Refinishing plywood panels on flybridge

Discussion in 'Wooden Boat Building and Restoration' started by sdowney717, Jul 25, 2020.

  1. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    https://goo.gl/photos/xghMmuFVaGLXUBq86
    Dishwasher drain pump used for the cruiseair heat exchanger.
    Works really well, and they are cheap. The entire Heatpump electric circuit is on a GFCI-AFCI breaker, and no nuisance trips.
    These pumps are entirely sealed, they impeller is magnetically driven and is a centrifugal pump. It fills a 5 gallon bucket in a minute, and they use very little electric power.
     
  2. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

  3. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/aW1BwxG3fVTVHR5M7
    Here I recarpeted the boat. I did the whole boat but not showing all those pics. I had to cut a groove in the hatches so the carpet could fold over and look smooth. I stapled it down with SS staples. This caroet was in someone LR, and was in pretty good shape, they had tossed it to the curb. It cleaned up about like new. And had enough to do it all. Had to piece some sections together. I used wall board tape and PL on the back side to join smaller sections into one.
     
  4. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Here was my 2014 haulout
    https://goo.gl/photos/Y876jwe1jceTp9Zz6

    I had no bottom paint on the hull for years, so it grew a lot of stuff. It was actually a test of the Sanitred Permaflex as they said the boat would clean itself, HOWEVER that might be true if you go over 15 mph all the time!, and most of the time it just sits in the slip. So that was 5 years of growth, so yes it was slow as molasses after all those years. I did not want to use any more permaflex, so moved on to the Black PL, which I can buy locally and actually is a superior product, IMO. That stuff has stayed on the hull just fine and with the real bottom paint has stayed much cleaner. I actually get in the water once a year and scrape it off by hand using a garden hoe I modified.
     
  5. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Added more pics. I painted bullseye primer on as a tell tale, then sanded it all smooth with 220 grit.
    I then popped any left over bubbles I could find. Used epoxy on the plywood edges to seal and smooth them flat.
    Sanded it smooth again.
    then painted on a coat of Minwax Gloss polyurethane. I plan to put on several coats sanding it smooth again.
    Then I will paint on a Rustoleum Latex tan colored paint I have to give it some contrast with all the white on the boat.

    The other plywood I had put an indoor -outdoor blue carpet on with glue, and after 10 years it had rotted and grown moldy, so I ripped that all off. To finish removing the glue, will use a heat gun and carbide scraper. Then will paint the poly on the plywood to seal all the little cracks and paint it white.

    Looking real smooth and solid now.
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/Bk2hNbsX6LW69Z7s9
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  6. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
    Posts: 4,281
    Likes: 737, Points: 123, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: usa

    fallguy Senior Member

    Epoxy would have been easier. Takes some smarts to thicken correctly and avoid having it kick.
     
  7. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    My experience with epoxy I bought 10 years ago a 3 gallon kit of DOW DER 331 epoxy was not very good. The resin seemed ok, but the hardener was lousy. I still have some of that epoxy but the hardener is dried up and worthless. Do you happen to know of a replacement hardener I could use it up then.
     
  8. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I added more pics to the album. Got the acorn brown paint on the top piece. and the other flat plywood panels resurfaced. The experiment with the MINWAX polyurethane did not stop it from checking after a multi day rain and then drying it again, small cracks appeared. So I sanded all that off (where compass sits), and used same method with fibreglass cloth tape and the PL Premium glue, and that has been good. Filled, smoothed with 220 grit, got all the bubbles out, than this time I layered on a thin coat of DAP Dynaflex 230. Will sand that (you can sand it after it dries and thin layers dry, forms a tough rubbery surfacing), then paint it.
    The other mostly hidden white plywood panel, I am trying something else. after painting it with Bulls eye primer. I slathered on a thin coat of bondo, sanded smooth and painted with more of that primer. That has been holding up without checking again, so far, and it is staying on ok. To prevent plywood from checking, you need to resurface with another layer of something other than paint.

    I am thinking next time try using Black PL polyurethane roof and flashing with the fiberglass tape for plywood surfacing, that does not bubble, and it stays on wood smeared on in thin layers. I have had extensive use of that, and it is also a great adhesive glue, it is very similar to 3M 5200 and it can be sanded smooth and flat. The fiberglass tape gives it an ability to attain a uniform thickness versus just smearing on a layer.
    Those 2 front plywood boards, I reshaped the contour to match the brown flat panel better, then smeared on a layer of epoxy to seal the edge. Both those boards I sealed in epoxy over 10 years ago, and have been fine staying flat and not checking.

    20200818_111540.jpg
     
  9. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I removed the failed epoxy coating on one exterior panel, the others are fine. It failed years ago and I just lived with it. It had bubbled and was loose in spots and tight in spots. I used a heat gun and a scraper, and it was a tough job in 90* + full sun.
    I added a section of wood to fill out the rim wood wider. When I rebuilt this 15 years earlier, I never actually finished it better. I went looking for EggHarbor pictures, how the flybridges looked and there are still some more original looking ones left and saw it needed to be wider. Simply cut it out from a deck board, rift sawn piece, and glued with Black PL and screwed it on.
    I then belt sanded the rim wood, and orbit sanded the plywood.
    Then coated a layer of black PL all over this panel. Next day plan to sand it smoother, and refill the low spots with a thin smear coat. Then primer and roll on some Acrylic paint.
    I have done various exterior parts of this boat the same way. All around the front windows and the aft planks to the waterline. It absolutely prevent water from penetrating, and it stays flexible.
    There is one downside, if you use a gloss oil based enamel paint that gets hard, eventually the paint surface cracks, because oil paint actually shrinks over time and gets BRITTLE. Acrylic latex has been ok painted over this black rubber. This black PL does a good job of staying on dry treated woods and is a very good glue.
    It easily can be forced into wood cracks and it does not swell. Has a chocolate type smell as it cures.
    it is just like 5200, but it is easy to spread with a wide knife. I could have used some fiberglass tape, but it really does not need it, but it probably makes it easier to get a uniform thickness. O the wooded pics, you can see how the black PL looks when sanded flat. Very smooth and not too hard.
    20200821_140703.jpg 20200821_140648.jpg 20200821_125417(0).jpg 20200821_125401(0).jpg
     
  10. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Sanded flatter today and recoated. Basically all you do is sand off the highs, then refill the lows. Maybe one more sand and fill then paint. It has been drying in a day so hot and humid out. When you sand, it creates little rubber balls. So you can vacuum and brush them off with a towel.
    What I am doing prevents the plywood surface from checking. That is the main problem of plywood painting. What I am doing also prevents the wood from moisture cycling, so any paint that goes on will stay on better. I also dont have to mix epoxy, deal with fiberglass cloth or get sensitized to epoxy, or spend a lot of money on materials. When done, I will have used up about 5 tubes of Loctite roof and flashing polyurethane, about $35. Wish I could buy it in the large 28oz tubes. Panel is about 6.5 feet by 2.5 feet.
    20200822_125422.jpg 20200822_115207.jpg

    Other things I have done before final paint is smear on Dap Dynaflex 230 for smoothing off some small low spots, but if it is cool or damp out, dont do that, it can take week or even 10 days or worse to harden in poor weather. Cured DAP can also be sanded smooth.
     
  11. Chotu
    Joined: Mar 2018
    Posts: 65
    Likes: 6, Points: 8
    Location: Florida

    Chotu Junior Member

    VERY interested in this thread.

    I can't use epoxy because I'm highly sensitized to it and must use alternative materials for a complete interior build from the bilge up.

    Do you have suggestions on the lightest weight, fastest built way to do cabinetry and shower stall and stuff using off the shelf materials like this?

    I have been trying high density XPS foamular foam with Formica/Wilsonart faces. Not sure if wood might just be even more lightweight. It seems like it is.

    I've been asking for years and mostly no one knows the answer. I have a feeling you do.

    I'd like the cabinets to be ultra light and be glossy white like a white iPhone looks.

    Thoughts?
     
  12. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Sure, finish the cabinet and surfaces using perhaps this black PL product laid in a sheer fiberglass light weight cloth. I did not use any cloth, and it does work out fine without cloth, but maybe cloth will allow you to form a smooth consistent layer over the wood or other materials surface. Try as an experiment to see. The black PL sticks to everything, and it will be 100% waterproof too and very durable against cracking as it prevents the wood from moisture cycling. Simply lay down a thin layer of Black Pl, stretch the cloth over it, and force it all smooth with a 6 inch or so putty knife. It is like soft butter consistency.

    Fill more black PL into the the cloth. Black PL is workable for hours, then dry the next day or 2 if cooler temps. But it is guaranteed to always cure. Put opened tubes in the freezer and it will stay good in the tube for months.
    Sand it smooth with 80 grit random orbit. It sands very easily, you will be surprised, honestly, you will be very surprised how smooth it can get.
    Wash off the rubber balls that form with water and a brush or a terry cloth towel, scrub the surface.
    Prime with 2 coats of Bullseye 123 primer, then finish paint with a high gloss white paint such as this Sherwin Williams.
    One benefit is cleanup is dish soap, water and a scrunge, and it comes off of everything before it cures very easy cleanup.
    No nasty chemical smells, it does have an odor, but not solvent odor, more like chocolate.
    Ok here are 3 smooth sanded rubber loctite black PL surface pics, as you can see totally smooth and pure appearance.
    And the paint I plan to use. A couple years ago used some Gloss Behr, and it was also good looking and shiny.
    Dont use an enamel paint, it will crack if it gets cold, the paint is brittle and the rubber allows for slight surface movement.
    20200825_084908.jpg 20200825_104020.jpg 20200825_104023.jpg 20200825_104044.jpg
     
  13. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Ok, here is the finished panel with 2 coats of white primer
    And here is a part of the deck. I had constant paint peeling issues in this spot from rain water swelling the wood. So this will stop that. And if you filling deeper layers, mix some wood sawdust into the Black PL so it cures in very thick layers, wood sawdust has moisture the material needs that to cure. You can see how rough this looks right now since I did use some sawdust mixed in in the center, but it will sand totally smooth.

    20200825_131243.jpg 20200825_131246.jpg

    Also, notice on my hull side, we had a storm and a metal dock bolt and nut sticks out from the piling and for hours the boat was slammed into that bolt and all it did was scrape off some white paint, it did not damage the Black PL, see back in 2014, I coated the aft entire hull side in black PL to waterproof the wood.

    Album link, this stuff is very tough and durable. A video shows the bolt sticking out. I have fixed the piling by covering the nut with wood, and that and the fenders it wont happen again. I just have not yet fixed the paint. Black PL is 100% uv proof, so it can be exposed without damage.
    https://goo.gl/photos/3YHHiPVPPu8vX5kn7
     
  14. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Sanded it smooth today, then later recoated, another sand then paint. I should have waited on more day as the thicker part was not fully cured and I used a belt sander and it tore loose an area the size of a dime. But it is easy to fix, cut it open with a knife, dig into it to explore the tear, just put some more Black PL mixed with a little sawdust back in there, and I will have to give it a few days longer before getting to paint it. You cant see it in this pic, But I noticed it when floating some more PL on top, it had a slight bubbled spot, which is where it tore. It did not tear the black PL from itself, it tore it from the wood. Another nice thing, unsanded black PL has a glossyness, so when your sanding it is easy to see what is not flat, since the sanded area is matte appearance.
    20200826_114901.jpg

    Originally this area had teak covering boards, which had rotted out the under structure, and a couple years ago, I rebuilt the entire back deck all the way around, and dont plan on replacing the teak. Where it buts up to the forward plywood, I should fit a beveled piece to make a smooth transition.

    I also found the paint I had used before which was good, so may use it again.
    BEHR PREMIUM PLUS 1 gal. Ultra Pure White Hi-Gloss Enamel Interior/Exterior Paint-805001 - The Home Depot https://www.homedepot.com/p/BEHR-PREMIUM-PLUS-1-gal-Ultra-Pure-White-Hi-Gloss-Enamel-Interior-Exterior-Paint-805001/100175675
     

  15. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
    Posts: 955
    Likes: 54, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 274
    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Ok, here is a more finished look of the side panel now. It still eventually could use a top covering board maybe 3 inches width bent along that curve all the way on the outer edge, which I have seen some boats use. Not sure how I would want to do that though. Typically such a trim piece would be painted or stained a brownish color. I suppose long strips of some kind of wood could be laid and glued to form a top, nut it really does not need it. It might be nicer if you sat in the seat to lay your arm on.
    20200906_105545.jpg

    I have a few tiny paint chips I have to fill in where when I was mounting the center biomin frame the wind was blowing and the ss piece dug into my paint job.
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.