Pulse 600 vs. humdinger & strike 20 & L7 & husky 6.0 & trinado

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by rapscallion, Dec 22, 2014.

  1. rapscallion
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    rapscallion Senior Member

    I'm excited to see corsair offer the Pulse 600, as it should renew interest in the beachcat/trimaran conversion efforts. It would be great to see more boats like this racing.

    Pulse 600 Specs
    L.O.A.: 19’ 8” (6m)
    Beam: 14’ 9” (4.5m)
    Beam folded: 6’ 11” (2.1m)
    Draft (hull only): 9” (0.22m)
    Draft D/B down: 3’ 11” (1.2m)
    Mast length: 31’ 2” (9.5m)
    Unladen weight: 816lbs 370kgs
    Mainsail: 184sqft (17.1m2)
    Jib: 80.7sqft (7.5m2)
    Spinnaker: 215.3sqft (20m2)

    The strike 20 specs are quite similar, except for the strike is lighter, and may be faster as a result.

    I have no doubt the L7 would be faster than the pulse 600, Russel Brown's Humdinger would be faster as well. I'm not sure where the Husky design would end up in the mix.

    I don't know what it would take for a trimaran of this size to reach critical mass and see a strong fleet form, but it would sure be nice to see it happen. The i550 design seems to be enjoying some popularity, what would it take to create a "formula 20ish" trimaran class for those who want the thrill of multihulls, but beachcats are a little much in terms of physical intensity.

    I just started racing beachcats, and I love it, but I have to travel to each and every regatta. There is a strong local lightning fleet, and I suspect many of those lightning sailors could get into a 20' trimaran and have a blast. Nothing wrong with lightnings, it's an awesome fleet - but what can we do to boost the number of multi racers out there?

    I think the strike 20 may be a good answer - some kind of formula 20 class that allows various beach cat trimaran conversions to compete would be fun. So why hasn't something like this ever reached critical mass?
     
  2. 2far2drive
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    2far2drive Senior Member

    I agree 100%. But I'm also a cheap *** so my answer seems to be, when a 20ft trimaran doesn't cost 25k!!!!! Its so hard for me to process that price when I used to own a beautiful little Catalina 25 mono that was slow yet very roomy and at 25yrs old, was the most awesome thing in the world to me. 50k fboats dont have the room that $3k Catalina had!

    I will never be able to afford a porche or some such so I bought a fast motorcycle. For 3k, I zip around at porche speeds and can out corner them on a good day while being more exposed to the elements. I'm waiting for boat design to take this approach. Fast, uncomfortable and cheap! I dont think it can ever happen. :(

    I'll stop being negative now. I think an F20 type class would be awesome! I wish there were more of these boats being built, sailed and reported about!
     
  3. rapscallion
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    rapscallion Senior Member

    The prototype L7 was built for about 6,000US, and the huskey 6.0 was built for about 4,500US. Both boats would be comfortable, compared to sport boats in the 7.5 meter or less range.

    Yes, the Pulse 600 is really expensive when you take the huskey 6.0, the strike 20 and the L7 into consideration. Lots of boats have tried to enter this space, the searail 19, Motive 20, (Motive 25 less so)

    The Diam 24 has a small fleet in europe, and there are multi 23's racing on the west coast.
     
  4. waynemarlow
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    waynemarlow Senior Member

    What does an ageing cat sailor population do, try to carry on finding ways and means to keep sailing on trapezes or do we all move over to soft comfy tramps on a Tri.
    I think there is a beginning of a groundswell of a 20ft Tri formulae with the availability of boats such as the Pulse and a number of home builds. I had heard rumoured that 4 Pulses are going to be in the Solent next year and others interested, if that is the case then that should be a basis of a mini fleet somewhere in the Solent.

    I think there was a start of evolving a T20 formulae here on boat design, Type into the search engine "T20" and it is there, unfortunately it's more than 2 years old and I can't bump it back to the top of threads.
     
  5. rapscallion
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    rapscallion Senior Member

    Exactly!

    I think the Husky 6.0 (or an equivalent "trinado" design) could easily give the pulse 600 a run for it's money, and a "trinado" could be built on a budget of 4000US, which includes the price of the Tornado catamaran.

    The strike 20 should also perform favorably against the Pulse 600. I hope the Pulse is popular, and a Formula 20 class could be built around the popularity of the pulse. Granted, I'll be sailing in a trap until I can't sail anymore. What I hope for is the ability to sail multihulls without having to travel several hours one way to participate in a regatta. We have a strong Lightning fleet, perhaps a few of them would come to the darkside if a formula 20 type fleet took off.
     
  6. waynemarlow
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    waynemarlow Senior Member

    I'm thinking your budget maybe a fair bit short if you want something that's reasonibly lively and has enough "fun" factor to keep any Cat sailor entertained. Riding out on the outer hulls whilst crashing along at 20knots is not un similar to trapezing and in a lot of ways a bit more scary as you are not held on by the trapeze.

    The upside with these little Tris is they have a dual role, certainly more than a big beachcat, in that they can be used for overnight coastal runs using a cockpit tent, the downside is that they are just big enough to be really a trailer launch at a ramp rather than straight off a beach, 180kgs is heavy enough, 280kgs is getting tough on the sand.

    I hope this T20 class does kick off, it's certainly needed in the market.
     
  7. Richard Woods
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    Richard Woods Woods Designs

    When I developed the micromultihull rules, over 30 years ago, I wanted to make sure that boats were not just C class cats under a different name. Because pure racing boats with no performance limits have a short life and no resale value, as the "arms race" ensures boats are outdated quickly.

    So I wrote a performance limit and a sensible accommodation requirement. Furthermore, not everyone is a skillful enough sailor to race a truly fast multihull. Thus production boats like the Firebird, F24, Dragonfly and Strider were all competitive and had a life after racing.

    That was not the case with the F40 and F28 classes which had no such limits

    So if you draw up rules don't make them so that boats only last a season before being outdated.

    Also make sure that boats are not just 3 hulled Tornados, otherwise what's the point? It seems peoples requirements have changed over the years. In the 1980's people did sleep on their boats during regattas, few do that now. So boats like the J700 and Melges 20/24 may have "cabins" but they are never slept in, just somewhere to store gear safely.

    So maybe the time is now right for a small multihull class that can do races like the inshore Swiftsure, Round the Island and 3 Bridge fiasco.

    Right now the only performance limit/rules I would suggest is that the mast length is limited to 31ft ish, (or whatever the Tornado mast is). Making a mast that is even a few inches longer will be very expensive given the limited market. And no trapezes or sitting out aids apart from toestraps. At least one hull to be in the water at all times

    The Strike 20 will use 10sheets of 6mm ply - so maybe USD600 for ply, and maybe USD2000 for a complete main hull including glass/epoxy/timber. You can buy complete F18, Hurricane 5.9's etc from about USD1000 in the UK, so USD4000 is a good benchmark for costs

    The Strike 20 hull drawings are now well underway and should be available by the new year (assuming I don't go sailing too often over Christmas!)

    Speaking of which. Best wishes for the holiday season and have a great 2015 sailing!

    Richard Woods of Woods Designs

    www.sailingcatamarans.com
     
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  8. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

  9. Richard Woods
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    Richard Woods Woods Designs

    Confused????

    I thought this was a thread about 20ft inshore racing trimarans????

    RW
     
  10. P Flados
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    P Flados Senior Member

    Confused?

    Don't worry.

    These guys were talking cheap Tri.

    Bucket list is a lot like a Tri that got 2/3 built and sailed incomplete ;)
     
  11. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ===============
    Why? Why eliminate one of the most exciting avenues of development? It's easier now for a skilled homebuilder to turn out an effective set of foils than it ever has been.
     
  12. waynemarlow
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    waynemarlow Senior Member

    Doug I agree with you on foils but I think that full foiling would be undesirable in such a class, it would limit the market and that's the last thing we want. I personally think that in the majority of sailors hands, a non foiler would be just about as fast around a multi point course, as a full on foiler, at the moment the extra drag on the upwind and reaching legs, probably equal the extra downwind speed and I would suspect these in shore boats will not be doing just windward leeward only courses.

    What about a compromise of always one hull in the water but foil assist by using "C" boards. I say that as I feel most owners who will enter this class will want to tinker and be up to date in their thinking. C boards are probably the easiest for a home builder and have the least hassle factor on the water. Imagine a sort of mini Seacart 26 type of arrangement.

    Certainly I agree with Richard on the cabin arrangement, simply a place to store kit and squeeze in a portaloo for the family days where one has to have some trinkets and baubles to attract the ladies and rugrats along.

    Richard I see you advocate using a Tornado mast rather than the F18 size, is it that you think a 17.5 Sqm main will not be enough? A modern F18 sail is probably now pushing an older 20sqm Tornado sail for power output and can be detuned far easily when it does blow up a bit. Myself I think we should be thinking more a long the route of allowing 3 sails upwind by adding a screecher + spinny as this combination covers all bases.

    Let's keep this discussion going. Oh bye the way, merry Xmas all.
     
  13. rapscallion
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    rapscallion Senior Member

    Richard is right - the more versatile the platform, the more likely the designs will have a use beyond racing. My thought revolved around the Pulse 600 vs. a trinado in a class that would allow both to race. Limiting the home builds to a sail area the same size as or smaller than the pulse 600 is a good idea. Maybe a minimum weight would also be a good idea. As much as I would love to see a fast, stable 20 foot home built foiler, I just don't see one being competitive in a buoy race. The sail area vs. weight would make it difficult to foil in moderate air, and in light air the foiler would likely be slow.
     

  14. waynemarlow
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    waynemarlow Senior Member

    When you think that the most likely homebuild will be based on an f18 through their abundance of used boats and their development of sails, the likely weight will be in the order of 280 - 300kgs ( 185 for the F18 + 100kgs for the centre hull ) then the platform is not really suited for foiling. Add in probably 3 known production 20ft Tri's all at that weight range with similar sail areas who have not fitted foils, then it looks like market forces rather than development will rule what's what.
     
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