Ocean crossing with motor-yacht

Discussion in 'Powerboats' started by phatzih, Jul 7, 2005.

  1. mackid068
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 857
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: CT, USA

    mackid068 Semi-Newbie Posts Often

    I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I can't stand those bubble looking inverted turtle designs that people call sleek. I would much rather have the nordhavn. I also like this http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...757&slim=quick& My current boat is a 50 ft Burns craft houseboat. Who cares what the people you cruise by think. I much prefer comfort onboard for myself and guests. I suggest you find a boat that is usefull for your needs foremost.

    Woodboat, Ted Brewer agrees, as do I. I think that modern "rocketships" such as the Chaparral are not very beautiful nor fun. I'm much more interested in a proper passagemaker such as a Nordhavn or an American Tug or any sort of traditional trawler. Check out Americantug.com or nordhavn.com I really think that any other boat for Atlantic or, for that matter, any area with poor weather, cold water etc. (North Atlantic or just all areas above the equator that are offshore) over 30' must be a proper trawler or passagemaker. Otherwise, consider a nicely designed expedition yacht (or go custom). But stay away from "rocketships" if you plan on cruising in safety and comfort.
     
  2. mackid068
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 857
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: CT, USA

    mackid068 Semi-Newbie Posts Often

    Also, check out protector boats (www.protectorboats.com). Their boats are both comfortable and safe. Oh, and try Nautica RIBs (nauticaintl.com I think). Both companies offer boats up to 40 or so feet. Rigid hull inflatables are good for passagemaking, I would think, due to their great stability and safety.
     
  3. woodboat
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 312
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 14
    Location: Baltimore MD, USA

    woodboat Senior Member

    My current houseboat is a good fit for my family. It is extremely heavily built compared to other cruising houseboats. It's weight makes it a bit slower though. I stay within the Chesapeake bay. My wife and five children, ages 4 - 15, took a one week vacation marina hopping down the Bay. We also took about 25 people out on July 2nd to watch fireworks. The boat has plenty of room for 25 people. With that said once the children are grown I want a boat like the Marine trader I posted. I want to travel between Baltimore MD and Florida and just explore. I truly do not see why people think they are attractive boats, those "rocket ships" as you call them. My wife hates them too. She loves sitting in a full size chair on the front deck of our boat as we motor along. Those round bubbly fronts are useless. You can't walk on them. You can't lay on them. You can't sit a chair on them. The round shape intrudes on the cabin forcing odd shaped interiors. No sir I don't like them, not one bit.
     
  4. phatzih
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: UK

    phatzih Junior Member

    Thank u all,
    Kelly the link was quite interesting...Mackid I think is a matter of culture but I would never consider inflatable or ugly fishing boats....imagine reaching the coast of Ibiza or a Greek island with such a boat…the sun is shining, the beach is full of topless beauties and next to your boat are all the luxury super-yachts... people will take the piss out of you ...plus your boat will never help you to get some girls (which is an important issue, lets be honest)...In fact people will staring at your boat waiting for a dirty, smelly fisherman with a pipe in his mouth to come out of it...I know those boats are safe but I would rather walk through the beach with a pink bikini than come out of thing like this....If I was a millionaire I would definitely buy a Lazzara (http://www.lazzarayachts.com) but for my money a Chaparral is perfect. You can go for vacations with your mates without feeling embarrassed about your boat…Probably for people who cruise lakes those issues are not important but I am more like a fun of crowded beaches….To be honest I find it funny that there are people buying boats like Nordhavn…..if I meet such a boat at Ibiza I will definitely take the piss out of the owner too…. :p
    thank you for your replies..
     
  5. mackid068
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 857
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: CT, USA

    mackid068 Semi-Newbie Posts Often

    Anyone who has a Nordhavn is clearly wealthy. They are very expensive, fancy (without looking like a genital extention) and are safe along with the fact that they'll never go out of style unlike rocketships. Bah! Humbug. I'm as cultured as most Europeans, but I feel that Italian-sportscars will never eclipse a safe BMW or a plus Mercedes, no matter HOW ugly they are. A sportscar will win a race, but the driver won't survive that crash on the highway (or a sideswipe by one of those crazy Parisian drivers).
     
  6. phatzih
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: UK

    phatzih Junior Member

    BMW is also producing roadsters….but only a Ferrari can be a Ferrari….I don’t think a car or a boat should be genital extension but I believe it is really important to be at least good looking (in an artistic way)…. Nordhavn boats are looking like small ships…I really find it so funny using the word “fancy” to characterize a Nordhavn …and yes, if somebody owns one this means that he is really wealthy….but it also means something about his sense of beauty…..I might think like this because I am still quite young and by the time I get 40 start thinking that sitting in a full size chair on the front deck of our boat is the important issue….But for the time being I would take the piss out of anyone who will spend a small fortune on a boat like Nordhavn… except if he plans shipping potatoes from Turkey….
    Anyway it was interesting that the matter took this rather cultural dimension…
     
  7. woodboat
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 312
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 14
    Location: Baltimore MD, USA

    woodboat Senior Member

    What does "take the piss out" mean :eek: If you let women define your sense of stlye then you sir are no man. I bet you even go to a hair stylist :) If you buy a boat because you think somehow that bubble shaped turtle you call sleek will attract women then you truly are clueless. We have a local spot, fells point, with 85 bars within walking distance. I had a old 1965 wooden cruiser and my friend a house boat. We never had a problem with parties or women. The boats were routinely packed beyond capacity. I can tell you truly that often only the captain would due for the ladies joining the party :) Somday you might actually figure out what women really want. If I owned a Nordhavn do you think for one second I would care what a chaparral owner thought? Do you think the Lazzara is pretty? I think it is butt ugly.
     
  8. KCook
    Joined: Jan 2003
    Posts: 171
    Likes: 2, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 13
    Location: Arizona

    KCook Senior Member

    Well I would want to have my cake and eat it too. So my Nordhavn would sport a Windy 761 to run fetch the bikinis for me :cool:

    Kelly
     
  9. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 471, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Those boats you desire aren't boats. They are styling exercises that will look just like the out date furniture in your den in a few years. Nothing looks worse then something that "use to be" modern styling. Remember those molded, form fitting chairs that were the hot item in the 70's? Would you be caught dead with on in your house now?

    Those same boats have loads of cute little gadgets and gimmick, dreamed up by folks who've never lived aboard, but will try to convince you they know what they're talking about.

    Take a guess why good passagemekers look like little ships. Have you ever lived aboard, while making a long passage? Trust me, you'll want as much ship (even if it's on the little side) under your ***, as you can afford.

    I've lived aboard several different yachts and made many long passages. The classic shapes, configurations and arrangements are such because they work. Those wonderfully useless styling gambles will put the shower stall in the head, to save additional room, so they can advertise berthing for a reinforced platoon. All the while not realizing that when you're using the boat on a passage, you'll wipe your butt with your fingers, because the paper is soaked from the wife taking a shower just before you had to take a dump. These boats are full of mistake after mistake, for passagemakers. Do you think they supply storm shudders for those raked and compound curved windows? Rest assured, a boarding sea will crash right through those ridiculously large, but stylish things. There's a reason they don't put big windows in the back half of an armored car, the same logic applies to ocean going craft.

    All those boats you listed are planning in the photos, have you ever been on plane in open water? I have, and it's about the most foolish thing you can do, unless attempting to break a record. This means at the speeds these craft will be operating, during a passage, they will be driven at much less then the ideal speed, likely displacement or very near so. Driving a boat like this sucks up 2 or 3 times or more fuel, is difficult to steer and frankly stupid. Planning is nice if you're close enough to shore to out run a thunderstorm, but 30 miles out (not in very deep water really) you'll never get to shore before the weather rolls over you. In deep water you'll have to drive to suit the conditions, not the abilities of the boat's top end.

    These boat manufactures are looking for people just like you. Interested in the newest thing, the latest style. They cater to folks who haven't a clue. The ones that do, have developed very distant needs and desires in a cruising vessel, earned over many miles under their keels and will not settle for less. Which is why they cost so much, are desired by the real cruisers and hold there value long after their styling has faded away.

    A quick blast across the channel, coast bouncing down to the Med can be done easily, but don't get caught with your paints down in one, we'll be reading about you in the paper the following day.

    Personally, I want you to buy one of those injection molded pretty harbor sluts. It'll just leave a real boat for a true cruiser to find. Better yet, rent a boat, go for a cruise (several) then buy what your experience tells you makes more sense.
     
  10. mackid068
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 857
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: CT, USA

    mackid068 Semi-Newbie Posts Often

    What section of the paper? The obituaries? A real boat is a nordhavn or the like! It's a real boat. You need such a safe boat for passagamaking, and a Chapparal or any other rocketship is not suited for extended cruising etc.
     
  11. FAST FRED
    Joined: Oct 2002
    Posts: 4,519
    Likes: 109, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1009
    Location: Conn in summers , Ortona FL in winter , with big d

    FAST FRED Senior Member

    "Those boats you desire aren't boats. They are styling exercises that will look just like the out date furniture in your den in a few years."

    I have always considered those buckets "personal jewlery" purchased to be seen with , not actually used.

    Same for Harley Davidsons , to make a "statement" not to actually ride anywhere (except to be seen & unfortunatly heard) .

    But it does keep the economy humming, a fool and his money ......

    FAST FRED
     
  12. phatzih
    Joined: Jul 2005
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: UK

    phatzih Junior Member

    I definitely go to a hair stylist…and all the people I know do the same…the only barber shops left are for Pakis…

    There have been two propositions already…the first is that those ships are good looking (even fancy) … I am sorry but I can only take this as a joke….

    The second proposition was that those ships are comfortable and safe…about comfort I think that when you take your boat on a cruise you should expect that you will not have the comfort of your house…you even desire to get away from it for a week or so….it s part of the sport….about safety now…safety is an important issue and that was the exact reason I posted at first place…according to what you people say stylish boats are not safe at all … in a thunderstorm with a boat like that you are pretty much ****** up…but I think this is also part of the sport…first of all you will never plan a trip when 30 feet waves appear in the horizon…in addition those boats have all the electronic goodies like satellite tracking systems that might save your *** if things go wrong (and your insurance will pay the rest)...but this will be the extreme case in which all weather predictions turn wrong for the 1-2 days that you actually run your boat in deep sea and you meet a thunderstorm coming from Alaska…lets be serious here…what are the chances to be so lucky?...no more than the chances to be at London at the specific point and time where the bombs exploded… I definitely understand that if you want to cross an ocean this means that you will run in deep sea for a week or more so the chances are big…but when cruising the Mediterranean with a 25 mph cruising speed you will never be in deep sea for more than two days….the consumption issue was very interesting although…

    Anyway during the period I am looking for a boat I have find more than 20 manufacturers of “rocket ships” and just a couple of fishing ships…obviously the demand for the first category is multiple…and manufacturers like Bayliner, Chaparral etc are building this kind of ships for ages…people are buying and using those ships for ages too…I understand that a Nordhavn might be safer but I feel you people exaggerate saying that a Chaparral can be in trouble cruising 30 miles away from shore…

    Concluding I would say that it became perfectly clear to me that the kind of boats I am looking will never give me the chance to visit California and Miami….but I can not accept that I will face serious safety issues when cruising the Mediterranean…thus I do not need a big-ugly-aluminum ship (which I could not afford buying new anyway)…I am looking for a boat for having fun and I am trying to figure what the limitations of my £100.000 investments will be…so it was totally clear that I will be limited in Mediterranean cruising….even this range of the Harley-boat worth the money…
     
  13. woodboat
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 312
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 14
    Location: Baltimore MD, USA

    woodboat Senior Member

    So you are a girly man? I honestly think those things are ugly. I truely believe like Par that in twenty years they will be like shag carpet or that high heeled shoe chair we all see at yard sales. Be aware that those ugly turtles you think are stylish will lose tremendous value when the style changes unlike a boat that is usefull. I certainly don't think you need to buy a fishing boat either but a more tradition styled cruiser. You obviously are very young so by the time you can actually afford the boat who knows what style will be popular.
     
  14. KCook
    Joined: Jan 2003
    Posts: 171
    Likes: 2, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 13
    Location: Arizona

    KCook Senior Member

    The appeal of the Nordhavn is not so much "fancy" as "well built". Fit, finish, and workmanship far surpass Chap and the other production boats. Bayliner, Chap, etc. sell in far greater numbers because they are much lower in price, at least here in the U.S. market. If we could buy a Nordhavn for the same price as a Chap it would be no contest, and we would all have Nordhavns.

    "Style" is getting knocked around a lot here. There are "stylish" (streamlined) boats that are safe enough for most of us. But they aren't built by Bayliner, Chap, etc. The real issue is how they are built more than how they look.

    It's common to see the production boats running 30mi offshore here in the warmer areas. Wind and waves permitting. I don't know the Med well at all. But my guess is that the practicality of these boats for the Med would be mostly a seasonal matter.

    Really very different boats for very different markets.

    Kelly
     

  15. mackid068
    Joined: Feb 2005
    Posts: 857
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: CT, USA

    mackid068 Semi-Newbie Posts Often

    Wait, hold on? Who is wood talking to?

    Kelly, you're right, I guess. Still, a WELL BUILT passagemaker is much safer and better overall. If not a nordhavn, get a well built european trawler style vessel. Build quality is an issue, so don't get a Bayliner. Production boats 30 miles offshore, sure, but well built, and mostly big ones (30-40'). You don't see Bayliners crossing the atlantic :D
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.