Re-power recommendations

Discussion in 'Diesel Engines' started by Brian@BNE, Sep 27, 2012.

  1. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    Here you go,basic engine for $6700.
    Add a marine exhaust and starter for $1000 aftercooler maybe $400 and you are $8100.

    Not sure what the difference is between this and a "marine" engine but there are many old Dodge truck engines in boats around the world.I think it's mostly the rating.They use them in excavators operating at all angles.

    Phone and ask,in Oregon.
    http://www.mckaymarinediesel.com/

    I don't see why those 555s wouldn't fetch $2500 to $3000 each
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2012
  2. FAST FRED
    Joined: Oct 2002
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    Location: Conn in summers , Ortona FL in winter , with big d

    FAST FRED Senior Member

    "The point is, the 270HP engines are not enough to plane at 20 knots, yet far more than needed for displacement speeds. They are an in-between size. Sure I'd like to plane, but with the fuel bill that would result I would not do it often - I just don't need to rush back for work anymore."

    I would change the hoses and belts etc. and get insurance that you wont KILL them.

    Low oil or an overheat is about the only problems that would keep you from another 5000-8000 hours at modest trawler speeds.

    Murphy gauges offer mechanical gauges that can have adjustable set points that can ring an alarm ,or shut down the engine if required.

    When cruising most folks will be on auto pilot , and may have a guest as watch stander.

    The Murphy system will insure that a scan is not required from the watch stander , and is probably the best insurance you can find.

    Someday those old triple nickels will need removing , but it could easily be decades , IF you don't KILL them.
     
  3. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    Great info, this is looking to be the best solution.
     
  4. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    Fred
    You are spot on. But I think the hoses etc, 1 new water pump and reconditioning starters etc is going to add up to quite a bit. If I can do the changeover at prices West noted then it will be very attractive.
     
  5. WestVanHan
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    ..there should be an AO forum around somewhere...ask and maybe get some ideas as per hp from other owners-with the 555 it's likely others have gotten rid of them.
     
  6. jonr
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    jonr Senior Member

    If you pick the right prop for how you operate, you can have significantly oversized engines and get as good or better economy. Plus longer life. Ie, 3x more HP than you use is fine, it takes more like 10x before it becomes a significant economy issue.
     
  7. Aliboy
    Joined: May 2011
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    Aliboy Junior Member

    I agree with this. I have twin 330hp in my 43fter, and yes I burn 21gph (combined) at 18 - 20knts cruise, but at 7 - 8knts it is only 3 - 4 gph (maybe a bit less even at 7knts). I know other boats closer to your size with twin 600hp+ engines that only burn an extra gph or less at the same speeds. In my experience what is true however is that electronic diesels are more efficient at these lower rpm's than traditional mechanical diesels. There is a real question about whether you need to operate electronic diesels at 'cruise loads' like a traditional diesel, or whether they will happily work for long periods at lighter loads due to the more 'careful' engine control by the ECU. In my case I now have 4000 happy hours on my twin 330's that spend 90% of their life at 1200rpm rather than the rated 2400 - 2500rpm cruise. I do give them 15 - 30 mins at the end of each day at 2200rpm+, but other than that the throttles are mostly stuck at 1200rpm for my 8knts. Based on the fact that they still feel like new engines, I am guessing a life span of at least 8000hrs from these ones the way I operate them. Personally, in your situation I would probably look at a pair of larger capacity, but derated HP, common rail engines. Nothing less than the 5.9l Cummins in size.
     
  8. WestVanHan
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    It's more a concern about the 555s starting to nickel and dime.

    But yes as I've said many times,the bigger boats can get surprising mpg at slow speed.
    I have twin 635 Cummins QSM-53' and under 7 knots I burn ~2.5 gph which is over 3mpg.

    Over 11 knots to 30 knots it's the same mpg,but at 25 knots there's a sweet spot with the props and rpm and it gets 10% better mpg.
    So either do under 10 or sit at 25 if I'm in a rush.
     
  9. FAST FRED
    Joined: Oct 2002
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    Location: Conn in summers , Ortona FL in winter , with big d

    FAST FRED Senior Member

    But I think the hoses etc, 1 new water pump and reconditioning starters etc is going to add up to quite a bit. If I can do the changeover at prices West noted then it will be very attractive.

    There is NO WAY , a replacement of expendable parts like water hoses and belts will cost what a complete engine swop will cost.

    Rebuild the starters AND get a spare .

    The 555 was never a powerful engine , but at displacement speeds would be fine till killed..


    "I'm still accumulating info on how much power I really need."

    Just look in your log book ,an old big engine , not near its efficiency peak will create 15 hp per gallon of fuel per hour,at best.

    So if you are burning 10 GPH at slow cruse its close to 150 hp, .

    At SL .9 to 1.15 a boat uses a remarkable little fuel, but if you optomise for that speed there will be little extra for 40K headwinds or get home itis.
     
  10. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    FF
    Logbook records and flowscan info:
    1500 rpm 6 gph 7.2kn
    1750rpm 8 gph 9.1kn
    2000 rpm 13 gph 10.1kn
    But speeds are SOG, perhaps some current.

    These are cruising range data, and I'm happy enough with fuel use.
    So it looks like I'm using around 200HP for 10kn? How much more is prudent? 50% Double?

    Sure I could install a pair of 450HP ECU engines and maybe even achieve better fuel use at those cruise speeds, but the times I would have 'get home itis' badly enough to use that power and run at 17kn would be pretty rare so I have a lot of trouble justifying the upfront cost of big engines.
     
  11. powerabout
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    powerabout Senior Member

    555 only got a poor reputation way back because of the meat heads operating them had to learn the hard way they you need to put coolant in the cooling system instead of water

    Use Brians info and a power/bsfc curve to work out the horsepower in the curve and then you will know how the 6BT will compare
     
  12. russfest
    Joined: Jan 2013
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    russfest New Member

    Im kinda curious which place in North Van you are meaning. I contacted the local Cummins dealer in North Van today, just out of curiosity, and a complete 4BT 3.9L Marine Cummins engine I got quoted 22k each.
    Thats not even the 5.9 or bigger 6 cyl marine diesels.

    I did see the places online you mentioned as well, and have been looking into that. Buy the new long blocks, and buy the marine exchangers, starters and manifolds.

    For Brian@BNE I would recommend like WestVanHan suggested.. buy them out of the states nearer where you are. It will be cheaper there than coming up to Vancouver.
     
  13. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    I decided to install JD 6068 TFM's. More money than new complete 6BT's, but with significantly improved fuel economy at low cruise speeds. Subject to sea trials I think I'll have enough range to go from California to Hawaii.

    Currently have the old 555's advertised for $3000/pair.
     
  14. WestVanHan
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    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    Don't remember right now,on holidays..I'd consider a reman Cummins unit to be the same as a new one.

    $22k is an absolute rip off....I'd guess $6k with a reman unit,ready to go...
     

  15. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    When I was considering 6BT's, price was $16K, complete, everything required to install and fit.
     
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