Ocean News

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by ImaginaryNumber, Oct 8, 2015.

  1. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Polar Vortex Grows Arctic Sea Ice to 10-Year High, but There's a Catch | The Weather Channel https://weather.com/news/news/2020-02-13-polar-vortex-arctic-sea-ice-cover-highest

    Ice coverage in the Arctic Ocean is currently the highest it has been since 2010 with support from the strongest polar vortex on record.
    Ice covers 5.4 million square miles of the Arctic – roughly the size of the United States, Mexico and India combined. This coverage is still below the long-term climate average, but the uptick is at least a temporary stall in sea ice decline.

    That was Feb 13, 2020, this year.
    We are now in the northern hemisphere summer.
    Ice melts in the summertime?
    Oh NO! It's a catastrophe!
     
  2. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    This will disappoint some, but David Hempleman-Adams was successful in his attempt to circumnavigate the North Pole through the Northeast and Northwest passages in one season in a sailboat.

    The Polar Ocean Challenge – History in the Making
    BTW, Sir David Hempleman-Adams is one of the most accomplished explorer-adventurers of our time.

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    This is now so little multiyear pack ice in the Arctic Ocean that for the last few years there are cruise ships taking guests through the Northwest Passage each summer.

    Northwest Passage – Follow the footsteps of legendary explorers
    [It looks like they are only booking for 2021, presumably because of COVID-19]
     
  3. Dejay
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    Dejay Senior Newbie

    Since I'm actually planning or hoping to spend the next 20-30 years in the mediterranean area - from what I gather this means higher temperature and less rain. But also less cloud cover and more solar gain from solar panels?

    It's also interesting how careful scientists phrase their predictions and conclusions. For example that the drought in Syria contributed to the civil war there. This is the real problem with climate change, if you understand humans you know that this will mean more and more conflicts and wars all around the world. If Turkey, Greek, Spain and Italy will be impacted and the European union crumbles that could become a real hotspot for conflict.
     
  4. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    http://www.projectbluesphere.com/2013/01/18/Building-a-watermaker/

    The Mediterranean has always had drinking water shortages. Expensive to buy.

    Cruising the Med, living onboard ... Is it all it's cracked up to be ? Is it for you ? : by Bryant [Living on board] - VisitMyHarbour articles https://www.visitmyharbour.com/articles/1532/cruising-the-med-living-onboard-is-it-all-its-cracked-up-to-be-is-it-for-you-

    A combination of rose tinted glasses, wrong assumptions, and lack of experience, can lead to big problems manifesting themselves after significant amounts of capital have been deployed. Any venture that involves living on a boat (especially if it involves buying a boat for this purpose) really needs to be thought through thoroughly in the first instance.

    Living on board a boat in the Mediterranean is NOT the same as a chartering holiday or a good coastal cruise. Holiday cruises and charters come to an end, and the happy event can be mulled over in the comfort of your own home later.

    Living on board your boat is a tough option (even in the Mediterranean climate), in practice far removed from the image most people have of it. It truly can be a very satisfying and healthy way of life, but requires commitment and dedication.... and not a little money.

    The purpose of this article is not to dash your dreams, but gently take you, dear reader, and explain to you how it really is. Once the false assumptions have been brushed aside you can make your decisions based on reality rather than expectation. If you do decide to try living on your boat and cruising the Mediterranean you'll have a much better chance of enjoying it rather regretting it (and often losing large sums of money in the process).
     
  5. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    When it come to selecting information sources that are incorrect, misleading, or irrelevant, Yob never fails to deliver.

    The extent of arctic sea ice mid-winter is not a good predictor of minimum arctic sea ice extent in September.

    [​IMG]
    Charctic Interactive Sea Ice Graph | Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/charctic-interactive-sea-ice-graph/

    This chart shows arctic sea ice extent for 2012 (red dashed line), which holds the record for minimum sea ice extent for the last 40 years (when satellite coverage began). Also shown is the extent for the years 2014, 2018, and 2020. As you can see during the winter of the record minimum year of 2012, maximum sea ice extent was greater than for all the other subsequent years (that I've shown). Also note that between July 1 and August 1 that there isn't too much difference between any of the years. It's not until August and September that the difference in years starts to become apparent.

    What is more useful to watch than sea ice extent is sea ice volume -- roughly ice extent * ice thickness.

    [​IMG]
    Sea Ice Thickness and Volume: Polar Portal http://polarportal.dk/en/sea-ice-and-icebergs/sea-ice-thickness-and-volume/#c23717

    As you see, 2020 has the lowest mid-winter volume of any year since 2016, and considerably lower than the 2004-2013 average. Almost every year the sea ice is getting thinner, even on those years when extent may be greater. That is the real story of what's happening to arctic sea ice. Each year there is less and less of the thick, multi-year ice. Mostly now the ice is just a few years old, and therefore not as thick, and therefore easier to melt each summer.

    So once again, Yob, you are half right and all wrong.
     
  6. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    I was curious how they could measure the thickness of thousands of square miles of polar ice. The EXTENT of ice can be accurately determined from satellite photographs, but THICKNESS?
    Must be a technological miracle!

    Then, I read this.

    Sea Ice Thickness and Volume: Polar Portal http://polarportal.dk/en/sea-ice-and-icebergs/sea-ice-thickness-and-volume/
    "Differences may occur in terms of the position of the edge of the ice in the two maps, “Extent of the sea ice” and “Thickness and volume of the sea ice”, as the model calculations do not always correspond exactly to the satellite sensors’ registration of the extent of the ice.

    Ice concentrations are based on satellite data and are from the Ocean and Sea Ice Satellite Application Facility project (OSISAF).
    The thickness of the ice shown is calculated by means of the HYCOM-CICE model of sea ice at DMI. "

    Here is the rub.
    I created this sentence below from excepts in the above quote. Does not change the meaning. Makes it more obvious.


    The HYCOM-CICE model calculated thickness of the ice does not always correspond exactly to the satellite sensors observed data.

    SHAME!

    And the "modeled" curve doesn't differ by much from other years. just needed a little nudging here and there to be a tad worse. I don't trust AGW models or ethics. Ya'll been caught manipulating the reported data many many times. Credibility ZERO.

    You can't empirically observe it, so you manufacture data in a computer model? Tsk! Tsk!
    Amazingly, modeled results are nearly always reported as a tad worse, some new record low!
    Why would they do that? An agenda by the model creators?

    Do they think ALL of us are stupid and naive? Or enough of a mob sufficient for a consensus?

    When mobs eventually learn they've been hoodwinked, it ain't pretty!

    Doesn't mob refer to a flock of sheep in some parts?

    "What is more useful to watch than sea ice extent is sea ice volume -- roughly ice extent * ice thickness." said i
    Your contention the modeled volume of ice is more telling than the observed extent of ice, depends upon two things, Imaginary number. What kind of story you are telling, and the presumed bias and gullibility of the, your, intended audience.

    Another point, you opined you wouldn't choose February to show minimum ice. Why not? If winter ice were less than normal, that might make your case better than no ice at all in mid summer!
    On the other hand, if it did all melt in the summer? As long as the ice returned huge, thick and strong in the winter, who cares. Short term weather events are just weather, not climate!
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
  7. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Home >> Trending Topics >> In The News >> Environmentalist Issues Climate Scare Apology, Forbes Removes Article
    Environmentalist Issues Climate Scare Apology, Forbes Removes Article

    Posted by: Thomas Catenacci in In The News, US News June 30, 2020 0

    Topics in this post: climate change media bias Michael Shellenberger
    ShareTweetSubscribe: CDN Daily Briefing

    [​IMG]

    Forbes unpublished an article Monday in which an environmental activist apologized for scaring people about climate change.

    Michael Shellenberger’s article was originally published by Forbes Sunday, but was taken down one day later. Shellenberger, who is the founder and president of Environmental Progress, decried “climate alarmism” in the article, which he posted on his website after Forbes took it down.

    “On behalf of environmentalists everywhere, I would like to formally apologize for the climate scare we created over the last 30 years,” he wrote.

    Shellenberger added: “Climate change is happening. It’s just not the end of the world. It’s not even our most serious environmental problem.”

    2030 is coming and with it comeuppance.
     
  8. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    Shellenberger makes some interesting arguments. You can read his article here:

    On Behalf Of Environmentalists, I Apologize For The Climate Scare

    An older piece he wrote for Forbes can be found here:

    Why Climate Alarmism Hurts Us All

    I'm very curious why Forbes pulled the article? They use to be quite pro-Denialism, but more recently cleaned up their act a bit. In the next few weeks I hope to find reviews of Shellenberger's arguments.
     
  9. ImaginaryNumber
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    ImaginaryNumber Imaginary Member

    Most of your rant appears to have come directly from your kiester. Fortunately, I'm wearing my full COVID protection suit. ;)

    I didn't say I "wouldn't choose February to show minimum ice." I said that the maximum winter ice extent is a p00r predictor of summer's minimum ice extent. And I proved it by showing that the record year for minimum ice extent (2012) had a rather high winter maximum ice extent. This should not be a difficult concept to understand for anyone who has mastered kindergarten skills.
    Loss of summer ice has both direct effects and indirect effects. Some that I can think of include:

    Polar bears get most of their energy needs from eating seals, caught from sea ice. They eat very little during the summer when the are confined to shore and can't reach the sea ice. The longer they can't access winter sea ice, the harder it is for them during their summer "fast".

    Walrus have similar problems, in that a lack of sea ice confines their feeding grounds (clams on the ocean floor) to near shores. When they can haul out on sea ice they have access to a much larger feeding area.

    Sea ice is white and reflects sunlight. Open water is dark and absorbs sunlight. More open water for a longer period of time means more heat absorbed from the sun. Though, admittedly, at high latitudes that isn't as significant as at lower latitudes.

    Any amount of ice acts as a barrier to energy exchange between air and water. No ice, no barrier.

    Russia is now shipping petroleum products (oh, the irony) via ice-breaker tankers from Siberia to Asia via the Northern Sea Route (the Northeast Passage) six months out of the year. Other cargo companies are itching to start using the Northwest Passage ASAP.

    Russian, US and Canadian oil companies are looking with increasing lust at Arctic ocean oil deposits. Thick sea ice is the main impediment.

    Increased commercial use of the NE or NW Passages means increased chances of accidents and oils spills. Because that area is so remote and so cold, clean up efforts will be much more difficult. And any damage done will be more long lasting in a very fragile environment.
     
  10. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    All good comments. except the keister one.You have a point about the polar bears. Don't worry about your point. Wear a hat, nobody will notice.

    You neglected to comment on the appropriateness of your choosing model "data " as preferred over observed empirical data. They can't be of equivalent quality, aren't even nearly at the same level of confidence. and for models to be considered superior to real data is insane, living in fantasy-land.

    Speaking of keisters, apparently you are as physically contortionist as your science, to enable you putting your head in up yours. Expect it's warm for you, but is it your flushed red embarrassed face driving the warming or your zeal for your AGW ministry? Ah! Exhaled CO2! Are you certain you don't find any methane up there? Don't inhale the methane. You might pass out. A tipping point, a hat can't hide. Possibly an extinction event for you!

    Hey! I think I have an explanation, for our different POVs regarding AGW!
    I got the big world picture. You got tunnel vision! You are looking inwards. I look outside the box, you want me in.

    I hesitate to ask. Do you have a consensus in there? Do others also have their heads up your...nah, can't even imagine it. Don't want to!
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
  11. Dejay
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    Dejay Senior Newbie

    This is such a weird article. He says 6th extinction event isn't caused by humans, but doesn't say it's not happening or gives arguments as to why the scientific studies would be wrong on this.

    He then says that "Climate change is happening. It’s just not the end of the world. " but instead of arguing for this central premise he pushes peripheral arguments as to why certain things in the mainstream media are presented wrong. He gives no arguments how the actual science on climate change is wrong. He does not say how the world with +4°C we're heading towards would be "fine" and nothing to be alarmed about.

    He says it's wrong for children to be scared and maybe that is right, it should be the burden of adults not children. Unfortunately the adults have their heads in their kiesters. But he makes no argument that there is no reason to be alarmed. It's simply a logical fallacy to use this appeal to emotion ("Think of the children!") to make being alarmed about climate change seem wrong. But being alarmed or not, that's is a question of facts and science. Protecting children from the truth is a luxury we don't have.

    All of this starting with and peppered with his "credentials" as an environmentalist to show how environmentalist he is in an appeal to authority.

    He then throws around a lot of innuendo and vague accusations about ideology ("anti-humanist beliefs", "Malthusianism") and accuses the scientists working on the IPCC of "politicization of science.".

    He even makes the argument that "social media is allowing for a wider range of new and independent voices to outcompete alarmist environmental journalists". What kind of madness about a "truth competition" and anti-intellectualism is this? The majority opinion is worth more than what the scientific process tells us? The voices on social media are to be trusted despite all the evidence for "billion dollar disinformation campaigns"?

    It's brilliant propaganda but he doesn't actually argue for his central premise and just throws out a bunch of logical fallacies like appeal to emotion, special pleading, composition/division and ad hominem and a lot of things entirely unrelated to the argument.

    "It's so horrible lets close our eyes" is a very good propaganda tactic because people have a natural tendency to do that. He's giving them permission. And for that he of course has to avoid talking about the actual consequences.

    I agree that we should get more nuclear power and that there are much hysterics about nuclear energy. And I wouldn't be surprised that some anti-nuclear campaigns were funded by fossil fuel interests.
     
  12. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    Great! We found a sliver of common ground. Let's go nuclear.
    i dream of the day tiny cigarette pack sized nuclear (fusion maybe) power cells can power our yachts! At a reasonable affordable price!

    Currently, I'm playing with, experimenting with, home made all carbon super capacitors.
    I use copper clad carbon washing rods intended for unwelding, as center cathodes in PVC electrical conduit tubes. The anode paste is my own powdered carbon and secret ingredients mixture. They charge up quickly. Dangerously.

    Still working on series and parallel multiple capacitor cells for a power pack. trying not to electrocute myself in the process!

    Okay, i'll spill my secret mix info.
    it's a mixture of carbon and manganese dioxide salvaged from dead C and D flahlight batteries, but I added 70% more powdered carbon. The membrane separating the two carbons, is a thin layer of epoxy, the washing rod was dipped in and drip dried..
    A thin springy aluminum sheet is rolled to slide into the PVC conduit as a terminal connector to the powdered carbon filler. The carbon rod is the other terminal. If you make these, wear thick rubber gloves and eye protection when handling charged capacitors.

    A construction hint. Center drill a cap and cement it on. Insert the washing rod and secure with sealant or hot glue gun. Invert tube and fill tube and around center rod, from open bottom. When full of powdered carbon, cement on bottom cap. Charge with a charging sourse. Be careful.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
  13. SamSam
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    SamSam Senior Member

  14. Yobarnacle
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    Yobarnacle Senior Member holding true course

    So?
     

  15. SamSam
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Coastal Georgia

    SamSam Senior Member

    [​IMG]
     
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