Peel ply advice please

Discussion in 'Fiberglass and Composite Boat Building' started by sean-nós, Sep 11, 2012.

  1. sean-nós
    Joined: May 2010
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    sean-nós Senior Member

    Hi guys, I'm not happy with the finish on my build as some of the weave is showing through where the damp has got at it so I want to remove it and redo it with 4oz cloth and peel ply my problem now is that the boat is the right way up so now some of the cloth and peel ply near the bow will be upside down and I would like to know if it will stay while it sets without any vacuum bagging or will it fall under it's own weight I'm using west system 207. The boat is also quite curvy will this suit peel ply or should I just do it the same way as before doing 3 coats with a 3 hour gap between each coat, I don't want to mess this up again so any help would be great.
    Thanks.

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  2. Charly
    Joined: Dec 2009
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    Charly Senior Member

    Hi sean-nos, I think it is beautiful like it is dont mess with it:D

    Seriously, to me it sounds like the best option is to just flow coat it like before, especially if you are doing it outside, where the wind could ruin your day, of course, the wind could kick up dust too. Maybe some of the more experienced will weigh in here.

    Is the inside of the boat protcted from moisture? I would think that fluctuations in the moisture intake of the wood in the hull, with resulting movement, would not be good for the outside coating at the bond.
     
  3. sean-nós
    Joined: May 2010
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    sean-nós Senior Member

    Thanks Chary, the boat is encapsulated inside in epoxy and varnished with the engine in place and it is also under a lean to. I was hoping the peel ply could be left on to protect it till I'm ready to do the final coats also to help save on the sanding "I hate sanding":D
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  4. gypsy28
    Joined: Mar 2010
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    Location: NSW Australia

    gypsy28 Senior Member

    Sorry for the off topic, but ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL. Well done on a great job

    Cheers DAVE
     
  5. sean-nós
    Joined: May 2010
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    Location: Dublin,Ireland

    sean-nós Senior Member

  6. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    i really dont think peel ply is going to give you anything better than what you got . thats not what its for its to compress the glass and draw out any surplus resin thats in the glass . !!
    Glass over wood you alwas going to get movement forever more live with it ! also the dark colour is going to draw heat so will get even worse with time as the heat shrinks the resin and the glass pattern will show even more !!:(.
     
  7. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Peel ply will offer a uniform surface, though it will have the fabric's weave pattern imbedded in it, so this will need to be sanded out. I see no advantage, unless your shop environment is such, that keeping contaminates off the surface is required. Mylar strips would be a better choice as you'll have a nearly flawless finish when it's removed, though the overlapping portions of these stripes will need to be addressed. Dealing with these edge humps is a lot easier then attempting to smooth the whole hull, but still can be a daunting task, particularly on a very compound hull.

    I haven't looked at your pictures, but do remember some previous photos, where weave was visible and possably some "thin" spots. In the areas where you have weave showing, but the 'glass appears to be fully wetted out, you just need another coat or two of epoxy. In the areas where the weave is exposed, it's possible it'll wet out with more epoxy, but no guarantees, mostly because there could by a few reasons for this, such as the fabric floated in these areas and didn't fully wet out. In these locations, I can't see anyway around carefully grinding back to fully wetted out fabric and trying not to touch the wood below. You can "dam" the area and bulk up the low spot with additional coats of goo, eventually getting high enough to fair it down to surrounding areas. I've done this on a few bright hulls and it's very difficult to do. It's way too easy to over sand and knock some color off the wood. It's also really easy to have a "blotch" of color, because the epoxy is thicker over the depression, that was just filled.

    If it was me, I'd just apply two more coats of straight epoxy, with a roller and tipped off. You'll have some brush marks (use a dry foam brush), but you can block them down after the goo has cured (give it a week). I'd block it down with 220, moving up to 320, following the grain and a padded block. This will remove the brush marks and only remove the bulk of the top layer of epoxy, leaving the one below for finishing. If it's fair enough, continue the finish sanding until you're ready for vanish. If not, apply more epoxy and block it down again. Basically, you need film thickness to fill and cover the weave, plus offer some room to fine tune the surface. Once it's got a minimum of 6 (preferably more) coats of varnish, you can buff the surface, further improving the quality of the finish. Of course the varnish needs to be truly cured (about a month) or you be a lot more pissed off, then you are now.
     
  8. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
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    mydauphin Senior Member

    Beautiful boat!!!, agree with all leave it alone. Work a little on making environment better. I have had too many a projects suffer due to humidity and dust creeping in.
     
  9. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    If you work in the open and not in a enclosed enviroment what else can you exspect . humidity affects wood resin coat all sides or not moisture still gets in just takes one pinhole anywhere .i laid laminate flooring and used to that 4 to 6 weeks for it to aclimatise to the conditions of a house and its sealled every where but the moisture still affects it !! . :confused:
     
  10. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Properly encapsulated with epoxy, wood is stable and doesn't move.
     
  11. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    if you have to go to that exstent why not just make a glass boat and be done with it !!! :eek:
    OR you could just bottle it and shove a cork in the end and sit and look at it !!
     
  12. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Simply put Tunnels, because wood is generally lighter and stronger and a whole lot prettier than the milk jugs you seem to favor.
     
  13. Herman
    Joined: Oct 2004
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    Location: The Netherlands

    Herman Senior Member

    Ah, another thread spoilt by fighting dogs.

    [​IMG]

    Anyhow, let's try to advise the topic starter a bit more. His achievements are great.

    Concerning print, there are 2 types that you will encounter: The epoxy sinking into the weave of the glass, showing the glass texture, and the wood texture and seams showing through the surface.

    The epoxy sinking into the glass can be adressed by using a high-temperature resistant epoxy. The only disadvantage is that these high temp epoxies need a postcure, and they are not optimised for surface quality. (which is less of a problem, as you will need to sand anyhow).
    Another try is to add enough epoxy (West 105/207) on top of the glass, so the glass weave is buried more.

    The wood showing through is something that is hard to avoid. Adding glass helps, but as you want things to be transparent, you cannot add too much glass.

    The white spots are really annoying, especially when they appear in the epoxy that is used to laminate the glass. You can try to heat up the epoxy gently (heat lamp) to about 50 degrees C (130F) to see if it disappears, but if you are out of luck you will need to remove it.
    If you remove one patch including the glass, unfortunately you will always see it after rebuilding. So your 3 options are:
    -remove all the epoxy and glass
    -patch it up
    -do nothing

    Keep in mind that when the boat is in the water, defects are less noticable.
     
  14. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
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    rwatson Senior Member

    The cynic in me wants to say :

    "You are building a dining table quality hull to race at 25+ knots on plastic infested water, next to sand infested beaches, launching on rock infested ramps ? You would be better off to sell the motor, put the hull in a glass case and hang it on your living room wall"
     

  15. sean-nós
    Joined: May 2010
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    sean-nós Senior Member

    Or I could turn the motor into a dining table

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    and use the dining table as a boat but thats not what I want:D

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