Piver Mariner

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by NickStephens, Apr 26, 2015.

  1. NickStephens
    Joined: Apr 2015
    Posts: 7
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: California

    NickStephens Junior Member

    I've been lurking for some time looking to get back into boats, a trailerable munlti seems to be what fits into my life best at the moment. Ideally a f31,2 or 3 is what i want, but I've found a 25ft piver mariner in the area that i can practically have delivered to a friends yard for a very good price. I know it's old, needs some love, but from what I see and from what I know of my skills (think very good general contactor) I see the potential in this particular boat. now for the part where you make fun of me. I see plumb bows, an off center daggerboard (for protecting the trunk when beached and interior clearance), create an open transom, lengthening the stern about 2 feet, widening the stern by a few inches, and creating a much larger, more useable cockpit.

    I've seen a few projects involving plumb bows, and some involving extending sterns, but has anyone seen or created a wider stern? I'm basically trying to give boat more loa and increase boyancy for load capacity and a more aft oriented cockpit.

    I figure this will be a good re intro into boats, an interesting project and will help me determine if i should try to build a farrier or just save up longer to buy one.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. gonzo
    Joined: Aug 2002
    Posts: 15,233
    Likes: 943, Points: 123, Legacy Rep: 2031
    Location: Milwaukee, WI

    gonzo Senior Member

    If you count your labor and materials, it will be faster and cheaper to build a new set of hulls to your specifications. You could buy an old boat for the rig, sails, etc.
     
  3. NickStephens
    Joined: Apr 2015
    Posts: 7
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: California

    NickStephens Junior Member

    and that may happen with this, it does have a rig, sails, folding mechanism etc.


    on the converse, if I just return it to pristine stock condition... wondering if that would be better? I know they don't head up very well at all, but they seem to be decent. It's resale value would probably be the same either way (not very much)
     
  4. catsketcher
    Joined: Mar 2006
    Posts: 1,306
    Likes: 148, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 790
    Location: Australia

    catsketcher Senior Member

    Hi Nick

    That looks like a Piver Nugget to me. One way to know is to measure its length - 25ft and its a Mariner, 24 and its a Nugget. Both could fold with hinged side decks. She sure has the Nugget's sheer (or lack of it) the Mariner had reverse sheer.

    I would be all for giving the boat some paint and sailing. You can't just widen a stern. If you like you can start from let's say about 4 ft in front of the stern and extend yourself a new stern about 3 ft aft of the present one.

    You should not use this as a cockpit for seating - look at it but don't put weight there. Piver's original Nugget had the cockpit in the middle where the weight should be. If you really want to do something with it you could make the cabin into a cuddy cabin (cut off the back half and leave it open) and have a fab day sailor for not much money. She will sail pretty well if you do.

    My money would be on the cuddy cabin. You get a great day sailor for not much work. As to building new hulls, I would disagree with Gonzo here and bring the old girl back into some glory.

    Please do not put vertical stems onto her. I should write an article on stem shape. It is determined by hull flare. Unless you go back a few feet and fair in a slab sided fore section adding a vertical stem will make the boat have a higher wetted surface and turn slower for almost no increase in buoyancy.

    Read this

    http://proafile.com/magazine/article/a-solid-gold-nugget

    and this

    http://www.montereyherald.com/gener...restored-trimaran-on-bay-again-after-39-years

    Look at the lovely bit of history you will be saving. Notice how all of the nice Nuggets have the cockpit in front of the aft beam. Try to do the same and she will sail well. If anything that cabin is a bit too large - cut it off, add a windbreak cuddy cabin with toilet inside (if needed) and she will be great.

    I had a Nugget when I was young. Nice boat and she started my love affair with multis. Good luck and let us know what happens - if you don't cut her up!

    cheers

    Phil
     
  5. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 3,009
    Likes: 126, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 509
    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    It's a Nugget, and you don't need to widen the stern, nor can you lengthen it because the Piver has quite a lot of rocker and your lengthened part would mostly be in the air and therefore useless. However, not being negative, but you could turn it into what we did with Jacques' Nugget, board, rig, cockpit, small cuddy, new rudder and so on. Meaning strip the boat of all weighty junk and then you'll end up with an excellent sailer, even though half a Century old design. Here's a couple of shots of Marguerite Star. Actually, in these images the cuddy has been removed. This boat has achieved 19 knots speed - and that is good for even modern 24 foot designs.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Manfred.pech
    Joined: Apr 2010
    Posts: 596
    Likes: 82, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 319
    Location: EU

    Manfred.pech Senior Member

    Nineteen knots is indeed a remarkable speed for a 24 ft Piver and it shows that it can be achieved by reducing weight radically.
    In the early seventies a friend of mine had a piver 23: http://kleinanzeigen.ebay.de/anzeigen/s-anzeige/segelboot-trimaran/303704161-211-922?ref=search. http://www.sailingtheweb.com/sailboats/Piver 23/Multimare/
    This boat of 23 ft has both, a cockpit, a small cabin and three bunks -- and it was never really fast. In the squalls it buried the leefloat and slowed down being not able to develop enough hydrodynamic lift to get on a slide. All attempts to make it faster were in vain. A centerboard, Tornado mast and sail and reducing weight as far as possible did not result in more speed. The wave digging tendency could not be avoided. The last plan was to make the boat wider and replace the floats by those of the Dragonfly 25 (35kg each) which were able to climb in a squall because of a better shape. But my friend sold it.
     
  7. NickStephens
    Joined: Apr 2015
    Posts: 7
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: California

    NickStephens Junior Member

    I called it a mariner based on its length, (which I'm assured is 25), and its cabin/cockpit style, but I'm guessing its a mixture of the two models. I'll include some more pics. If I was to change the bow or stern, I would start about 6 ft in and fair it to ad buoyancy. then it becomes a different boat, and not necessarily a piver anymore. I'd rather end up with a weekend cruiser than a day sailer, but not sure i can get this to fit the bill.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 3,009
    Likes: 126, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 509
    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    You need a chainsaw, Nick, that boat is covered in useless and heavy junk; the keel/bustle thing has to go as well.
     
  9. NickStephens
    Joined: Apr 2015
    Posts: 7
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: California

    NickStephens Junior Member

    keel? there's no keel? by bustle do you mean the outboard bracket?
     
  10. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 3,009
    Likes: 126, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 509
    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    Nick, don't listen to me, am a defecation stirrer from way back.
    I mean that long silly thing (called bustle in the old days of IOR) running aft from mid way below water to the rudder. It is there, I guess, to have something to slide on when putting the boat on the trailer. If you strip the boat of all the heavy nonsense, that "keel" will be unnecessary. Also is just drag and slowness. Did I say, don't listen to me?
     
  11. catsketcher
    Joined: Mar 2006
    Posts: 1,306
    Likes: 148, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 790
    Location: Australia

    catsketcher Senior Member

    Gary I can't see much of a bustle - I think you may be seeing something from the other float on the trailer.

    The problem with doing a lot to this boat is that it is not worth doing a heap to it. If you really want a boat with serious staying aboard features I would look out for a good quality 31 ft Searunner A frame - you can trail to to where you live and then get a great safe boat with lots of room. If you look for three or four you can offer money to the owners and get a great deal on the boat that the owner wants to sell the most.

    Or I would spruce this one up as cheaply as possible and go sailing until you can build the one you want. It will be fun to sail with a sand and paint. Plus as Gary says - get rid of some stuff. Old tris tend to get used by people who don't understand - keep it light and clean. Get rid of all the stuff you can and it will be a great boat.

    cheers

    Phil
     
  12. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 3,009
    Likes: 126, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 509
    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    Apologies. Mea culpa. No bustle. I was way too smart arse hasty.
    Phil is right, get the boat going in basic condition and sail it. However Jacques (actually it was me) spent time getting his derelict Piver going - but it was worth it because he and various crew had a number of years really enjoying the boat - until he sold it.
     
  13. catsketcher
    Joined: Mar 2006
    Posts: 1,306
    Likes: 148, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 790
    Location: Australia

    catsketcher Senior Member

    Gary - don't you ever go to bed? I am sleepy two hours earlier than you. PS When is the Jim Young book coming out?

    cheers

    Phil
     
  14. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 3,009
    Likes: 126, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 509
    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    Just had a bath, cooling off looking at screen. Midnight here.
    The Jim Young book is being published by Amazon and the esteemed one gets an early copy maybe next week.
    cheers
    Gary
     

  15. Manfred.pech
    Joined: Apr 2010
    Posts: 596
    Likes: 82, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 319
    Location: EU

    Manfred.pech Senior Member

Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.