poor design of expensive ding drive jabsco pump

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by sdowney717, Aug 25, 2013.

  1. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I have this model 11810-0001 pump.
    It came with the boat, so at least I did not waste money buying such and expensive disgusting thing $700 and up pump, IMO.

    I decided to open it up because it was leaking past the shaft seal.
    Well I am stuck on how to proceed getting the impeller off the rusted motor shaft.

    I am thinking it will have to be burnt out with a torch.
    Huge smoke will result.
    Other idea is perhaps using a hole saw cut down thru the metal -rubber,
    remove the bronze pump body
    then torch it out.

    Any other ideas?
    I tried a puller and also used rust buster on the shaft.

    The outer motor case also rusts heavily.
    Jabsco took a standard motor with a key drive and designed an impeller to fit and charges maybe $700 for the pump.
    http://www.jamestowndistributors.co...gine=adwords!6456&keyword=product_ad&type=pla

    The impeller is very expensive at maybe $80.

    shows the shiny SS end of impeller where it slides over the steel motor shaft and the thing is rusted together.

    For $700 they could have at least pressed a SS sleeve on the motor shaft.
    Or maybe they did.
    Whoever had this should have used teflon grease on the shaft.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  2. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

  3. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I used a 7/8 hole cutter to cut through the brass center of the impeller.
    Then had to use a torch to melt the leftover brass from the impeller's stainless center.

    Yanked the bronze pump body off.
    I was left with the motor plus the stainless remains of the impeller.
    Used a torch to melt and pry that off the steel motor shaft.

    There was no way that impeller would ever have come off without my oxy torch.

    [​IMG]

    Shows the SS impeller center thoroughly rusted to motor shaft.
    [​IMG]

    cleaned up shaft with file. I see no evidence of SS here.
    [​IMG]

    tools shown, the needle nose held the impeller while I drilled.
    Use plenty of oil when cutting.
    [​IMG]
     
  4. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    Maintenance was more a problem than the pump itself.
    When you own a boat, you have to get ready to spend money, too late to complain :p
     
  5. michael pierzga
    Joined: Dec 2008
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    Location: spain

    michael pierzga Senior Member

    What is that pump for ?

    There are better pumps around...

    A pump sercive for that jabsco would be bearings, seals shaft and impellor.
     
  6. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    It really does not do anything anymore.
    A previous owner had used it to pump cooling water for the AC heat pump.
    My idea is to use it as a wash down salt water pump. Or maybe suck out bilge water, various usage possibilities.

    I found a cheap rubber covered shaft double lipped seal for $3 instead of the very expensive brass lip seal specified. Seals have a metal spring that keeps the lip against the shaft. This pump leaked due to the seal's spring rusted which then rusted the motor shaft causing me this trouble in the repair.

    I am going to try reversing the seal face to keep the spring facing away from the water.
    Also Globe sells an impeller for half the price made to run dry. So will get that instead of the Jabsco impeller.

    The motor shaft I put a thin coat of Seal-All on the rusted area. I will use RetorSeal T plus 2 teflon based pipe sealer (white greasy water proof stuff) to seal out water getting between impeller and motor shaft. I found that stuff works well, does not wash off. It also works well on bolts and nuts keeping parts dry. That teflon based soft sealer is also good when pressing water pump bearings into housings, they slip together smoothly.

    The motor bearings are still good. I will repack with grease. I am removing one shield side on the bearing and putting the grease in the sealed cavity of the motor. ( these bearings have side shields, not rubber seals)
    For the front seal, I removed the rusted shield om the motor's nose and am using a standard steel double lipped seal, 1 3/8 OD, 5/8 shaft to keep the grease in.

    I completely disassembled the pump.
    For the rusted main motor body, I scraped off the old paint and rust then smeared on a thin coat of PL Premium polyurethane CA. This adhesive glue seals out the water. I think I will paint the pump green.
     
  7. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    motor housing sealed with PL Polyurethane. I noticed the copper winding are not string tied! And also some of the windings are loose. They did a poor job, but still it worked. Copper windings are supposed to be secured together or they can move and short. Paint them with a polyurethane clear gloss minwax, etc...to help. Motor fields are usually dipped in a clear glue.

    I had to repair my motor on an air compressor because the windings moved and rubbed which created a short. On that motor, I found the short on an outer coil loop, so was easy to break the copper weld where it shorted and reseal with some polyurethane. The reason that motor had a failure was the starting current demand was very high and the extension cord too long for it's size. That caused the motor to not easily start, so it drew too much current and overheated the winding. The motors red button breaker was no use in that situation.

    [​IMG]

    motor end plates, a new seal will go in the motor nose. Shows the old rusted shield with the old impeller seal slid inside. New seal for that was only $3.60
    [​IMG]

    bearing shield removed. Grease will be retained by the new seal in the motors grease cavity. Your not supposed to fill the cavity all the way up
    with grease or the bearing can overheat? I read that on a site that serviced electric motors which are run continuously.
    [​IMG]
     
  8. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    Fresh paint waiting to dry before I assemble this thing.
    [​IMG]

    Close up of new seal versus the simple outer shield that was there. I pried off the bearing shield and grease is in the bearing end plate cavity. This way the bearing was easy to rinse clean and regrease. This seal will positively retain the grease. This seal was a tight fit, the end cover seal bore may have needed a little opening up, but it still fit.
    [​IMG]

    Picture of seals with invoiced part numbers. Good prices. The rubber covered seal will go into the bronze pump housing.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2013
  9. michael pierzga
    Joined: Dec 2008
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    Location: spain

    michael pierzga Senior Member

    These plastic body, magneticaly coupled, pumps last for 1000s of hours. Ive got one on the air con thats 19 years old and still working fine.


    http://www.marchpump.com/140-3/

    Those maintenece cycle of those Jabsco impellor pumps is too short.

    Next time upgrade rather than rebuild.
     
  10. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I agree, I am not using it for the heat pump-AC.
    What I did was rather unusual but has worked well.
    I am using a centrifugal bait well pump made by Attwood, 12vdc.
    The pump head is always submerged so it self primes.
    It keeps the Cruisair 16k heat pump cool with enough water flow. I measured the flow and it was within spec though can not remember now the numbers.

    Plus these pumps are inexpensive. This has worked for years.[​IMG]
     
  11. Yobarnacle
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Location: Mexico, Florida

    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    My advice comes too late, but for future reference, an old chief engineer taught me a trick on frozen pumps motors engines, ect.

    Fill with ATF (Automatic Transmission fluid) and let sit. After some days or weeks, try to move the part. Might need to sit some more.

    eventually even a totally frozen up rusted together diesel engine will free up!

    ATF is not hydroscopic. Diesel IS!

    Marvel Mystery Oil is MOSTLY ATF!

    For what it's worth.
    :D
     
  12. pdwiley
    Joined: Jun 2008
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    Location: Hobart

    pdwiley Senior Member

    Next time take out the spring & deep-six it, then replace it with an O ring of reasonable size to act in place of the spring. Presto, no rust problem.

    Also if there's space 2 seals back to back are good.
     
  13. MikeJohns
    Joined: Aug 2004
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    Location: Australia

    MikeJohns Senior Member


    I've yet to see it work, and I know of several people who tried it on various well frozen engines. The not so well frozen are usually freed up pretty easily one way or another and maybe ATF marvel etc works on those.

    I've seen to many people try and resurrect a salt water seized diesel with wonder products and just waste time and money waiting for the magic to happen, and it doesn't
     
  14. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    That is a good idea. I am glad you told me. I reversed replacement rubber seal to try and keep spring integrity. If it drips, I will put it facing normal way and take an oring from the AC seal kit I have and see if it matches.

    Motor is back together and running good. Now need to buy the impeller.
    Going with the globe run dry.

    Also thinking of setting a water well pressure switch in the output with a swing check valve.
    This way pump will cycle on when pressure falls and off when pressure rises.
    The PDF seems to indicate 20 PSI output pressure. I have an old pressure switch from a well pump I plan to adapt, perhaps modify spring.

    Do you think a swing check valve is better that a suction well spring loaded check valve?
    If the swing check leaks back, then the other style check is the better one to use.

    So it will be set up in order like this.
    water pick up - impeller pump - check valve - pressure switch - hose nozzle.
     

  15. Yobarnacle
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Location: Mexico, Florida

    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    swing check valves are notorious for getting stuck partially open.
     
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