refrigeration gas or elec

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by taezow, Sep 14, 2010.

  1. Fanie
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Well Yipster, your guys in the Netherlands make a VERY efficient cooler system but won't supply to us. Said it's for 'special' applications only.

    Last time we went fishing we took a fridge with a danfoss compressor on a 100Ah battery. The fridge lasted 3 days without any problems, the battery was charged from a generator every second or third day. Never did not have cold cool drinks.

    Thumb suck the freezer runs for a few hours two or three times in 24 hours. If it runs conservatively for 2 hours at a time @ 2.8S it's 6Ah required. While a solar panel is connected during the day no power is drained from the battery even when the fridge is on. So if the freezer is on twice at night you're looking very conservatively at around 12Ah.

    I know lots of guys who have freezers with those danfoss compressors. They are all very impressed with it's power consumption and performance. A decent solar panel with about a 100 to 120Ah (or more) battery should give a life expectancy of about 5 years on the battery. If you use a good quality SLA battery, it may even go beyond that.
     
  2. Fanie
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Don't confuse a danfoss with the peltier cooler rubbish you get. Peltier coolers are extremely unefficient, they work well on camera's for cooling the image chip down for instance but not suitable for fridge use.
     
  3. taezow
    Joined: Jul 2009
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    Location: Ca USA

    taezow Junior Member

    I don't want to cover my boat in solar panels.

    I'm thinking an 80 watt panel, which will fit nicely, 1 battery and small generator.

    Adding batteries and panels for the off times of cloudy, or really hot weather, or even extensive use, would weigh and cost more than a generator. I can count on a generator but not the weather.

    The cheapest way to go would be gas fridge, an 50 watt panel, and one battery. I would have to gimbal the fridge or maybe just shim it on long reaches. And get propane every couple of weeks.
     
  4. cavalier mk2
    Joined: Mar 2010
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    Location: Pacific NW North America

    cavalier mk2 Senior Member

    The cheap way to go is to drink the beer warm! Lighter too.....
     
  5. yipster
    Joined: Oct 2002
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    Location: netherlands

    yipster designer

    "I know lots of guys who have freezers with those danfoss compressors. They are all very impressed with it's power consumption and performance"

    had a few fridges in the past and there is no need for a new one at the moment but i hear you: danfoss compressor
     
  6. catsketcher
    Joined: Mar 2006
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    Location: Australia

    catsketcher Senior Member

    Can't keep away

    Kankama's fridge is a Danfoss BD50 compressor driving a lamellar evaporator. On about 30% of the time - more in really hot weather when we use ot to cool water for drinks. Still about 20 AH I have to find every day before lights and autopilot.

    Every cruiser I met who used solar panels on their first season got more solar panels if they had a fridge. But these were long term cruisers.

    cheers

    Phil
     
  7. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    Comments in blue...

     
  8. cavalier mk2
    Joined: Mar 2010
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    cavalier mk2 Senior Member

    Don't forget a CO2 detector and a propane alarm. You really need both with a gas system. I read an old article that told of one boater's problem caused by metal corrosion flakes built up under the fridge pilot. Cleaning out cured the problem.
     
  9. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    Someone mentioned "Engel" earlier but never expanded on the subject

    I now submit this interesting product from Engel that was just recently sent to me. Does anyone have practical experience with any of their products?
    http://www.engel-usa.com/MB40V.html

    I found this detail about their unique compressors interesting, particularly their low start-up power draw, and their economy:
    http://www.engel-usa.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=80&Itemid=70

    Haven't looked far enough to see if it can be combined with holding plate technologies, or even if that complication would be needed?
     
  10. brian eiland
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

  11. aussiebushman
    Joined: Oct 2009
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    Location: Taralga NSW

    aussiebushman Innovator

    I have used an ENGEL fridge for some years and can highly recommend them as excellent examples of the best Japanese manufacturing. The only complaint is that the cases are mild steel and over time they will develop rust spots. Maybe wipe them over with fish oil? Just watch they have not gone the way of Makita and now manufacture in China!

    I suggest you go back to the comments by Richard Woods and Phil about consumption figures, My Engel pulls 5 amps on a 50% cycle so thats 60 amps a day. On my new trimaran nearing completion, I will fit 2 X 40 watt solar panels onto a stern arch to charge a 100A deep cycle battery then use a 750w petrol generator a couple of hours a day to top up while I'm working on the computer.

    Good luck

    Alan
     
  12. CDK
    Joined: Aug 2007
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    Location: Adriatic sea

    CDK retired engineer

    At the time, the Engel compressor was the very best product for small refrigerators.
    But with the development of inexpensive MOSFET inverters companies like Waeco switched to small sealed-for-life rotating compressors that perform just as well and retain their refrigerant indefinitely.
     
  13. mikereed100
    Joined: Jan 2007
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    Location: Borneo/California

    mikereed100 Junior Member

    Concerning loss of energy from front loaders, I don't think this is as much of an issue as people believe. Before building my refrigerator I did some calculations and found that the energy required to bring 6 cu. ft. of air from 40C to 0C was less than 1 amp/hr IIRC. Actual numbers would be more like 30C to 10C, requiring less than .5 amp/hrs. Balance that against listening to my wife curse me every time she has to dig through a top loader for the cheese and it seems pretty cheap. I compromised and used a drawer for the fridge with a small top loading freezer. Wife is happy, batteries are happy, beer is cold.

    Mike
     
  14. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    you can find engles in use at campsites all over australia, they are brilliant. also available now in stainless for marine use.
     

  15. whitepointer23

    whitepointer23 Previous Member

    you will also find an engle fridge in almost every long haul truck in australia, waeco are the next most popular.
     
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