull. They can snick into marsh and swamp, as well as shallow rivers and streams.
     
  14. TANSL
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    TANSL Senior Member

    In general, the height of the deck over the water must have a minimum value, called freeboard, established by the regulations, that does not depend on the type of boat that is, mono-hull or catamaran.
    I'm sorry but due, probably, to my inability with the English language, I am not able to know what you want. I withdraw from this discussion. Good luck with your project.
     

  15. phrogjlf@yahoo
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    phrogjlf@yahoo JL Frusha

    I can find no such requirement, other than for commercial cargo vessels, as a load-line. Even commercially made private vessels do not seem to have more than a flotation requirement, which will be provided for, in my little boat, by flotation foam.

    I appreciate your interest in safety and thank you for your time. As well, I thank you for the prompting that led to me finding the jon-boat hull design. Unless someone else offers to assist, so that software can be used, I will be venturing into the design and construction, as best I can.

    I expect the freeboard to be around 12 in-16 in, with an additional lip, around the edge of the passenger compartment, inside the cabin wall, above the hull, to provide additional resistance to the ingress of water. This design has sufficed for many types of vessels, for centuries, and can be seen even on cargo skiffs, where the cargo cover comes down, over it, and cargo is loaded into the hold. The cabin structure will rest on the hull, outside that lip, but will be attached and sealed to it, as well. A typical hull, of these general dimensions, if made commercially, would be rated for as many as 8 people.

    By placing an extended deck, outward from the hull, at that 12 in-16 in height, Swimmers should have access to the deck, as I intend. Many commercial vessels have a similar provision, with an open stern, for easy access to the water, including dive boats and charter fishing boats.
     
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