Offer: true go anywhere Trawler to build "side by side"

Discussion in 'Metal Boat Building' started by apex1, Aug 4, 2009.

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  1. apex1

    apex1 Guest

     
  2. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    It's true that I have tendency to comment where I am comfortable with the material, and I don't know enough of the progress made of aluminum and the latest progress of aluminum construction. I have a "thing" for steel, I am comfortable with, no secret quite simple.
    Of topic, I saw at the maritime museum in Bath Maine an interresting design by Starling Burgess for a fast destroyer made of aluminum.
    Just to have in my mind a idea of the vessel, do you have allready a desision made about the horizontal distribution? will be a three decker or a two decker with raised pilothouse? I compt the lower deck on top of the bilge the first deck. Perhaps it is early, but it will give an idea.
    You comment about the very complete workshop inboard, so your intention is to have quite a powerfull genset, and perhaps a small one for the night? Do you think to have all the engines with the exhaust dry, or you favor the wet exhaust.
    As for the cooling, do you consider a box cooling, if the vessel is in steel, or a built in keel cooling?
    And now an other question, please nobody blast me for this one: Do you intent to put some kind of sails, for help in case of engine failure, if you have to hove to, or keeping the vessel from turning around the mooring?
    Daniel
     
  3. apex1

    apex1 Guest

     
  4. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    About general shape, perhaps you mentioned it allready and missed the post, it will be hard chine or round bilge, if round bilge do you have in mind a cruiser stern or a transom?
    You mentioned one prop is more esy to protect, if you go for a round bilge do you intent to have reverse curve built down and a hull plating fairing to the prop?
    About engine failure, I think a low speed engine large displacement is less prone to fail due to fuel quality than a high speed small displacement.
    it is true that a good engine do not fail by itself just for the sake of failing, it is the anciliaries and the fuel make it fail.
    You are a airplane pilot as you mentioned, so you know how to rely on one engine, and how to take care of it with great caring. Up there an engine failure is not a option.
    I didn't know this technologie. Sounds very great.
    Do I detect a a high flared bow like a Norvegian Research vessel?
    I will wait for the picture, I am just making wild guess.
    Daniel
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2009
  5. apex1

    apex1 Guest

     
  6. TeddyDiver
    Joined: Dec 2007
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    TeddyDiver Gollywobbler

    :eek: Up here it's just the opposite.. only some amateurs having wet exhaust.. (rarely in some southmade boats) ;) And a bit of warm inside is allways wellcomed here.. also during summer.. right now it's 5C outside, winter and king crab season coming you know..
     
  7. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Ja Teddy, and I said "fear seawater" did´nt say all amateurs have dry exhaust.:D

    Otso, Kontio, Sisu, Sampo, Hanse, Njord (Sverige) and so on, all dry exh. Did you know Hanse? I made my tickets on them. Was cool, well really cool sometimes. Had just to sign for a ice campaign and got my next level, some winter we were done after 8 weeks.
     
  8. TeddyDiver
    Joined: Dec 2007
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    TeddyDiver Gollywobbler

    Ja ich weiss Hanse. Glaube es wird gebaut bei Wärtsilä zeit fünfzig jahren oder?
    Got a feeling that's full of mistakes.. should take a trip to Germany sometime ein bishen praktisch zu haben :)
    Anyway waiting to see the pictures of your boat..
    Don't you happen to have a place for a third boat aside those two.. Not any sister ship.. more like a 26' "leftovers" steel sjark ;) Thou I propably can't afford even that :rolleyes:
     
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  9. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    1966 Wärtsilä, 3750 tons, 8000hp. Burned in 1998 in the Med, wrecked then.
    Your German is better than tämä on minun soumen?

    A third boat is not a real problem Teddy and 26 is fine, cm of course. Just send me a drawing then.
     
  10. M-Sasha

    M-Sasha Guest

    Interesting offer, impressive data, extremely attractive price! And quite obvious a boat not attracting any boaters. That is no surprise what do they know about a well engineered and thought out passagemaker, they know better about the interior designer who is hip today. I doubt you will find a true old salts who builds with you side by side, boaters will not, a shame. But nevertheless good luck!
    Sasha
     
  11. Ad Hoc
    Joined: Oct 2008
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    Apex

    The vac-pac looks mighty impressive. BUT, you need to get it type approved, unless it is already type approved?? Otherwise the construction wont be passed, for all the usual rules/reg's reasons...
     
  12. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Good point John, did not think about that so far. But I´m sure I´ll manage. TÜV and CE approval is there, and the foam (backing) has GL cert. If not......it is completely hidden under the foam. (question of assembly shedule you know);)
    But it is fire retardant (better than the foam) so we manage.



    Thank you Sasha. I hope you are not right in this case!
     
  13. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    I will make some assumptions and guesses. Lets say she displace 90 tons which will make a displacement length of 152(imperial), and for a range of 5500 miles the bunker will be, let say, 31000 liters which will gave her an endurance of 17 days. But with the CPP these number can be very off.
    We are talking something large and rather complex.
    Building time will be 12 months and cost of the boat ready to sail (toothbrush will be on owner expenses:D ) 2 millions euros, its quite a achievement.
    I would like to know, If its possible, the systematic to achieve this goal. For exemple I will guess a vessel that large will take aproximatly 33,000 man hours
    so it will be a crew of aproximatly 20 boatbuilders, welders, pipers, mechanics and other. Without counting the back office for the accountant, the buyers, the stock manager and the secretary. I am perhaps completly off, it is just a guess.
    This is a lot of people to supervise and to direct, and like a maestro direct his musiciens, no false note must be allowed to achieve the goal.
    Can we know the naval architect who designed the hull? Will be the same person who will design the superstructure and the systems?
    Daniel
     
  14. apex1

    apex1 Guest

     

  15. Alik
    Joined: Jul 2003
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    Alik Senior Member

    I think apex1 is on right track with dimensions. The boat is big enough to comply for ocean class (OK, it is not under ISO, but...) without excessive internal ballast. Use of wide hull and ballast (as for smaller and relatively wider boats) will definitely reduce roll period.

    We did a study for one of our concepts - 16m trawler, steel/aluminium. For that trawler compliance with wind/wave criteria from ISO12217-1 without ballast was an issue, on other hand with ballast we have to introduce roll stabilizers.
     
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