Our Oceans are Under Attack

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by brian eiland, May 19, 2009.

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  1. Mr Efficiency
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Not so sure sure about Greenland being green, by all reports it was an early example of false advertising designed to encourage settlers with an alluring name.
     
  2. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Having Viking ancestors, I read a lot about their culture and explorations.
    The Madison Avenue "treatment" of Greenland, false advertising as a fit place to colonize, I've encountered the notion numerous times.
    Doesn't quite fit the criteria for a scam.
    Nobody was selling building lots.
    Advertising FREE land for the taking? No profit in that.
    And it was a "strong arm" culture. I wouldn't want angry Vikings looking for me, because I had lied and tricked them.
    I suspect the story arose in relatively modern era to explain the early abandonment of the settlements.
    Climate change to colder was the real reason, as it was the end of MWP and beginning of the little ice age.
    I'm grateful we aren't facing impending COLD!

    The only "evidence" I've ever uncovered for the " false advertising" notion is from a Norse saga.

    original source:

    Þat sumar fór Eiríkr at byggja land þat, er hann hafði fundit ok hann kallaði Grænland, því at hann kvað menn þat mjök mundu fýsa þangat, ef landit héti vel.

    1880 translation:

    In the summer Eirik went to live in the land which he had discovered, and which he called Greenland, "Because," said he, "men will desire much the more to go there if the land has a good name.

    Explains the naming Greenland, but hardly implies it was a misleading name. That could be very dangerous for someone living in the same settlement as the fraudulently enticed were. As was Eric, he was living on Greenland himself!
    You think he enjoyed suffering, did he? I think it was a decent place and climate at that time.
    As for glaciers, Norway and Iceland have them, so Eric no stranger to glaciers.

    We call that walking the walk, not just talking the talk.
    Erik believed Greenland was a good place to settle. He did, and invited others.
     
  3. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    Climate Trades | The New Yorker
     
  4. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Carbon Based Life Form

    Who doesn't like CAPSLOCK and exclamation marks???????!!!!!!!:!::!::!::!::!::!::!:
     
  5. micah719
    Joined: Jul 2012
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    micah719 Plotting Dreamer

    Lol, still at it? Whenever you back a watermelon (green outside, red inside) into a corner, they resort to ad hominem, straw men, red herrings, appeals to authority, and all the other copouts rather than reasoning and refuting the argument at hand.

    I LOVE CAPSLOCK!!!!!!!

    Also, I think we could solve the Ebola and ISIS problems quick smart, and throw in the warmists as well: since the religion of piece is somewhat lax in their sharps safety procedures, in addition to being rather cavalier with other people's bodily fluids, simply divert all Liberians with elevated body temperatures to Mosul. Then, take up the warmies on their pabulum and give them a free, all expenses tour of the Middle East Liquid Carbon Harvesting Facilites to convince the gentle locals of their errors. Starting with Mosul, or something suitably nearby. Have a nice trip! Nothing to fear, you're in bed with that lot anyway, and you're so winningly charming you won't fail to make impressions, win friends, and influence people! Just don't lose your head. If the desert heat is too much, perhaps a holiday on the humungous Antarctic Ice Cap will help you chill out. Relax, all the Polar Bears that never lived there have already drowned.

    DID I MENTION I REALLY LOVE CAPS????

    !

    :D
     
  6. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Thanks for the support on CAPSLOCK!
    The AGWers don't need or deserve govt dispensed infected blankets or "ultimate solutions".
    They are confused and misguided for the most part, by themselves, their own propaganda, and their adrenaline addiction.
    And they certainly don't need or deserve government funding, although THEY insist they do.

    What they need, is injections of common sense, honesty, and anti-hysterical drugs.
    Maybe some encouragement to take up skydiving and bungee jumping for their adrenaline fixes?

    The EPA and IPCC, both which I have little respect for, and respected climatologists, meteorologists, atmospheric physicists, other scientists, MOST agree, NO SIGNAL of increased severe weather is detected or detectable, or can be for many more decades. simply, because these severe events are relatively rare.
    Scanty data.

    But AGWers are opportunists claiming every bit of weather is CO2 driven, because they BELIEVE CO2 is increasing frequency and severity of extreme weather, although they have no evidence of it happening, and are shooting big holes in their credibility while they diddle themselves with these false claims.

    When AGWers make pronouncements of FACT based on scanty evidence, like charts of GLOBAL temperatures 1000 years ago with only bit over 1000 data points for the whole planet, they give themselves adrenaline rushes thinking they refute cyclic nature, but destroy their credibility.
    Everybody knows nature is cyclic, except AGWers in reference to NOW! Man disrupted the cycle NOW. Arrogant, aren't they!

    When they excite themselves with claims warming is hurting animals, like polar bears currently enjoying a population explosion, they destroy their credibility.

    When shenanigans with the data reporting and model projections come under public scrutiny, their credibility dives.

    When they label us skeptics as mentally subhuman compared to their elitedness inflated egos, they shoot themselves. And become unpopular. Arrogant aren't they!

    Nature doesn't lie. The temperature hiatus is continuing. Truth continues occurring dispelling the power of lies.
    Research continues. Life continues.
    We need to continue preventing political changes based on AGW thinking and agenda.
    Spread the word, pointing out the obvious falseness of AGW doctrine and "evidences", and urging NO political compromises. Resist continually!
    No carbon tax, no UN green fund, NO financial support for AGWers or lying agencies of govt. Defund AGW!
    Truth will manifest itself in short time, within a decade or less. Lies are hard to support, and harder over time!
    Socialism always fails because of it's arrogant lies! Remember the massive USSR existed only 74 years! Freedom reigns!
    Take heart!

    TIME is OUR ally!
     
  7. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    100 European Cities Sign Pledge for Action on Climate Change: European Commission | RIA Novosti
     
  8. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Since you like DOOM scenarios imaginarynumber, here's one up your alley.
    Your movement is DOOMED to fail!

    roflmao! :p
     
  9. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    Maybe. But the possibility of failure is no excuse for not trying. At least I'll be able to look future generations in the eye and honestly say 'I did my best'.
     
  10. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    From C3

    "CO2's Impact On Global Temperature Trends: Minimal To Non-Existent, Per IPCC's Gold-Standard



    Climate change, as represented by global cooling and global warming trends, is in a constant flux...the IPCC's gold-standard temperature dataset provides the empirical proof that a natural cycle of ups and downs is the reality - past, present & future.....

    HC4 ipcc gold standard temperature trends global warming co 101314
    (click on graph to enlarge)

    How much global warming (or cooling) will take place by 2050AD?

    The flat-out, scientific truth is that nobody really knows. Not the IPCC. Not the climate models. Not the experts. And certainly not the green crony-facilitators, Naomi Klein and Bill McKibben (fyi...crony Al Gore just loves them to death.)


    This chart plotting the IPCC's gold-standard (HC4) of global temperature trends, of past and present, reveals why it is so incredibly difficult to predict climate change, be it of short or long-term nature. Climate change is constantly happening - going from one warming acceleration to the next cooling acceleration extreme, rather rapidly.

    And note, this takes place regardless of atmospheric CO2 levels (see black curve), and associated human CO2 emissions. Clearly, the skyrocketing CO2 levels since the 1950's are not responsible for such wide variance in temperature trends, since they can even be observed a century before.


    In fact, based on a visual inspection, one could surmise that climate change extreme trends have lessened since the modern increase of CO2 levels.

    As can be seen, shorter cooling/warming trends have been highly variable from the very start of recording instrumentally-measured "global" temperatures. The light red (12-mth) and green (60-mth) plots readily show this.

    So, when did the greatest acceleration of warming trends take place? Amazingly, all the warming spikes that matched or equaled ±20°C took place (see yellow-tinted boxes) prior to the last 40 years of massive human CO2 emissions.


    Regarding the 10, 20 and 30-year climate change variability, there is no question that the wild and natural extremes of the short-term always return to a rather mundane long-term variability. The dark blue, cyan and bright red plots indicate long-term climate change that is...well...pretty mundane.

    How mundane?

    Compared to a 12-month climate change extreme trend of +25.0°C reached in 1878, the 30-year trend extreme only reached a maximum of +0.72°C (during 2003) and has now been reduced to a August 2014 30-year trend of 0.61°C - and relative to the 1940's, that's a trend only eight-hundredths of a degree greater.

    Conclusion: Climate change never stops. Whether short-term or long-term, global temperature trends constantly accelerate/decelerate. Human CO2 emissions have nothing to do with this extreme variability - it is a natural phenomenon that is chaotic, totally unpredictable and unstoppable. The climate change indicated by today's temperature trends is insignificantly different than the past climate change. And those are the stubborn facts."

    I enhanced colors and size in 2nd chart.
     

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  11. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Ah! That's MY motivation also. Did my best to prevent foolishness!
     
  12. NoEyeDeer
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    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Please accept my congratulations for managing to write one of the most astoundingly idiotic posts in the history of the internet. It really is quite an achievement. :)

    At the moment I am far too pleased about one particular development in the middle east (namely the YPG managing to hold Kobane) to be bothered arguing in this thread any more. Sometimes you need to get some perspective.

    (Barnacle: you should read their constitution. It's a cracker. Covers a lot more than yours does. ;) )
     
  13. Boat Design Net Moderator
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    Boat Design Net Moderator Moderator

    It's probably a good time to insert another request to please try and keep the forums polite to everyone and away from posts which will be offensive to many others.

    The topic of environmental and other issues which may or may not affect the oceans is obviously one of interest and importance to the boat design and boating community.

    But let's please try and keep the discussion informative rather than just inflammatory argument or criticism of "the other side." Thanks very much for your understanding and for everyone's help in keeping the threads more enjoyable than offensive and discussion that people can learn from. Thanks.
     
  14. myark
    Joined: Oct 2012
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    myark Senior Member

    It’s one of the unspoken rules of the internet that typing in capitals means any number of things, it could be that you’re REALLY ANGRY or you’re trying to EXPRESS SARCASM in a NOT SO SUBTLE MANNER. Sometimes it even means EXCITEMENT which could easily be confused with A BIPOLAR MANIC EPISODE.
     

  15. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    I explained why and when it is that I emphasize a word or a phrase.
    Why are you speculating it means something different than I said I meant?
    ???????????????????
    We do not think alike. Not at all.
     
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